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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: Dede2002 on March 25, 2007, 01:30:33 AM
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Hi there, ??? ??? ???
My R-09's left channel is running slightly hotter than the right one ( when Line In is being used). Not much, but pretty easy to notice. It's been like a month since the first time I noticed. Well, in my imense lack of knowledge I don't know if one thing has to do with the other, but last week my Line In let me down. The opening act was almost finishing and I turn the unit on to check levels etc. Horrors! Only the left channel was working. Yes, I'm familiar with the R-09 Line In faulty soldering job. But like many other bad things in life, this only happens to other people, right?
I has to spend the whole concert holding the plug in the exact spot where both channels were sampling. Not a very pleasant experience. Of course, after the show the Line In was working perfectly,both channels, no problem.
Anyway: does the left channel running hotter has something to do with the bad soldering?
Is it a complicated thing to fix?
I'm convinced that my R-09 has something wrong. Even with MM HLSC-1 mics, which I was told are great but not very strong in the bass department, my recording always show oceanic, prodigious amounts of bass.
Anyway, thanks in advance for any tips regarding the Line In imput issue.
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You did use an angled mini-jack?
Level differences may be due to soldering issues but there is no guarantee.
Resoldering could fix the issue.
If you're out of warranty:
Find someone who can use a soldering iron. There is info on opening the deck floating around.
Is the HLSC-1 a `built on Sennheiser technology` mic?
If so: there should be plenty of bass. Maybe the battery box filters the bass due to the capacitor size?
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Is the HLSC-1 a `built on Sennheiser technology` mic?
If so: there should be plenty of bass. Maybe the battery box filters the bass due to the capacitor size?
Yes, Sennheiser MKE40`s capsules are used with the MM-HLSC-1 and MM-HLSC-2 mics.
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You did use an angled mini-jack?
Level differences may be due to soldering issues but there is no guarantee.
Resoldering could fix the issue.
If you're out of warranty:
Find someone who can use a soldering iron. There is info on opening the deck floating around.
Is the HLSC-1 a `built on Sennheiser technology` mic?
If so: there should be plenty of bass. Maybe the battery box filters the bass due to the capacitor size?
Yes, an angled mini-jack has been used. About opening deck info. Where can I found it? Any help will be highly appreciated.
Thanks in advance.
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http://www.sonicstudios.com/r-09revw.htm hints to the metallic backplate, that it can come off.
Under that there should be some screws, besides the already visible ones.
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I'm a wee bit worried now. My R09 ought to be arriving tomorrow, and all I hear about them is the damn line-in jack expiring. Is ths something I'm just gonig to have to live with, or is it a bad batch of R09's? Will I be having to send it back every once in a while to get it fixed yet again?
I'm not even contemplating taking it to bits - should the need arrive - I've had enough trouble with warranties and such in the past... is there a chance that enough badgering Edirol and they'll fix them all for good, or upgrade whichever component keeps failing?
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I'm a wee bit worried now. My R09 ought to be arriving tomorrow, and all I hear about them is the damn line-in jack expiring. Is ths something I'm just gonig to have to live with, or is it a bad batch of R09's? Will I be having to send it back every once in a while to get it fixed yet again?
I'm not even contemplating taking it to bits - should the need arrive - I've had enough trouble with warranties and such in the past... is there a chance that enough badgering Edirol and they'll fix them all for good, or upgrade whichever component keeps failing?
I noticed Edirol has new R-09 colors available...
http://www.edirol.net/products/en/R-09/
Maybe getting a colored one will gaurantee you are getting a pick from the latest production run...? (assuming they would have addressed the jack weakness in subsequent runs...)
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I'm a wee bit worried now. My R09 ought to be arriving tomorrow, and all I hear about them is the damn line-in jack expiring. Is ths something I'm just gonig to have to live with, or is it a bad batch of R09's? Will I be having to send it back every once in a while to get it fixed yet again?
I'm not even contemplating taking it to bits - should the need arrive - I've had enough trouble with warranties and such in the past... is there a chance that enough badgering Edirol and they'll fix them all for good, or upgrade whichever component keeps failing?
