Taperssection.com
Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: kfrinkle on October 20, 2009, 10:36:32 AM
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Ok, so taped a show last night, MT was charged, had it charging while taping... Got to the encore, I almost started a new track, decided against it since the set was so short. I stopped looking at the MT about 5 minutes before the end of the encore, and when I went to stop the recording AFTER the set was finally over, the MT was already off. I was very confused, but figured shit, even if it shut down, it should have saved first. I got home last night, saw the 0kb file problem. I read up on it at these two links:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=53521.0
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=55626.0
And I was able to do the chkdsk /f and the wav file came back! There is also a tmpXXX file that has almost 300 mb in it (the wav file that was recovered is approx 1.2 gb) So after that I tried doing the 'fix the header' routine that has been suggested, first with AudioHack, and I got the "input file has no data chunk!" error. I also tried the CEP route... Both to no avail (got the white noise wav form). Would anyone be willing to take a crack at this? I am super duper freaking out about this. I have unlimited space on my server on campus, could upload files for someone to checkout.
I am also open to more suggestions. This is a very very very very very (did I say very) important recording to me, and I am gonna cry if I cannot save most of it...
Also, what is up with the temp file being 300mb? That really sucks....
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There is always a temp file created when you use the MT. It is part of how it operates. I am guessing it has operational information that is created when the card is formatted. As for your file, I'm guessing that you did not have the lock on when you went to almost start a new file. Probably hit something which cause the file to not shut down correctly. I have had the MT recorder for a few years now, and as long as I lock and unlock before and after any button presses I have never lost a file. In my first days with the unit if I left the unit unlocked I lost an occasional file, so I am well trained to not do so.
I really hate to say this, and certainly you should not go by this, but whether the file is really inportant or not, it likely is lost. I have not seen anyone bring the file back from this type of problem. I hope I am wrong, sorry!
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There is always a temp file created when you use the MT. It is part of how it operates. I am guessing it has operational information that is created when the card is formatted. As for your file, I'm guessing that you did not have the lock on when you went to almost start a new file. Probably hit something which cause the file to not shut down correctly. I have had the MT recorder for a few years now, and as long as I lock and unlock before and after any button presses I have never lost a file. In my first days with the unit if I left the unit unlocked I lost an occasional file, so I am well trained to not do so.
I really hate to say this, and certainly you should not go by this, but whether the file is really inportant or not, it likely is lost. I have not seen anyone bring the file back from this type of problem. I hope I am wrong, sorry!
I always have the hold on.... I think the problem is that the MT lost power at some point during the encore, and shut down. I do have a wav file that is almost 1.2 gb long on there... there has to be some way to recover that data... I have uploaded it to my server if anyone wants to take a crack at it...
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Try opening the file in CDWave, and report back...
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Try opening the file in CDWave, and report back...
Tried that, sorry should have posted the message... It did ask me if I wanted to adjust the header size... I tried yes, I tried no, either way I got the "no fmt descriptor" message. :(
This is seriously seriously bumming me out... Worst part is, that a friend came and taped as well, and both of his recordings have issues.... Can you believe that?
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Ahh sorry, didn't know you had tried it :), I don't think I can be of any further help then...
The only times I've had success fixing header problems was with cdwave, hopefully someone else can chime in with better advice or an offer to look at the file for you, good luck though.
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Thanks... this is seriously stressing me out... Even the baby jesus is crying over this one.
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As I stated before, I can give anyone a link, I have it uploaded to my server if someone wants to take a crack at it, let me know and I will pm the link...
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I also tried the CEP route... Both to no avail (got the white noise wav form).
I've seen this before, too. In Audition/CEP, when I Open As | PCM Raw, the s/w prompts me for information. My old version of CEP (1.5) prompts me three times:
<1> Open File As. Are you positive you selected the proper Sample Rate, Channels, Resolution (32bfp if you recorded 24-bit)?
<2> Interpret Sample Format As. Are you positive you selected the proper Sample Rate, Channels, Resolution (32bfp if you recorded 24-bit)?
