Topic: Best 'all in one' recorder (no external mics)?

[gambra]

Ok, I'm getting tired of having to set up my current set up at gigs mostly because the kind of gigs I go to are very taper unfriendly and so setting up a stand is greeted with stares and the odd kicking out by security (even though it was a taper friendly band). I guess people here don't get the whole taping w/ mics thing.

Anyway, I'm looking into getting one of the what I would call 'all in one' units that don't have any external mics that can just record using the internal microphones. I know i'll take a hit on the sound quality but I don't mind. The options I have so far are the Zoom H series or a Church Audio modded R-09. Any other models? The H4 is looking nice and cheap but is the modded r-09 worth it? Any other models I could look out for? Tips and advice would be greatly appreciated.

[stantheman1976]

With your rig you could always go stealth.  The Zoom H2 is good for voice and acoustic or string instruments but not well suited for extremely loud sources.  The H4 might be better.  I'd say the modded R-09 would probably serve well.  With Chris's mics in there you'd be able to handle some high SPL situations and still get clear recordings.

[Belexes]

Think about the Sony D-50. I have both it and the R-09.  Very sensitive mics on the D-50, but in the retail section a board member makes a spiffy windscreen.  I don't care for the internals on the R-09, but haven't done the Church mod as I mainly use external mics.

If bands you record are taper friendly friendly, but you are having venue issues, always good to get your clearance from the band as sometimes the band's authority can sway a venue's decision.  I usually end up getting free beer to boot because they think I am with the band/crew!

[wklitz]

For what you are looking for, I would vote for the Church mod R-09, proably the best you'll do soundwise for an "all in one"

[sunjan]

Ok, I'm getting tired of having to set up my current set up at gigs mostly because the kind of gigs I go to are very taper unfriendly and so setting up a stand is greeted with stares and the odd kicking out by security (even though it was a taper friendly band). I guess people here don't get the whole taping w/ mics thing.

Anyway, I'm looking into getting one of the what I would call 'all in one' units that don't have any external mics that can just record using the internal microphones. I know i'll take a hit on the sound quality but I don't mind. The options I have so far are the Zoom H series or a Church Audio modded R-09. Any other models? The H4 is looking nice and cheap but is the modded r-09 worth it? Any other models I could look out for? Tips and advice would be greatly appreciated.

Rig: Church Audio STC-11-> Church Audio ST9100-> iRiver H120

What Stan said.

I have to admit I don't get it. You're running one of the most convenient stealth rigs on the market, but use a stand?
You have problems with staring and security, but want to switch to an all-in-one that you must hold in your hand the entire show, visible for anyone around?

The STC-11 can easily be hat mounted (keyword Kangol).
Hat mounted mics, properly done, are always more stealth than any hand-held ever will be.

If you don't like to mount your gear in public, get to the venue 10 minutes earlier and go to the bathroom. It's that simple...

If you want less people to notice what you're doing, and have money to spend: go for a pair of DPA 4061, rather than spending money on a hand-held that will still get you busted at the first look.

/J

[Keyser Soze]

Here's a link to the modded R-09 thread if you want to read up on it: http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,98290.0.html

[gambra]

I know it sounds odd that I'd rather hold something but I think people would actually take less notice of me holding something than having mics up in the air/taped to a wall or clipped onto me.. The modded R-09 sounds like the best option for me though

[sunjan]

I'd rather hold something but I think people would actually take less notice of me holding something than having mics up in the air/taped to a wall or clipped onto me.

Stealth, my brother, stealth! I never said that you should clip the mics on you.
I digress... make a search in the Rig Pictures for "Kangol" or "hat mount".

[morst]

This chart doesn't say anything about audio quality, but has some good general comparisons of some of the options.

http://www.wingfieldaudio.com/compare-portable-recorders.html

I'm pretty happy with the H2 in general, and I find it's internal mics to be adequate for rock and roll.

[bobt]

Go to the minidisc forum and see what people use there, an RH1 with mics mounted on glasses works great, and is not noticeable,
Bob

[jadg2]

I know it sounds odd that I'd rather hold something but I think people would actually take less notice of me holding something than having mics up in the air/taped to a wall or clipped onto me.. The modded R-09 sounds like the best option for me though

You have a stealth rig.  It would be more inconvenient, plus really hard to get a good recording with a recorder with built-in mics.  What are you going to do?  Stand and wave it like a mobile phone all evening?  It's going to be hard to get it mounted at any height, even with a shirt pocket.

So.

Take a pair of clips, clip your current microphones onto a shirt lapel, or jacket collar, and wear a black t-shirt.  If you're having problems with security / not comfortable, wear a shirt and hide all the mic cables etc inside that, and just have the mics poking on your collar or whatever.  Given your location, I find it hard to believe you're having a hard time stealthing.  Most of the security in your location, and in Europe in general don't give a crap or really know about recording.  They're looking out for rowdy, drunk folk in the crowd, or folks doing drugs.  Simple as.   

[madman]

I second the suggestions of clipping the mics on.  I used to stealth with AT853s and I still use 4061s, though they are obviously extremely easy to hide.  Run the mics inside your shirt and out the collar, or use one of the hat/glasses methods.  Your recordings will turn out many times better than using built-in mics.  Venues are so dark that security won't be able to see the tiny mics clipped on.  I've stealthed 5' away from security without issues, and that includes checking my levels on my MD.

[Church-Audio]

I know it sounds odd that I'd rather hold something but I think people would actually take less notice of me holding something than having mics up in the air/taped to a wall or clipped onto me.. The modded R-09 sounds like the best option for me though

If you can hide mics get my 2.4k mod CA-11 mics they will plug directly into the R09 with out any battery box or preamp into the mic input. The signal to noise will not be as good as if you did use an external preamp but if your taping really loud shows you should be ok. If you dont want external mics at all then my mod is your only option to improve the sound quality of the r-09 you can also run my omni capsules with that recorder. As my cardioid capsules unscrew from the r-09 after the mod is done. So you can change them out for omni.

Chris