I just bought mine used and it has been modded by Edirol to add some epoxy to help carry the load on the jack so the wires won't break. That's what's needed. However, there have been people here that have made a couple of good suggestons that should help.
1) Use a right angle jack on the line in plug to prevent as torqueing on the jack as much as possible.
2) Plug the cable in and leave it. Don't take it out every time you use the R-09. Just leave it plugged in and forget about it. That will prevent further stress on the jack because obviously every time you plug and unplug your cable, you're putting a little bit of stress on the jack.
Otherwise, if you want peace of mind, have the unit modded. Look through the forum and you'll find the link to the person that does a mod if you don't want to send it back to Edirol. I got a message from him and he feels his fix is beefier and better than the one performed by Edirol. Anyway, regardless of which fix is performed, the people that have had their units modded (by either Nick or Edirol) have reported that the R-09 works great after being modded.
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I'm a wee bit worried now. My R09 ought to be arriving tomorrow, and all I hear about them is the damn line-in jack expiring. Is ths something I'm just gonig to have to live with, or is it a bad batch of R09's? Will I be having to send it back every once in a while to get it fixed yet again?
I'm not even contemplating taking it to bits - should the need arrive - I've had enough trouble with warranties and such in the past... is there a chance that enough badgering Edirol and they'll fix them all for good, or upgrade whichever component keeps failing?
I just bought mine used and it has been modded by Edirol to add some epoxy to help carry the load on the jack so the wires won't break. That's what's needed. However, there have been people here that have made a couple of good suggestons that should help.
1) Use a right angle jack on the line in plug to prevent as torqueing on the jack as much as possible.
2) Plug the cable in and leave it. Don't take it out every time you use the R-09. Just leave it plugged in and forget about it. That will prevent further stress on the jack because obviously every time you plug and unplug your cable, you're putting a little bit of stress on the jack.
Otherwise, if you want peace of mind, have the unit modded. Look through the forum and you'll find the link to the person that does a mod if you don't want to send it back to Edirol. I got a message from him and he feels his fix is beefier and better than the one performed by Edirol. Anyway, regardless of which fix is performed, the people that have had their units modded (by either Nick or Edirol) have reported that the R-09 works great after being modded.
Excellent... I'll be extremely careful with it, then if problems arise I'll get Edirol to sort it out (they should be able to handle it without having to send it off for too long). I'll not be using it - initially - more than two, three times a month, but I've heard so much about the jacks that I'm paranoid that merely looking at it funny might cause bits to fall off. I'll also look out for a right-angle cable. Thanks for the advice!
::)
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I'm a wee bit worried now. My R09 ought to be arriving tomorrow, and all I hear about them is the damn line-in jack expiring. Is ths something I'm just gonig to have to live with, or is it a bad batch of R09's? Will I be having to send it back every once in a while to get it fixed yet again?
I'm not even contemplating taking it to bits - should the need arrive - I've had enough trouble with warranties and such in the past... is there a chance that enough badgering Edirol and they'll fix them all for good, or upgrade whichever component keeps failing?
I just bought mine used and it has been modded by Edirol to add some epoxy to help carry the load on the jack so the wires won't break. That's what's needed. However, there have been people here that have made a couple of good suggestons that should help.
1) Use a right angle jack on the line in plug to prevent as torqueing on the jack as much as possible.
2) Plug the cable in and leave it. Don't take it out every time you use the R-09. Just leave it plugged in and forget about it. That will prevent further stress on the jack because obviously every time you plug and unplug your cable, you're putting a little bit of stress on the jack.
Otherwise, if you want peace of mind, have the unit modded. Look through the forum and you'll find the link to the person that does a mod if you don't want to send it back to Edirol. I got a message from him and he feels his fix is beefier and better than the one performed by Edirol. Anyway, regardless of which fix is performed, the people that have had their units modded (by either Nick or Edirol) have reported that the R-09 works great after being modded.
Excellent... I'll be extremely careful with it, then if problems arise I'll get Edirol to sort it out (they should be able to handle it without having to send it off for too long). I'll not be using it - initially - more than two, three times a month, but I've heard so much about the jacks that I'm paranoid that merely looking at it funny might cause bits to fall off. I'll also look out for a right-angle cable. Thanks for the advice!
