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Gear / Technical Help => Recording Gear => Topic started by: Merton on June 11, 2007, 05:52:20 PM
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Hey everyone,
Someone on another message board told me to ask you kind folks over at taperssection for advice. (copying and pasting thread)
"I would like to get some recording hardware (an audio interface), so that I can record stuff on my home computer. My uncle has a studio in his basement, so I am somewhat familar, but I am not too familar with audio interfaces.
The max I am willing to spend is $700.
I am currently looking at Echo AudioFire12 (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Echo-AudioFire12-12Channel-FireWire-Audio-Interface?sku=247004)
I like this interface because it offers 12 inputs. I don't really need 12, but it is cool that I atleast have the option to record the entire band at once if I ever wanted to.
If anyone has any input on this interface, or on any other hardware, please let me know. I have been reading reviews, which have all been positive, but I am just making sure there isn't something better out there that I am not familar with.
Thank you!!
(NOTE: I do not plan on buying from musicians friend if I decide to go with that)"
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(http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/8pre/images/8pre_front.jpg)
(http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/8pre/images/8pre_rear.jpg)
http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/8pre
$529 at bhphoto...i think i want one. it'd be right at home under the traveler instead of the ADA8000 :P
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Audiofire 12 is an excellent choice, but it has no preamps.
The MOTU 8pre is not a bad choice (I've not heard one, so I can't comment on sound quality).
You could go with a Presonus FireStudio or Focusrite Saffire Pro 26 I/O. Both of those units provide excellent expandability options for adding gear on in the future.
All three of these options fit under your budget cap.
If it were me, I'd probably go with the Presonus. Their service is excellent should you ever need it (both tech and repair).
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TNJazz, thank you so much. I didn't even realize that the AudioFire didn't have preamps!!
The first interface I was looking at was the Presonus FireStudio. I was almost set on that until I saw the 12 channel AudioFire.
Like I said before, the only thing nice about the 12 channel is the fact that I could record an entire band at once. That isn't really needed for my situation, but I love the idea of getting that live vibe in the recording.
However, I am guessing, if I really needed it, that I could chain it up with another FireStudio interface if I ever needed more tracks?
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I picked up a great condition used MOTU 828 mkII a few months ago for $500 and I've been very happy with it. Solid ongoing driver development and transparent sound with a variety of input selections were my shopping points.
A lot depends on what you intend to record - like TNJazz mentioned no pres on the Echo but are you really running mics? Just line levels? Need good drivers to get 1.8ms latency for your midi rig or latency isn't an issue because you are just mixing.
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(to make things easier I am just going to assume I am micing drums)
blast, my original plan with the echo was to mic my drums, send them to a Mackie mixer, then send the output to the AudioFire, then to my computer.
Also, I forgot to mention, I will be running this on a PC. I really do not have money to afford a mac because I am a Computer Science Major, and need a PC. However, I plan on purchasing a Quad Core AMD system, and hopefully 2-4gigs of DDR3 ram around Christmas time / early 2008.
The thing I am worried about is I will be running Windows Vista by then, so it will have to be Vista compatible. It could also be Linux compatibale, but I don't think I have ever seen an interface that markets Linux compatibility.
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I believe that a very trustworthy cat on this board has a MOTU for sale. Cleantone is his handle. Check the yardsale.
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Question:
When I am looking at some of the specs on these interfaces, it says "24-bit/96kHz audio interface" or "24-bit/192kHz audio interface"
which is better?
The reason I ask is because the MOTU 828 mkII and the PreSonus FireStudio is 96kHz, while the Echo and Focusrite are 192kHz.
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The reason I ask is because the MOTU 828 mkII and the PreSonus FireStudio is 96kHz, while the Echo and Focusrite are 192kHz.
192 vs 96 is a whole other topic, but 8-12 channels (I, I/O, whatcha doin?) @ 192k over firewire [400] is yet another piece of the puzzle...and IMHO not needed
....you're gonna need some horsepower in a PC and some good disc driveS
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However, I am guessing, if I really needed it, that I could chain it up with another FireStudio interface if I ever needed more tracks?
Yes, or you could just pick up a Digimax FS preamp (or any other 8 channel pre with A/D) and go lightpipe into the Firestudio (what I meant by "future expansion").
The Firestudio and the Focusrite both have two lightpipe inputs which allow the base unit to bee linked with two additional 8 channel preamps via the ADAT inputs.
I wouldn't worry too much about 96k vs 192k. We do all of our live recording at 48k.
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sorry....couldn't resist:
I have 4 presonus digimax96 (8 channel pre's with A>D) for sale.
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The reason I ask is because the MOTU 828 mkII and the PreSonus FireStudio is 96kHz, while the Echo and Focusrite are 192kHz.
192 vs 96 is a whole other topic, but 8-12 channels (I, I/O, whatcha doin?) @ 192k over firewire [400] is yet another piece of the puzzle...and IMHO not needed
....you're gonna need some horsepower in a PC and some good disc driveS
Haha I will have A LOT of horsepower, trust me.
And by 400 do you mean firewire 400? They have pci-e fireware cards that do firewire at 800 (which I have). Do either the PreSonus or MOTU support that?
I will need to have atleast 6 inputs when mic'ing my drums. Bass drum, snare, high tom, low tom, hi-hat, overhead. I have been using that setup for recording for years. If that is not possible with an inferface like this, please let me know, because I will DEFINTELY NOT buy one.
The reason I would have liked 10-12 is so I can mic the entire band. 6 mics drums, 2 inputs for guitars, and input for bass. This isn't necessary, but I love the whole "lets try this for the first time and record it" vibe.