<3> PCM Raw Data (no header). This one was the key for me. Are you positive you selected the proper Data Formatted As value (24-bit packed Intel PCM if you recorded 24-bit)? And did you try each of the different offset options (0, +1, +2, +3)?
For me, I didn't recover the audio until I selected the correct offset option (no idea which was correct...I just tried each one.)
I know you read the README1st and associated threads, so forgive me if you've already completed all of the above...I wasn't sure based on your OP if you'd tried each offset option (and I doni't think the original thread mentions the offset option).
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Brian,
I did try this, although what is the difference between the intel and motorola 24 bit? which one should i be choosing?
-karl
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I did try this, although what is the difference between the intel and motorola 24 bit? which one should i be choosing?
Okay, wasn't sure if you tried the different offsets or not. Hmmm...not sure of the difference between Intel and Motorola 24-bit. Maybe try both with each of the offset options. If you send me the link, I'll d/l and see if I get anywhere opening with Samplitude SE.
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Oh man..... so I tried Intel and Motorola on each of the settings, I got to intel at +2, and it worked!!!!!
So then I go and try the same thing on the temp file on the drive, and nothing. I end up getting down to intel at 0 and it worked!!!
So I have an almost complete recording now, I totally appreciate all the suggestions/help on this one.. you guys are the best! Now I need to patch in a second source for the last few minute jam....
thanks a bunch!
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Oh man..... so I tried Intel and Motorola on each of the settings, I got to intel at +2, and it worked!!!!!
So then I go and try the same thing on the temp file on the drive, and nothing. I end up getting down to intel at 0 and it worked!!!
So I have an almost complete recording now, I totally appreciate all the suggestions/help on this one.. you guys are the best! Now I need to patch in a second source for the last few minute jam....
thanks a bunch!
This is excellent! I'm happy that the data can be recovered. I am sure you are right about the loss of power being the issue. Very cool news!!
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I am still trying to figure out how it lost power. That is not a good sign in and of itself. Had a battery stick plugged into it, it was charging the whole show I though...
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We'll at least you got the file! The exact same thing happened to me last year or so. It was on the MT I, I still own it, and never happened again. I tried everything up to step three in Brian's post. Don't think it is on my card anymore, but I thought it transfered to HD. I'll have to try that, if I can find file82. Kind of bummed me out too, it was night one of a seven night residency.
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I did try this, although what is the difference between the intel and motorola 24 bit? which one should i be choosing?
Okay, wasn't sure if you tried the different offsets or not. Hmmm...not sure of the difference between Intel and Motorola 24-bit. Maybe try both with each of the offset options. If you send me the link, I'll d/l and see if I get anywhere opening with Samplitude SE.
Intel/Motorola is for the processor type and the thing in question is the endian format. (if on Apple choose Motorola unless it is an Intel chip. For windows choose Intel.)
No idea on what type of cpu the MicroTracker uses but likely the endian format is little endian the same format as Intel. Someone sent me a file a good while ago and I didn't have to convert the file to another format. It loaded into samplitude without any conversion required.
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im having a strange issue here as well..
Microsoft Windows XP [Version 5.1.2600]
(C) Copyright 1985-2001 Microsoft Corp.
C:\Documents and Settings\Chris and Melany>chkdsk h:/f
The type of the file system is FAT32.
Volume Serial Number is 0B13-0B10
Windows is verifying files and folders...
The size of the \file0286.wav entry is not valid.
The size of the \file0287.wav entry is not valid.
\file0287.wav is cross-linked on allocation unit 368512.
Insufficient disk space to copy cross-linked portion.
File being truncated.
The size of the \file0288.wav entry is not valid.
\file0288.wav is cross-linked on allocation unit 501760.
...now chkdsk seems to be hung up or something...cf card drive light is still 'on', but its been running for 20 minutes...
fyi: battery pack crapped out during a dino jr show for the mt
chris
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^^ nevermind..it just took a long time for it to run....now attempting opening in audition....
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I am beginning to wonder if the internal battery on my MT is finally taking a dump after 3 years of use. Totally shitty. That was the issue with my messed up wav file from my recording of Hope Sandoval. I am glad that I recovered it, but still.... I even had an external battery pack attached. No clue what happened or why. It may be time to get a new recorder.