::)
It's nothing to be paranoid over. The problem is readily known and is easily repaired by the people that have done the fix. Otherwise, people have nothing but positive things to say about this product.
It's just annoying as you well know to buy a new product and spend some decent money and then have a key component so cheaply made.
FWIW, even though I have my unit modded, I'm going to keep the cable plugged in all the time and then wrap the cable down around the body of the unit...then sorta 'straightjacket' the cable to the body with some velcro or something similar so there won't be any tugging on the jack. That way if any accidental tugging or bumping happens, the velcro will absorb the load, not the jack. Maybe not pretty, but I really don't care about how it looks as long as the deck works reliably.
I remember one person said they dabbed the end of the mini plug into some epoxy and glued hte cable in place. I personally wouldn't do that to my unit, but it's another way to keep the cable from being removed every time.
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There's at least one thread about this issue:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=dc5cb19c3eae03a2a98a47d2a8b6b290&topic=71160.0;all (http://taperssection.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=dc5cb19c3eae03a2a98a47d2a8b6b290&topic=71160.0;all)
Below are images of front/back views showing UNUSED mounting holes that if used would have solved the problem.
And Roland's flexible glue fix that ONLY DELAYS the board being broken from using these jacks in normal fashion.
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Leonard - are you willing to do that mod, and if so, for how much? Mine is fine so far, but you never know.....
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This is what I did:
(http://aycu29.webshots.com/image/13388/2002770341711023917_rs.jpg)
The plug on the left is a dummy - attached to he connector for the real plug with epoxy and fiberglass. the electrical tape was used to "mold" the epoxy as it set. Not pretty but it works great.
This is a very stable and secure connection - no rotation, and loads are mostly applied to the mic in jack (which I don't care about)
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There's at least one thread about this issue:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=dc5cb19c3eae03a2a98a47d2a8b6b290&topic=71160.0;all (http://taperssection.com/index.php?PHPSESSID=dc5cb19c3eae03a2a98a47d2a8b6b290&topic=71160.0;all)
Below are images of front/back views showing UNUSED mounting holes that if used would have solved the problem.
And Roland's flexible glue fix that ONLY DELAYS the board being broken from using these jacks in normal fashion.
Has anyone replaced the jacks with the appropriate part?
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Leonard - are you willing to do that mod, and if so, for how much? Mine is fine so far, but you never know.....
Not something I'd do as a service for others. Unless Roland gives written permission, gluing down the jacks permanently voids the warranty, and makes the board unrepairable in that area if service for something else is required. While unlikely, there's always the liability/risk of breaking the deck in the process.
Finding the correctly designed part seems unlikely as there's a special 'plug inserted' switch section inside these jacks NOT usually found in replacement jacks. We would need to find an identical part WITH the missing board mounting studs, and if available, I'd think Roland would be using these instead of gluing down these parts like they've been doing so far.
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Hi there and thanks for all posts. Well, let me try to describe what's going on with my unit right now. Both imputs ( Mic and Line) presenting the same problem:if you insert the plug all the way, only one channel works. If you pull out the plug a little bit you'll find a spot where both channel works. I'm kinda concerned, because if this only a matter of soldering, I can handle the problem. My concern is that the problem is located in the jack itself.
Any thoughts? Thanks
Sergio
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The plug on the left is a dummy - attached to he connector for the real plug with epoxy and fiberglass. the electrical tape was used to "mold" the epoxy as it set. Not pretty but it works great.
The thing I wonder about with that approach.. The r09 has switches in the jacks that allow it to auto-select whichever input has a plug inserted. I was wondering if there would be any negative consequences to line-in performance when running with a jack in the mic-in.
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if you insert the plug all the way, only one channel works. If you pull out the plug a little bit you'll find a spot where both channel works.
Has it always acted that way? Have you tried any other input plugs? If the plug is not quite up to 'spec' in terms of insertion depth, it maybe inserting too far.
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if you insert the plug all the way, only one channel works. If you pull out the plug a little bit you'll find a spot where both channel works.
Has it always acted that way? Have you tried any other input plugs? If the plug is not quite up to 'spec' in terms of insertion depth, it maybe inserting too far.
