Topic: Team classical recording

[Gutbucket]

video link-
http://www.rodetv.com/iwal/interview-with-a-legend-tony-faulkner/

^^
Another outstanding Tony Faulkner interview which Hynocracy posted elsewhere earlier today.

[Massive Dynamic]

Additionally, there is money to be made.  Students generally are required to record their recitals.  Oftentimes the performance program utilizes tech program students to do the recording, but there's not always enough, or any, recording students to do the actual work.  Additionally, it's typically required that the students pay for the recording work.  Soooo, opportunity.

Hang a flyer advertizing your skillz at the local college/univ that has music performance program.  I've done a bunch of opera recital recording (typically running blumlein on stage/lip at about 6'^).  I charge a $100 flat rate for record, post production, track and transfer, and provide a wav and flac disc to the student.  Generally rave reviews, of the likes of "awesome, and certainly better than the student recordist who f'd up my spring recital from last year, and $50 less, to boot!!!"  And once you get one good student, they're good at recommending you to others.  Last spring I had to turn some folks away because I'd already be booked on a particular night. 

Heard some amazing and inspiring work doing this.  Also suffered through some sheer horror.  Preponderance has been very good, though, and the money's been a nice little gear purchase funding source!!  I'd have been happy to do it for free, actually, but the students made it clear that, at least at the two programs for which I've worked in Minneapolis, they're required to pay.

Another benefit is you can cozy up to the accompanists who can (a) refer you to other students, (b) turn you on to other events of interest, and (c) blow your mind at how good they are.

My days of rock recording are getting fewer and further between. There is a state university with a well-respected music department blocks from my house, and I am wondering about approaching someone at the university. Before doing so, I am wondering if my gear is going to be sufficient. Most contributors to this thread are using 4 channels - I have two recorders, but don't really want to spend my evenings doing post, my least favorite thing. That may also be a reason not to even contemplate this endeavor. Can acceptable results be had with a nice pair of cardioids and a 2-channel recorder? Should I keep my LSD2 instead of selling?

[Gutbucket]

Sure, a simple stereo pair of cards in ORTF can be just the ticket.  If you want to keep the LSD2 you'll be far more likely to find good situations to be able to run it in Blumlein than most rock situations.  Simple two channel 'purist' techniques have a better chance of working really well in decent rooms designed for or at least somewhat adapted to making music without PA reinforcement.

Seems to me colleges/universities generally fall in two categories: they either have mediocre gear and no one to really run it competently or serious endowment mics and a recording engineering program.  It's probably easier to get in with the first since the second will be more serious about having recording engineering students recording the music program students.  There are more of the first type anyway.  Dean will be more likely to have better insight to this than I if he's around to reply.

[Massive Dynamic]

Thanks, Lee. The university is state-funded, but there are many generous alumni. Guess I'll just have to inquire.

[dean]

I'd hang onto that LSD2 and run it blumlein on stage about 6'^.  Talk to the students if you can.  I think they're more receptive to what you're selling than the faculty would be, and they're the ones paying.  However, it's a public school, so I think you can hang a flyer or something with no issues.

Good luck!

[ScoobieKW]

First time recording a classical choral piece. First session will be rehearsal with performance in a few weeks.

Have cardioid, sub, super, and omni capsules for my Avantone CK-1 (Busman mod) mics.

Thinking card/stereophonic zoom at 7' front row of audience. basically trusting the conductor to mix.

Feedback?

[Gutbucket]

Seems appropriate.
Good sounding room?

Irrespective of pattern, which of those capsules has the sweetest sound to your ears?  If the room is good I'd go with whatever that is in the appropriate Zoom config.  I'd probably lean toward the subcardioids, which should work well from there if the room is nice.  I think choral pieces typically benefit from the wide, lush sound of spaced configs verses sharper imaging of closer spaced configs which rely more on mic directivity.  Spaced omnis on the edge of the stage could work really well for this too, and they don't necessarily need to be up high.  Position of the group forward or back on the stage can make a significant difference in the direct/reverb ratio at the front row.  A lot depends on the quality and quantity of the room reverberence, how quickly the direct sound drops off into that with distance from the group, and of course the audience's behavior!  One big difference with recording acoustic material in nice halls as opposed to amplified music in bars and clubs is that the room sound is more likely to be a big asset to the recording, rather than just a problem to work around.  Getting best direct/room balance is the primary key to nailing it.

The conductor is the live-mix soundguy!

[ScoobieKW]

Seems appropriate.
Good sounding room?