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I am beginning to wonder if the internal battery on my MT is finally taking a dump after 3 years of use. Totally shitty. That was the issue with my messed up wav file from my recording of Hope Sandoval. I am glad that I recovered it, but still.... I even had an external battery pack attached. No clue what happened or why. It may be time to get a new recorder.
EXACTLY what happened to me...+ i just dropped some $$ for an AKG 414 for home recording so the 'extra cash' for a new recorder isnt really in the bank yet... :-\
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I am beginning to wonder if the internal battery on my MT is finally taking a dump after 3 years of use. Totally shitty. That was the issue with my messed up wav file from my recording of Hope Sandoval. I am glad that I recovered it, but still.... I even had an external battery pack attached. No clue what happened or why. It may be time to get a new recorder.
I think the battery has always been the weakspot for the MT, either version. It is really important that the external battery be a good one. I have had great success with three different types, but all were very good, high mah, and always after a show my battery is fully charged and showing the little "plug" icon instead of the "charging" icon. You mentioned a battery stick, and I think that would be insufficient. 4 AA batteries would be good. If I am thinking of the stiick you are referring to, it only has the strength of 2 AA batteries. One of my packs holds 4 AA, the second is a ZAP battery, and I forget the name of my third, but it is the smallest, and usually after a 2-3 hour show is only down 1 LED.
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I have been using this gogreen.ie battery stick. was able to keep the MT going for 12+ hours with that thing, and I think I still should be able to. It was pretty small too, totally awesome little battery stick.
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im having a strange issue here as well..
Another thing you might try after running chkdsk is copy the file and see what you get from that.
Sometimes windows or the console copy might timeout copying a file. In that case you get nothing. Here are a couple of tricks if the file gets hung when copying.
1) try ftp'ing the file to an ftp server. ftp will copy the portion of the file that is accessible. If it can't access the last part of the file you will have a copy of whatever could be ftp'd. Try importing that into Audition (or samplitude)
2) audiohack can be used to copy the file, or whatever portion that can be read.
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^^ thanks for all the tips...i got the files to open in audition, but parts we're just white noise/static while other parts were fine. the oddity of it is that depending on which offset i use, i get different parts of the set intact, while others are static...losing the recording isnt too much of a concern, since we had this gig totally covered, but i want to be ready at the next one....
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i got the files to open in audition, but parts we're just white noise/static while other parts were fine. the oddity of it is that depending on which offset i use, i get different parts of the set intact, while others are static.
You might try copying the good portions from one offest into a new file, then do the same for the other offset(s), and piece it together. Not sure it's worth it, depends on how many sections are intact for each offset.
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Definitely keep trying, I refused to give up on my files. This is a shitty thing to happen, and I am seriously thinking of getting a new recorder.
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...i got the files to open in audition, but parts we're just white noise/static while other parts were fine. the oddity of it is that depending on which offset i use, i get different parts of the set intact, while others are static...
With 24-bit stereo samples each frame contains two channels and 3 bytes (24 bits) in each channel. So if you import the file with 6 different offsets you will cover all of the possibilities. Riff headers are commonly 44 bytes long, so with one start at offset 45, then 46, 47, 48, 49, 50.
Perhaps it would be useful for some to describe how I do this with Samplitude. I line them up on 6 separate tracks and then solo each track until I get figure out which track contains the correct audio left/right for one section. Once that is determined I split all 6 tracks at the same point and then delete the 5 objects I don't need. Repeat the process for the next region of audio. Once you have been through all the audio, line up the good objects on one track and bounce the entire thing to a new file. You might need to do crossfades between objects or cut at the edges a bit more to join the files at zero-crossings. (ie. where the audio changes from positive to negative on the graph.) This will avoid pops or clicks at the edit points.
You might have an additional problem where your audio is crossed up somehow because of the cluster being cross-linked between two files. You just have to listen back and see what you've got. Possibly some data was overwritten, or perhaps some is duplicated because chkdsk couldn't totally recover the file.