Topic: Marantz PMD 620 or another R-09?

[edtyre]

Hey Taperz!

Just dropped and broke my 4th R-09 a few days ago, although
its only been a back-up or my super stealth recorder, im thinking
about getting something different. I love my Korg MR-1 as my main unit.

Who is using a PMD 620 in the field with high end mics? How noisy does it
get if you have to use a little gain on the recorder? (the Korg sucks in this department)

Any comments would be appreciated.

[JD]

Take a look at the R09hr.

The build quality appears to be much better than the R09 and the display much nicer to use (bigger).
The jacks are now thru mounted on the PCB so break away jacks should no longer be an issue.
From what I can tell the sound is at least as good as the R09.

Food for thought.

[stevetoney]

My take...screw Edirol and the R-09H.  They should have gotten it right from the start. 

The 620 sounds good.  Someone PMed me that the A/D is the same on the 620 as the R-09H, but I honestly have no idea.  I prefer to let my ears decide and I think these recordings sound great, so you should listen for yourself...

A couple of Nottinghams samples...these were the reason I went for the 620...

http://www.archive.org/details/mh2008-06-05.DPA4022
http://www.archive.org/details/alo2008-02-17.DPA4022

...and my only recordings so far with the 620.

http://www.archive.org/details/tlg2008-05-10.dpa4021
http://www.archive.org/details/nm2008-05-06.km150

I like the 620 because a) no SD card size limit, b) battery door is easy access from the back and not the hoodini thing on the R-09...simple to change batteries in the dark, and c) jacks designed for the purpose and don't have to treat them like they're made from crystal. 

BTW, regarding your question about how noisy it gets when adding gain, suggest you refer to the 620 thread.  I think there's a discussion there.  For the recordings I provided links for above, I was at less than unity gain which happens at about -8 or -9db.  I ran with settings around -15db for one show  and -18db for the other.  You would definitely NOT want to run this recorder above unity gain for any reasonably loud shows, because it will most definitely distort.  I proved that my first time out when I ran the Aerco at -20db and the 620 at something like -5db.  My levels looked great during the show, but the sound was not even close to listenable.  I can't remember who that was for, but it was a club show and rock n roll volumes...not ridiculous loud but plenty loud enough.

[edtyre]

Steve, thanks for posting the links to the samples +T

I listened to the Mothers Hips and TLG and they sound really good.
I'm going to borrow one to run in the field and i'll post my comments soon.

[Dede2002]

 Friend,I suck big time as a sales man. I have a  brand new ( used only 3 times, warranty etc) at YS, so at this time I should say wonderful things about the 620. But I won´t. 
 Sure it´s a fine machine, well built and everything. But with all due respect to different opinions, the 620 does not come even close ( to MY ears) to the R-09 in sound quality.
 The R-09 is a much warmer and fuller sounding machine than the 620. Most important: R09´s recordings are very pleasant to listen to, not one or two times, but lots of times. If you have the chance to have both units in your hand, tape some shows and listen. You'll understand what I´m talking about.
 The R-09 is not a perfect, dream recorder. I´m a lucky guy and my unit never let me down in almost two years. Appreciate the fact that I'm a fanatic, taping like 2, sometimes 3 gigs a week. So far, no problems with faulty jacks or battery door jams. Mind you, my unit once was submerged in a swimming pool, thanks to my 5 years old son. Works perfectly. But that´s just me. I know , like everyone else around here, that the R-09 has it´s issues, honestly.
 That being said, I´m waiting for my new R09HR. Friend of mine has one. It´s way more solid that the R09 and seems that all the old issues have been fixed.Hope that helps.
 Take care,
 Your lousy sales man from Brasil

[aaronji]

To my knowedge, both the R-09 and the PMD620 use the same chip, the AIC32 (http://focus.ti.com/docs/prod/folders/print/tlv320aic32.html).  I am unsure about the 620, but the R-09 is all codec and it is likely that this is also the case for the Marantz.  Both have pretty similar noise levels.  I think they both sound good...

But I like the Marantz better due to it's more solid build and the features that tonedeaf mentioned.  I also like the fact that there aren't so many little switches on the recorder; things like AGC and recording level (L/M/H) are set via menu.