Irrespective of pattern, which of those capsules has the sweetest sound to your ears?  If the room is good I'd go with whatever that is in the appropriate Zoom config.  I'd probably lean toward the subcardioids, which should work well from there if the room is nice.  I think choral pieces typically benefit from the wide, lush sound of spaced configs verses sharper imaging of closer spaced configs which rely more on mic directivity.  Spaced omnis on the edge of the stage could work really well for this too, and they don't necessarily need to be up high.  Position of the group forward or back on the stage can make a significant difference in the direct/reverb ratio at the front row.  A lot depends on the quality and quantity of the room reverberence, how quickly the direct sound drops off into that with distance from the group, and of course the audience's behavior!  One big difference with recording acoustic material in nice halls as opposed to amplified music in bars and clubs is that the room sound is more likely to be a big asset to the recording, rather than just a problem to work around.  Getting best direct/room balance is the primary key to nailing it.

The conductor is the live-mix soundguy!

No idea on the sound of the room, rehearsal is in a room at a church, performance space TBD.

[Gutbucket]

My post above comes from the perspective of a performance hall or chuch space accoustic.  As you'd suspect, cardioids may be a better choice in a smaller, less than great room.. depending.

[Gutbucket]

Hope springs eternal.

I was pleased to find positive potential for improved quality of future concert goers recently- at a couple free admission pre-season concerts, two groups of young children in the front row were quieter, more attentive and better behaved than their mothers and most of the adults and seniors seated behind and around them.  The obviously well informed kids even refrained from clapping between movements, and looked to their mothers with unapproving expressions when others in the audience did not, perhaps hoping the moms would scold the inattentiveness of the less mindful adults!

[DigiGal]

Hope springs eternal.

I was pleased to find positive potential for improved quality of future concert goers recently- at a couple free admission pre-season concerts, two groups of young children in the front row were quieter, more attentive and better behaved than their mothers and most of the adults and seniors seated behind and around them.  The obviously well informed kids even refrained from clapping between movements, and looked to their mothers with unapproving expressions when others in the audience did not, perhaps hoping the moms would scold the inattentiveness of the less mindful adults!

 

[ilduclo]

For classical in a good hall, I don't think good omnis can be beat.

[DSatz]

When I started out recording, omni and cardioid were pretty much the main choices (e.g. AKG C 451--do you want a CK 1 or a CK 2 with that? Neumann fet 80 series--do you want the KM 83 or the KM 84?). It was as if they were a Platonic dichotomy that defined the whole universe. I only learned that first-order patterns are actually a continuum or spectrum a while later. But I would still have to agree with "ilduclo" (above) that for beauty, spaciousness and just plain listening pleasure, omni was the pattern of choice as long as it wasn't "too much of a good thing."

I've also had my flings with supercardioid and figure-8 microphones--actually, supercardioids and I had a long, serious relationship.

In the past decade or so, after years of thinking that this wasn't an alternative worth taking seriously, I've acquired good single-diaphragm capsules with patterns between omni and cardioid. They are predominantly pressure transducers, with just some controlled amount of pressure gradient sensitivity mixed in. So they still have (to a corresponding degree) most of the roundness, smoothness and bass extension of good omnis, but they also let me put both capsules on a single mounting bar on a single, central stand or hanging fixture and get a stable (if not overly detailed) stereo image.

Often in life when you try to fulfill two opposing sets of criteria, you end up with disappointment all around. To my surprise this has not been this case with these capsules. The first time I used wide cardioids, the situation must have been exactly right because I got one of my best recordings in decades (a small ensemble at one end of a huge private library). I don't usually love my own recordings, and I am constantly asking myself why I do this at all, I am so frustrated. But in this instance the beauty and the clarity--both together and not fighting one another--was exactly what I want from a recording.

There are still times now when I record with omnis--mostly small ensembles in relatively dry but still well-balanced halls, where I can get the main pair in fairly close to the musicians. But I find that these in-between capsule types have become my "go-to" capsules, and I'm having more fun recording now than I was having for a number of years.

--best regards

[kindms]

Last week I was out working the all natural lump charcoal on the grill (ribeyes over wood yum)

anyway I bring the food up to the living room and the other half has a shit eating grin on her face. I take a look at the tv and realize why

Just happened on Opening night at lincoln center being broadcast live on PBS channel 13. I immediately wondered if any of you guys were recording

Was a great treat. Itzahk Perlman did several pieces (he makes it look soo friggin easy) and they finished with the Pines Of Rome.

I wish they would have more stuff like this on TV etc.

[ScoobieKW]

So the rehearsal recording is done. The composer, Richard Peaslee, is very happy with my result, I ended up using subcardioid capsules AB. The hall was live with loud folding chairs, and the subs worked well. Will post a sample when/if I get permission.