No. Not whatsoever. It's a new behaviour. Yes, I've tried diferent plugs.
There is another thing worth mention:sometimes (when the plug is actually in the input), even without any music or sound, the right channel led will act like there is, going up and down like crazy. When thart occurs, playback shows horrible scratching noise.
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I would return it for new plugs
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The plug on the left is a dummy - attached to he connector for the real plug with epoxy and fiberglass. the electrical tape was used to "mold" the epoxy as it set. Not pretty but it works great.
The thing I wonder about with that approach.. The r09 has switches in the jacks that allow it to auto-select whichever input has a plug inserted. I was wondering if there would be any negative consequences to line-in performance when running with a jack in the mic-in.
I wondered that as well, but the manual put my fears to rest. I forget the exact language, will look it up when I get home. I've run that way for a number of shows and tests, it's always worked fine.
about the switches - Are they physical switches or is it something electrical (senses a signal)? The dummy plug makes no connections whatsoever, so if it's electrical, the device won't know anything's even in the mic-in jack.
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The plug on the left is a dummy - attached to he connector for the real plug with epoxy and fiberglass. the electrical tape was used to "mold" the epoxy as it set. Not pretty but it works great.
The thing I wonder about with that approach.. The r09 has switches in the jacks that allow it to auto-select whichever input has a plug inserted. I was wondering if there would be any negative consequences to line-in performance when running with a jack in the mic-in.
I wondered that as well, but the manual put my fears to rest. I forget the exact language, will look it up when I get home. I've run that way for a number of shows and tests, it's always worked fine.
about the switches - Are they physical switches or is it something electrical (senses a signal)? The dummy plug makes no connections whatsoever, so if it's electrical, the device won't know anything's even in the mic-in jack.
The switch for 'plug inserted' is inside each input jack. Works when the plug is inserted to physically push a 'normally closed' contact to be disconnected from ground (if I remember correctly) to be open sending a signal to turn on that input.
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well, now you guys got me thinking, so I went and looked it up online. From the manual, in the section on recording mic-in:
If a cable is connected to the [LINE IN Jack], then the input from the [MIC Input Jack] is ignored.
Do not connect anything to the [LINE IN Jack].
and the section on recording line in:
If a device or cable is connected to the [LINE IN Jack], input from the microphones is disabled. Therefore,
it is not possible to mix microphone and line input during recording. If there is sound input via both the
[LINE IN Jack] and the [MIC Input Jack], only the sound from the line input is recorded.
so unless they royally screwed up, I can't see why there might be a problem.
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There is another thing worth mention:sometimes (when the plug is actually in the input), even without any music or sound, the right channel led will act like there is, going up and down like crazy. When thart occurs, playback shows horrible scratching noise.
Hey Sergio,
Are you using a battery box with your MM HLSC-1 mics? If so, be sure to select "condenser microphone powered by self-contained battery" during recorder setup (r9 user manual, p. 35). Otherwise, the r9 as well as the battery box will try to power your mics, and I wonder if that might be causing the noise on the right channel even though there is no music or sound input.
HTH.
Peace, Debra
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There is another thing worth mention:sometimes (when the plug is actually in the input), even without any music or sound, the right channel led will act like there is, going up and down like crazy. When thart occurs, playback shows horrible scratching noise.
Hey Sergio,
Are you using a battery box with your MM HLSC-1 mics? If so, be sure to select "condenser microphone powered by self-contained battery" during recorder setup (r9 user manual, p. 35). Otherwise, the r9 as well as the battery box will try to power your mics, and I wonder if that might be causing the noise on the right channel even though there is no music or sound input.
HTH.
Peace, Debra
Hi debra,
Thanks for your reply. I don't if I understood exactly what you mean. Anyway, I'm not using the plug in power at all. The mics are being powered by the bb alone.
Thanks,
Sergio
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Sorry for the confusion caused by my unclear post, Sergio. I just wanted to make sure your R-9 was not trying to supply plug-in power to your mics.
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Sorry for the confusion caused by my unclear post, Sergio. I just wanted to make sure your R-9 was not trying to supply plug-in power to your mics.
No sweat. Your comments are always appreciated. ;D