I never tried it with high-end mics, although I think (in addition to tonedeaf) a few people here have...

At the rate your breaking R-09's, you should just get a 702!  Save you money in the long run...

EDIT:  And I think jaledu's suggestion is also pretty good.  The R-09HR reviews are starting to roll in...Maybe worth your while to give one of those a whirl?  In any event, I am curious what you decide and how it turns out.

[nottingham]

FWIW.

http://www.oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-620.html

[aaronji]

FWIW.

http://www.oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-620.html

+ for the heads-up on this! 

The website doesn't say much about it ("The PMD 620 Basic MOD rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions"), so I e-mailed Doug Oade for some additional details.  Here is part of his response (which was very quick, by the way):

The basic MOD only works for the mic in and all features remain intact...I have not had time to do any comparisons for the web, I am staying too busy doing upgrades but plan on it after I get the other MODs done. Once they are done, info will be on the website. I hope to do one for concert recording, which will improve the line in and for ambient recording which may remove the built in mics.

He also said that the -12 dB and -24 dB attenutation settings on the mic-in will be unaffected by the mod.  Might make for a very compact, good sounding recording option.

[Dede2002]

FWIW.

http://www.oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-620.html

+ for the heads-up on this! 

The website doesn't say much about it ("The PMD 620 Basic MOD rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions"), so I e-mailed Doug Oade for some additional details.  Here is part of his response (which was very quick, by the way):

The basic MOD only works for the mic in and all features remain intact...I have not had time to do any comparisons for the web, I am staying too busy doing upgrades but plan on it after I get the other MODs done. Once they are done, info will be on the website. I hope to do one for concert recording, which will improve the line in and for ambient recording which may remove the built in mics.

He also said that the -12 dB and -24 dB attenutation settings on the mic-in will be unaffected by the mod.  Might make for a very compact, good sounding recording option.

I hope that one day he might offer this upgrade to machines bought elsewhere, not only at his company. I have the PMD-620 and I'm not happy whatsoever. Especially since my R-09HR arrived.
Nottingham, +T%.

[John Willett]

Small portables - Sony PCM-D50, Olympus LS-10, Edirol R-09HR - first two are solid metal construction, last is plastic (I bought the LS-10 myself).

Larger and portable rather than pocketable is the Fostex FR-2LE.

[JasonSobel]

the oade page has been updated with more PMD-620 mods:

http://oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-620MODS.html

The PMD 620 Basic rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also increases gain by 6dB in order to record lower signal levels without using the ALC circuit. All features remain intact.
Price 449.00
Click Here to Order

The PMD 620 Concert rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also improves the line input circuit. The built in mics are removed to maximize microphone input quality, all other features remain intact.
Price 499.00
Click Here to Order

The PMD 620 Super rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also improves the line input circuit and increases gain by 6dB in order to record lower signal levels without using the ALC circuit. The built in mics are removed to maximize microphone input quality, all other features remain intact.
Price 499.00
Click Here to Order

[Dede2002]

the oade page has been updated with more PMD-620 mods:

http://oade.com/digital_recorders/hard_disc_recorders/PMD-620MODS.html

The PMD 620 Basic rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also increases gain by 6dB in order to record lower signal levels without using the ALC circuit. All features remain intact.
Price 449.00
Click Here to Order

The PMD 620 Concert rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also improves the line input circuit. The built in mics are removed to maximize microphone input quality, all other features remain intact.
Price 499.00
Click Here to Order

The PMD 620 Super rebuilds the PMD 620 mic preamp with a very low noise, high slew rate op amp that dramatically enhances detail and clarity while lowering noise and audible distortions. This upgrade also improves the line input circuit and increases gain by 6dB in order to record lower signal levels without using the ALC circuit. The built in mics are removed to maximize microphone input quality, all other features remain intact.
Price 499.00
Click Here to Order

Thanks for the heads up. Hope someday they may offer the mods for machines bought elsewhere.
+T.

[nottingham]

Thanks for the heads up. Hope someday they may offer the mods for machines bought elsewhere.

I second that.