Topic: First recording with PCM-M10 - Very little bass

[yousef]

I think you make a good point but in terms of what we do I think bass roll-off at the mic is too much of a gamble: we all know how much the sound can differ from night to night -  for the same band in different rooms, different bands in the same venue and even the same band in the same venue...

If you can do a proper test recording (ie of that particular band in that particular room on that particular night) and decide that there really is too much bass then fair enough but I would rather take the risk of recording too much bass and have to tweak it in post than run the risk of coming home with an unacceptably thin recording that no amount of post-processing can properly rectify.

I understand the benefits that you are describing but I think that they are probably of less import than the potential drawbacks. Plus you have greater flexibility when applying EQ in post, both in terms of amount of cut and the frequencies affected.

[hi and lo]

I think you make a good point but in terms of what we do I think bass roll-off at the mic is too much of a gamble: we all know how much the sound can differ from night to night -  for the same band in different rooms, different bands in the same venue and even the same band in the same venue...

If you can do a proper test recording (ie of that particular band in that particular room on that particular night) and decide that there really is too much bass then fair enough but I would rather take the risk of recording too much bass and have to tweak it in post than run the risk of coming home with an unacceptably thin recording that no amount of post-processing can properly rectify.

I understand the benefits that you are describing but I think that they are probably of less import than the potential drawbacks. Plus you have greater flexibility when applying EQ in post, both in terms of amount of cut and the frequencies affected.

Totally agree that it's too often a gamble, but only because the science of how it works with particular recorders has been completely obscured.

Roll-off is not meant to be tweaked in such a finite fashion as 'venue to venue.' Certain microphones will benefit from a threshold amount of roll-off 99.9% of the time, but you have to carefully evaluate what that threshold is. Once you know, you will never come home with an 'unacceptably thin recording.' In fact, you might still wish to remove a tad more bass as your ears and playback system dictate, but you're certainly better off than had no roll-off been used at all.

The goal is not to get bass response perfect before it hits the recorder, but rather to reduce a portion of the low frequency spectrum that is rarely useful or contains unwanted artifacts (hum, vibrations, etc.). For some microphones, a small amount of roll-off is beneficial regardless of the source music or environment.

[Shaun]

Just checked my Sounds Pro battery box and I think it's actually set up for 'no bass roll-off' already. It's one of the ones where you have to unscrew the top to get at the switches. I've never changed the setting since I bought it, and looking at the info on the sounds pro website it looks like it's set to 'no bass roll-off'. So it seems it's all due to the low cut filter on the M10.

[Shaun]

I've just made my second recording with the pcm-m10 and I have to say again it's disappointing. This time it was at a venue I've recorded at before (using the same mic set up but with my old sharp minidisc recorder) with excellent results. I definitely had the low cut filter off, no bass roll off on the battery box, going to line in, and recording in 48/96 mode and the recording lacks any real definition or any discerable low or high frequencies. Could I have a device with a defective line in?

[TimeBandit]

Could I have a device with a defective line in?

check out at home. record from a CD deck or similar into line-in. if there is a lack of sound maybe it´s defective.

Other to do´s: some recorders you can set EQ for recording, maybe yours is set with an EQ setting for "No Bass".

other points:

Battery box battery is bad

you recorded in a spot at the venue were phase deletion occured with your mic config. (maybe invert phase on one channel of the recording)

[morst]

Cardioid mics do have "less bass pickup" so I would suggest you leave your roll-off/filter to OFF.  If your recording has "too much" bass, you can always EQ it out, however, you can't add what's missing.

Cardioid mics are, however, subject to the Proximity Effect which is a boosting of bass at close distances. But that's WAY more dramatic the last inch or two to the mic, versus the difference between 20 & 40 feet away. But compare that to Omni mics which don't have proximity effect at all. Different animals.

Experiment!!