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Gear / Technical Help => Microphones & Setup => Topic started by: stevetoney on November 09, 2009, 01:10:33 PM
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I was just reading another thread where someone was talking about doing M/S at a bigger shed. That caused me to wonder, is the PA usually mixed for stereo at the bigger venues? Seems to me that they'd probably be more of a mono mix considering the majority of the audience is in the prox of one or the other of the PA stacks.
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I've seen a true stereo PA (where certain channels onstage are panned to one side or the other) once, and it was at an outdoor festival that accommodated maybe 6k at the main stage. I went back after the first act and chatted with the sound guy and he did it because the area was small enough he could toe in each stack about 10-15 degrees and you would have to be up front and to a side to completely miss the other stack. Even then, he only did hard panning with cymbals/drums and slight panning with vocals/instruments.
Not saying they aren't out there, but from my experience I haven't heard any real stereo at a big shed, just dual mono.
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Seems like the GD had some level of stereo to their PA mix (?)
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Most touring acts that play in sheds have stereo systems. I know Dave Matthews Band was one exception although I heard that they have recently changed to a stereo rig. Obviously, the sign of a good engineer is someone who can use the benefits of stereo but also maintain even coverage to as many seats in the house as he can.
Many times amphitheaters use delay for fill speakers to cover the lawn or VIP areas. At big festivals, these delay fills are actually flown line arrays. Almost all of the time, these speakers are putting out a summed mono signal. As their name implies, the speaker's signal is delayed a few milliseconds to compensate for the distance between the listener and the main stacks. Ideally, they will both be heard at the exact same time with no phase effects or cancellation.
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I was thinking that both phish and WSP were/are stereo?
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Uh....yeah....I'd call it quindraphonic on many nights :-)
Seems like the GD had some level of stereo to their PA mix (?)
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most PA systems big enough to cover an outdoor shed are run in stereo. i'm not sure who or why someone told you they weren't, but they are. these days, mono is the exception, not the rule. perhaps if we were discussing small nightclubs, you might be right, but not when it comes to "real" PA systems.
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most PA systems big enough to cover an outdoor shed are run in stereo. i'm not sure who or why someone told you they weren't, but they are. these days, mono is the exception, not the rule. perhaps if we were discussing small nightclubs, you might be right, but not when it comes to "real" PA systems.
Are they just not doing much with it then?
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most PA systems big enough to cover an outdoor shed are run in stereo. i'm not sure who or why someone told you they weren't, but they are. these days, mono is the exception, not the rule. perhaps if we were discussing small nightclubs, you might be right, but not when it comes to "real" PA systems.
Are they just not doing much with it then?
meaning that not a lot of panning goes on? i guess it depends on what band/engineer you are talking about. a lot of times there won't be much panning on the individual input channels, but all the effects are in stereo, so you get the stereo effect sound, but the instruments are mixed in mono so that the audience doesn't loose stage left's sound if they are standing on the stage right side. hope that makes sense.
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most PA systems big enough to cover an outdoor shed are run in stereo. i'm not sure who or why someone told you they weren't, but they are. these days, mono is the exception, not the rule. perhaps if we were discussing small nightclubs, you might be right, but not when it comes to "real" PA systems.
Are they just not doing much with it then?
meaning that not a lot of panning goes on? i guess it depends on what band/engineer you are talking about. a lot of times there won't be much panning on the individual input channels, but all the effects are in stereo, so you get the stereo effect sound, but the instruments are mixed in mono so that the audience doesn't loose stage left's sound if they are standing on the stage right side. hope that makes sense.
cool, thanks.
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I was just reading another thread where someone was talking about doing M/S at a bigger shed. That caused me to wonder, is the PA usually mixed for stereo at the bigger venues? Seems to me that they'd probably be more of a mono mix considering the majority of the audience is in the prox of one or the other of the PA stacks.
What is coming from the speaker stacks is only one half of the stereo equation. Even if the PA is mono, you still want to capture the ambiance in stereo and have a proper image image upon playback. My point is, it shouldn't really matter if the venue is broadcasting in stereo, you should still consider it stereo. The placement of you mics should still be made the same way, as you are trying to capture everything acuratly with two mics, so upon playback with two speakers, you get the image right. Forget about what is coming from the PA system, think about how it will playback over your speakers. That is where the "image" matters...
What is coming from the speaker stacks is only one half of the stereo equation. Playback is the other. Even if the PA is mono, you still want to capture the ambiance in stereo and have a proper image upon stereo playback. The placement of your two mics should consider both the scene you are trying to capture as well as the playback environment. If logic tells you to point the mics straight at the speaker stack, I don’t blame you. This approach might provide great music-to-crowd ratio, but at the expense of lifelike imaging. Forget about what is coming from the PA system, think about how it will playback over your speakers. That is where the "image" matters... The distance between the venues two pa stacks is how the mic configuration should be calculated. It really doesn’t matter to me at all if the material is panned between the two stacks. my $0.02
EDIT:revised thoughts...