Topic: Setting opinion/s on Upcoming Show

[Drgiggles1]

Artist -- Jon Anderson and Rick Wakeman
Location -- Mezzanine 3rd row center on top of mixing desk.
Rig -- CA-14 (o) -> CA-9100 -> PCMM10

I am considering going mic in for this show for extra gain from M10 and also setting mic sensitivity to high on the M10. What do you think ??

[Belexes]

That show was SO QUIET for me and I was standing 3 feet from the board. Maxed out the gain on the M10 and the 9100 running line-in and didn't get high levels.

I'd caution running the mic sensitivity on high.  That may be too risky.

[adrianf74]

That show was SO QUIET for me and I was standing 3 feet from the board. Maxed out the gain on the M10 and the 9100 running line-in and didn't get high levels.

I'd caution running the mic sensitivity on high.  That may be too risky.

I can speak to said tour but I did see one of Jon's summer dates at an outdoor festival this past August and the audio, as Belexes states, was really low.  On line in, I had to gain up the preamp to about 9 o'clock and even raise the deck levels a little bit to get something sufficient.  This was using a stand at 10' right next to the board area as well.

[tapeheadtoo]

I'd also be leery of putting the mic sensitivity on high.  True, much of the music and banter is quiet, but Rick does play some strong bassy organ chords here and there, and Roundabout is significantly louder than the rest of the show.  If you run 24 bit you can always raise levels in post without too much worry.

[Drgiggles1]

Thank you for the input. I was hoping people who  this event would chime in. So mic in only it is. Just curious would this be a good case for "automatic recording" vs. Manual ? Or there never is a good case for Automatic recording.

[acidjack]

Thank you for the input. I was hoping people who  this event would chime in. So mic in only it is. Just curious would this be a good case for "automatic recording" vs. Manual ? Or there never is a good case for Automatic recording.

There is never a good case for "automatic" for recording music.  That setting is really intended for speeches/interviews and things like that.

[Drgiggles1]

Thanks acidjack 

[Belexes]

Try not to laugh too hard at Rick's jokes.

[Gutbucket]

My rule of thumb for optimizing input gain for quiet performances is to set it wherever it needs to be so that applause (which is the loudest source) doesn't clip.  Clap it out yourself beforehand and roll from that setting.  You can then reduce the overall dynamic range later by bringing up the quiet sections if you want to.

[Belexes]

How'd it go? What levels did you peak at?

[F.O.Bean]

Don't be afraid to run MIC-IN on the M10. Thats the ONLY WAY I have run my CA14>SP BB setup and the M10's preamp is super quiet IMO. I have gotten consistently killer recordings going CA14[Cards]>SP 9v BB>MIC-IN>M10 I keep my gain all the way up on my SP 9v BB, and the gain on the M10 is usually around 4 on the scale

[tbger]

I don't have any idea about the mentioned artist.  Though keep two things in mind --

The CA mics will capture whatever you hear, and even more, while still maintaining a relatively consistent frequency response (i.e., you won't be significantly losing any aspect of the sound at most recording-levels).  If you're not satisfied with the levels, use an audio program to (carefully) boost them in post.

The second thing is, the High Sensitivity setting is quite noisy, hence you'll get a noisy recording when trying to boost the levels in post (should you need to do this).  I also remember Guysonic or someone else had mentioned this point in the PCM-M10 big threads, suggesting (IIRC) not to use this setting, basing their suggestion on measurements they've done.

The cleaner your signal be at any level you record, the happier you will be afterwards. 

[Drgiggles1]

The capture was as good as I could have asked for. It would have been mint for not the guy on my left who had heavy clapping hands. As far as during songs the crowd was really well behaved at times you can here a pin drop. For me the tough part was finding a good level where in post the worst thing I would have to do is attenuate some claps and keep the dynamics intact of the performance. I think it came out very well and comments from BT have been very positive. As far as my settings I had the preamp all the way and the pcmm10 on 4. During the announcements I saw i needed to bring it down so after the lady finished speaking I turned the pcmm10 down to 3. In the beginning of the performance I brought the level down to 2 where it was just right.

[ScoobieKW]

Would love to hear it when you are done, my wife is a huge John Anderson fan, and I'm a John and Vengelis fan.

[eman]

Loud claps are pretty easily repaired in post using limiter compression. Dial the limiter down to the level where the music is not affected. If you can see big spikes on the waveform from the claps, they can be cleaned up.