CURRENT QUOTES:
(as of 6/14/07)
PreSonus FireStudio $590
MOTU 828 mkII Firewire $689.00
Both are under my $700 limit. Which do you guys think would be the better unit? Don't worry about price (especially since I am the one paying =P).
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The Firestudio is a MUCH better unit than the MOTU 828mkII, both soundwise and feature-wise.
The MOTU 828 has only 2 preamps (although it does have lightpipe input). They are hazy and undefined, and the clocking is poor. The A/D is fair; nothing special. The D/A stage is tremendous though.
Don't forget about the Saffire Pro 26 I/O either (also 8 preamps and the capability to expand with 16 more inputs via lightpipe, just like the Firestudio)
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TNJazz, the current quote on the Saffire Pro 26 is $669.
So which do you think is better (in terms of quality, I am just listing cost for reference)
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Focusrite-Saffire-Pro-26-IO?sku=241135 (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Focusrite-Saffire-Pro-26-IO?sku=241135) Saffire Pro $669
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/PreSonus-Firestudio-26x26-Firewire-Recording-System?sku=241848 (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/PreSonus-Firestudio-26x26-Firewire-Recording-System?sku=241848) PreSonus FireStudio $590
(I linked both, so anyone with input please chime in)
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I believe that a very trustworthy cat on this board has a MOTU for sale. Cleantone is his handle. Check the yardsale.
ah thanks K! I'd sell one of my MOTU 896's. I've made tons of good recordings on those units. You can record from 8 mic or line sources and add two more with an AES input and even more if you used the ADAT lightpipe which I have never done. I used to use the AES on two units all the time making 20 channels via one firewire400 line.
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TNJazz, the current quote on the Saffire Pro 26 is $669.
So which do you think is better (in terms of quality, I am just listing cost for reference)
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Focusrite-Saffire-Pro-26-IO?sku=241135 (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/Focusrite-Saffire-Pro-26-IO?sku=241135) Saffire Pro $669
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/PreSonus-Firestudio-26x26-Firewire-Recording-System?sku=241848 (http://www.musiciansfriend.com/product/PreSonus-Firestudio-26x26-Firewire-Recording-System?sku=241848) PreSonus FireStudio $590
(I linked both, so anyone with input please chime in)
I think they're both about the same. We've owned a Saffire in the past and were fairly pleased with it. Only sold it because we moved to hard disk location recording and got rid of all the laptop based gear.
We do still own and use Presonus gear, and I think it's an excellent bang for the buck.
You might also consider Cleantone's MOTU 896 as well, although it's a 2 rackspace unit. Pretty robust though, and certainly a big step up from the MOTU 828 series.
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I used to use the AES on two units all the time making 20 channels via one firewire400 line.
could you elaborate on your sample rate and bit depth?
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could you elaborate on your sample rate and bit depth?
Well it depends on your computer. Your RAM, hard drive speed, processor speed and bus speeds will dictate the effectiveness.
I used to roll 24bit 44.1khz. 20 channels for a couple of hours without choking on a TiBook 800mhz g4 with a gig of ram. To external and internal hard drives. I am not sure what happened to the rig but after a few years it got unreliable. Maybe the OS upgrades? OS9 always ran awesome. It was the computer though for sure. Not the hardware. From what I gather this thread is not about recording live concerts anyway. I upgrades and now I use only one unit at a time for playback one my Mac. Firewire out to MOTU 896> out the mains (or AES) to my monitors. I don't have much need to use them for recording. This means I don't have too much need for more than one unit. Someday I might want to go above 24 inputs (new rig) and clock an 896 for additional channels. If and when I don't think I will need more than 10 more channels and if I do I don't want to use the laptop anyway.
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Okay now I have a new question:
Will any of these systems benefit from having a firewire pci-express card that can handle up to 800mb/s (opposed to 400mb/s)?
I have one in my system now, and of course it would be great to run it at 800mb/s.
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Okay now I have a new question:
Will any of these systems benefit from having a firewire pci-express card that can handle up to 800mb/s (opposed to 400mb/s)?
I have one in my system now, and of course it would be great to run it at 800mb/s.
Not really. All of them are Firewire 400. I believe the only unit on the market at the moment with built in FW800 ports is the RME Fireface 800.
FW400 is more than enough though.
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I used to roll 24bit 44.1khz. 20 channels for a couple of hours without choking on a TiBook 800mhz g4 with a gig of ram. To external and internal hard drives.
thx, i guess that's were i was trying to skip to when i said horsepower originally. a bottleneck is definately going to be getting the data out to the drives (also why i said driveS)
i somehow manage to run my traveler pretty well on a windows base, but i also don't care about recording above 44 unless it's going to video
the motu's definately seem to like macs better.
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the motu's definately seem to like macs better.
they just have good taste ;)
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I used to roll 24bit 44.1khz. 20 channels for a couple of hours without choking on a TiBook 800mhz g4 with a gig of ram. To external and internal hard drives.
thx, i guess that's were i was trying to skip to when i said horsepower originally. a bottleneck is definately going to be getting the data out to the drives (also why i said driveS)
i somehow manage to run my traveler pretty well on a windows base, but i also don't care about recording above 44 unless it's going to video
the motu's definately seem to like macs better.
I will have a ton of horse power. I am a computer science major, and I am in the research field of multi-threaded, multi-core software development.
My new system will either have a 3ghz quad core processor, or two 3ghz quad core processors (8 cores total). I will also be putting in a MINIMUM of 2gigs of ram.
My CURRENT system:
Athlon FX-55 2.7gHz (overclocked)
2 gigs of Corsair ram
2 200gb harddrives running in raid 0 (this means both drives work together to processes something, which decreases the amount of time it takes to read and write to harddrive (aka they are faster)