Topic: 788T

[marvin100]

There's nothing about it on the SD user message boards

Really? Where are you looking??

Here is one on the forum about possibly using it for a BBQ at the end of the day

Another one here in the same forum about possibly using the SSD to try and get around the heat problem

These two links go to the same post.

The thread ends with SD founder Jon Tatooles stating definitively "We haven't seen a unit fail specifically because of it getting too hot." Nobody disagrees, and the thread ends with the original complaint going to tech support, with the line "When an error occurs, it will occur when the recorder is powered on and therefor the recorder will be warm when the error occurs. This fact alone isn't enough to verify that the error was caused by the recorder's temperature."

The OP never wrote back to reaffirm that it was temperature that caused his problems, so I suspect it wasn't (although of course I don't know for sure).

Also in the same thread are a number of people saying they use their recorders in 40C+ temperatures for long periods of time without issue.

And yet another in the forum on the SD site about heat problems

Looks to me like the OP's problem had nothing to do with heat:

"Currently there is no indication that the battery is charging while the unit is on.

That will be changed in an upcoming firmware update."

but there was still some heat-related news in that thread:

"I´ve learned from my dealer today that units beyond (newer) serial HP0508246004 have a new mic-pre board installed that radiates less heat. They told me since this revision they haven´t had any heat-related issues with their rental machines. The 788T still gets very hot but they claim it´s not a problem to use bags without ventilation." (March, 2005)

And

"788T recorders manufactured before September 8, 2008 are eligible for a no-charge hardware update." (May, 2009)

Here is an article in the Sound Device support section about the heat problems

This just explains that the body of the unit is its heat sink and is therefore designed to get hot. The heat is radiated from the internals (esp. the mic pres) by direct thermal bonding to the aluminum cover plates. Aluminum, as anyone who's cooked or grilled with foil should know, radiates heat extremely efficiently and cools very, very fast. There is no mention of a problem or loss of functionality or failure.

So what I've found is that the units get hot, and that freaks some people out, but that the company doesn't consider it a problem and has heard of no failures as a result of heat, but that it upgraded the hardware and will bring older units up to date for free anyway.

So the above links include exactly one report of decreased functionality due to heat, which ended somewhat inconclusively but with the distinct likelihood that the problem may not have been heat related, and the user never posted an update. Among the thousands of units being operated every day in bags and all sorts of extreme and demanding locations (Antarctica? Check. Gold mines of South Africa? Check. Mt. Everest? Check. Hardcore punk clubs in Seoul and Tokyo? Check. The White House? Check. My bathroom? Check.), that is a pretty impressive track record.

Meanwhile, Nagra doesn't seem to have a user forum, so there doesn't appear to be any way to identify if its users have had any problems with their machines. AFAIK, of course--correct me if I'm wrong.

I guess SD's probably foolish to make that kind of thing public. Or confident.

So, yeah. That's all I found. It seems most of the "problems" are from people alarmed at the way the machine cools itself, a side effect of which is that its body gets hot. So I guess it's a genuine "problem" for those among us who really can't stand being near hot things, but as the delicious cup of coffee next to my mouse hand suggests, I'm not one of those people.




Of course, if I'm missing anything important, please let me know. That's always possible at my age.

[su6oxone]

Not a 788T, but I've noticed in the past that when I was running my 702 outdoors in the summer when it was sunny and hot at a festival and the unit was running continuously for hours (5+) in a closed bag that does get really hot but also it started to emit a 'whining' type of high frequency humming sound.  After turning it off and letting it cool down it goes away.  It didn't seem to affect the tape, and only happened in that all day running in the sun in a closed bag scenario. 

I asked on the SD forum what that might be and should I be concerned but they didn't seem to have any idea so I dropped it and it hasn't come back yet (but I leave the bag open when running for extended periods in hot, sunny weather now).

[JackHenry]

These two links go to the same post.

Oops, fixed..... It's fixed in my original post. It should have gone here

[marvin100]

The mic. pres and the digital converters are a little better in the Nagra

Is the mic pre/converter evaluation a consensus? The only person I see consistently and clearly stating this on the net is you--is this just your opinion or have there been studies or comparisons done? I'm genuinely interested.

It's not only me saying this - but we are *not* saying that one is good and the other is bad, just that both are excellent but one has the edge over the other in this respect.

Oh of course, completely understood. I certainly wouldn't imply you were belittling the SD. As I've searched around, though (which I've done quite a bit over the last couple months), I've seen a few scattered NVI owners saying this (usually with doubt and "personal preference" qualifications, and virtually always in Nagra threads), but you're the only one saying it consistently and frequently (and in SD threads).

So am I right in assuming you speak only from your own experience? Or is there some data/research/shootout/consensus I'm unaware of? Again, genuinely curious and cautiously skeptical of your statement, since you're on the record as being a bit of a Nagra partisan and your statement was made with no evidence beyond your own preference but a tone of certainly that suggests something more.

If it's simply preference, of course, it is absolutely beyond the realm of debate, as it would be with microphones, pre-amps, guitarists, women, or whisky, a glass of which (Ardbeg Uigeadail is my preference tonight) I'll gladly raise to both these fine machines in a matter of minutes.

Still wondering about this, John.

I know I'm not the only one curious if your authoritative-sounding pronouncement rests on anything other than your own personal taste. Surely you have the time to respond--I see you've been answering plenty of questions and dishing no shortage of advice online.

(Interestingly enough, it was another thread from which you unceremoniously disappeared--only after another user pressed you to more openly disclose your affiliation, I might add--that alerted me to your employment at Sennheiser/Neumann, a bit of information that has given me at least a sliver of a reason to think you might have access to actual test data or anything other than your own preference for the machine you own).

[John Willett]

Still wondering about this, John.

Answered by PM