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Gear / Technical Help => Ask The Tapers => Topic started by: wwaag76 on April 18, 2008, 08:32:06 PM
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I'm planning to have 4 people sit around and watch some old photos taken 30 years ago. I would like to record the resulting conversation and eventually put together a video based on the photos and recorded comments. My question--what is the best way to do the recording and what equipment would I need? I'm sorry about asking such a basic question, but I really do need some help on how to proceed. Thanks in advance.
wwaag
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wwaag, the two most basic suggestions would be:
(a) Record in stereo, not mono. You probably don't want to put a separate microphone on (or pointing at) each of the four people, so it's virtually guaranteed that you'll pick up a lot of room sound and incidental noises. A good stereo recording lets the listener's brain filter out the annoyances and ambiguities.
(b) If you're using a recorder with a built-in motor (e.g. a cassette recorder), use an external stereo microphone or pair of external microphones--not a built-in microphone or microphones. Put the microphone(s) in a place where it's/they're as close to everyone (on average) as possible, without being too close to any one person. Aim it/them appropriately, too.
Then my next suggestion would be:
(c) Once you've pretty much decided on what equipment to use, put everything together the way you intend to for the recording, make a brief test recording and listen to the result. Do this at least a day before the intended recording so that if you realize something is missing, you have time to go get it.
--best regards
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dsatz
Thanks for the reply. My initial idea was to put a lavalier mic on each person and feed these into 2 stereo recorders, so I would have a separate channel for each participant. I could then do the appropriate mixing during the production of the video. Would this work? I already have 2 lavalier mics running through an HDV camcorder that permits control of recording level. I would mix this audio with the video (what people are seeing ) and record onto a laptop. I would only need a couple more mics and additional recorder (zoom h2?). Such an approach would also allow me to take this "on the road". Comments?? Again, thanks.
wwaag
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(zoom h2?)
The Zoom H2 allows for 4-channel surround recording. I have used it to record speech, by setting the limiter to speech mode (AGC2). I was happy with the results. (I gave a presentation to a room full of people, and pointed the 90-degree mics at myself, and the 120 degree side at the crowd) I don't remember how I set the gain, but I think it was the Medium setting.
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wwaag, I didn't realize how much time you seem to be willing to put into this--my initial advice was aimed at a more casual approach that could still be effective.
Syncing up two separate recordings "after the fact" isn't entirely trivial. Were you intending to do this in editing software of some kind? With two recorders, each time you stop and start, you'll have to resync.
Also, while both recorders may be set for 44.1 kHz, the clock signals are still independent of one another by default, and one recorder's opinion of 44.1 kHz might be just a few Hz different from the other's; over many minutes this can mean that the two sound files will begin to diverge along the time axis. The only times I've ever used separate recorders to cover separate tracks, I connected the A/D converters so that one's clock was driven by the clock output of the other one. That way the "only" problem is to line up the start of the tracks when mixing down. Not all converters have these provisions so I made sure to choose a pair that did (Grace Lunatec V3 for the main channels and Lucid AD9624 for the extra pair, with word clock carried via BNC cable from the Grace to the Lucid).
--best regards
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dsatz
First, this is strictly for family, so while I want it to be good, it doesn't have to be perfect.
For post-processing, I'll be using Vegas Pro8 which allows mixing of multiple audio tracks and Sound Forge 9 for processing (compression, noise reduction, etc.) of the individual tracks. Syncing doesn't have to be perfect, since the recordings will primarily be voiceovers. In any case, my idea is this. The initial slideshow will be on DVD for display on TV. At the beginning, there will be a reference tone (any suggestions?) which will be recorded onto all 4 tracks--this will be the only audio from the DVD. I'll then use these signals to sync the beginning of the 4 audio tracks. I could also generate additional reference tones between segments of the slideshow, in the event there is some "drift" between the 2 recorders. Both will be recorded at 48kHz.
Incidentally, I just ordered the Zoom h2 recorder.
Again, any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks.
wwaag
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At the beginning, there will be a reference tone (any suggestions?) which will be recorded onto all 4 tracks--this will be the only audio from the DVD.
Can you get a slate and click it so there will be a nice sharp peak to synchronize all sources? That would make things easier.
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dsatz
First, this is strictly for family, so while I want it to be good, it doesn't have to be perfect.
For post-processing, I'll be using Vegas Pro8 which allows mixing of multiple audio tracks and Sound Forge 9 for processing (compression, noise reduction, etc.) of the individual tracks. Syncing doesn't have to be perfect, since the recordings will primarily be voiceovers. In any case, my idea is this. The initial slideshow will be on DVD for display on TV. At the beginning, there will be a reference tone (any suggestions?) which will be recorded onto all 4 tracks--this will be the only audio from the DVD. I'll then use these signals to sync the beginning of the 4 audio tracks. I could also generate additional reference tones between segments of the slideshow, in the event there is some "drift" between the 2 recorders. Both will be recorded at 48kHz.
Incidentally, I just ordered the Zoom h2 recorder.
Again, any suggestions are appreciated. Thanks.
wwaag
It will be easier than you might be thinking. Sit them at a table and set up the Zoom in the middle on 4 channel mode to get a 360 degree recording. The Zoom is great for this type of application. You will easily pick up all 4 people and the separate tracks will already be synced since they're coming from the same device. You can bring the tracks into Vegas and manipulate the stereo image however you please and, assuming you have the photos in digital format, drop them into a video track in the Vegas timeline and stretch or shorten the length to match up with the audio. I don't know what your level of experience is with Vegas but once you know the program something like this project is a breeze.
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Can you get a slate and click it so there will be a nice sharp peak to synchronize all sources? That would make things easier.
Since I don't have a slate, any idea where I can download a wav file?
It will be easier than you might be thinking. Sit them at a table and set up the Zoom in the middle on 4 channel mode to get a 360 degree recording. The Zoom is great for this type of application. You will easily pick up all 4 people and the separate tracks will already be synced since they're coming from the same device. You can bring the tracks into Vegas and manipulate the stereo image however you please and, assuming you have the photos in digital format, drop them into a video track in the Vegas timeline and stretch or shorten the length to match up with the audio. I don't know what your level of experience is with Vegas but once you know the program something like this project is a breeze.
Only problem with the table idea, is that the participants will be watching a TV screen. In any case, I'll try it.
Thanks for the replies.
wwaag
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1 mic and 1 channel per participant is great. Using a video camera or something to match audio to visual is great, too.
Having 1 channel per participant has its obvious advantages, but you'll want to monitor as much as you can while recording. I've done things like this before where someone had a necklace or something banging against the mic all night and I didn't notice it until after the fact.
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A simple stereo config picking up everyone could work well and give a sense of the space. Attached below is a short MP3 segment from a family Monopoly game, mics on either side of half a foam ball (http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,70134.msg940001.html#msg940001) sitting in the center of the board.
(http://taperssection.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=70134.0;attach=50225;image)