Topic: mic upgrade path suggestions?

[taperdave]

Ok, so I have been recording stealth (and occasionaly open with stealth rig) arena rock type music since '97 when guidance from the old DATheads list pointed me to a D8 and CSBs.
Quickly went to CSCs and then on to a set of Garlost (which turned out to be CSC clones).  Later back to CSC and a used D7 with oade mod and later still a Multitrak II.
So about 100 masters (still gotta transfer DATs, so little time) and 15 years into it, the band my wife and I see the most have finally developed an underground taping community that values sound quality above the ability to buy a CD for $20 on Ebay.
Amazon just delivered my PCM-M10, and a 32gig Class 10 card is on the way.
I am hopefully ordering the CA14 card/9200 combo, though I realize that may be a slow transaction.

I don't see many shows any more but do shoot HD video (sometimes stealth multicam), and "release" multicam HD 5.1 to the fan community and DIME (which seems to be anathama to some folks here).

I am wondering if there are any specific suggestions for getting nice audio from forward balcony seats in 10,000 to 20,000 seat arenas for loud rock shows. I'd like to make the most of the pulls at the shows I do go to.  I have never played with hyper-cards but am pretty good at holding still so can probably pull off the "mic-stand-man" routine that it seems would be required for using a set.  I have no aversion to used gear and budget isn't a huge concern, though I wouldn't spend college tuition sized money on a rig I might use three times a year.

Not nervous about stealthing and of course smaller is better, but I routinely take 2 camcorders with giant 500 minute+ batteries, a monopod and the audio rig into shows, for whatever that's worth.

All suggestions welcome, would love to spend my money with the confidence that I am making a marked inprovement in the results of my fun.
Dave

[H₂O]

Schoeps mk41 > nbox or tinybox KCY when avail

[markrsmith]

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=153777.msg1946059#msg1946059

these r great!

[newplanet7]

You have to give us somewhat of an idea of a budget or we will eff this thread up 
First post will set you back some coin. Not college tuition style but trust me we can get there quick.
For solid sound and to be prepared for a lot of situations, I suggest something modular. Meaning it takes
multiple caps/polar patterns. Card/omni/supercard or hypercard.
You can get that with some mini mics such as
Church Audio(card & Omni)
Audio Technica 853 (card/omni/hyper/subcard)
DPA- just omnis 4060, 4061


I am only listing some of the most tested heavy hitters here at taperssection that you can stealth with.
A little bigger and of course more $ you have smallish set-ups with caps remote cables and the amp(body). The DPA 402x series have no bodies, just cap/cable. Some schoeps set-ups require no bodies but the rest do, UNLESS you can get a tinybox configured with proper polarization for your caps.
The Neumann km100 bodies, and the Milab VM-44 bodies are small, and you said you have no probs bringing in cams so......

MBHO- Bodies/cables/caps. KA series. Hypers, Subs, Omni, Cards, Fig 8
Schoeps- The only one that uses active cables. a ton of options here. I love their omnis (MK2) personally, though not used much here.
Subs are great MK21, Cards MK4/4v, Hypers mk41/41v, mk22 which is in between a card and sub. Also have a Fig 8. Love the 2, 21, and 22.
Neumann- caps/remote cables/SMALL body km40 Cards, KM50 Hypers, KM43 subs, KM30 omni, KM20 Fig 8. Dig the cards and subs.
Never heard the omnis.
DPA- 402x series caps/cables. Not going to say much here besides 4011's(full card mic) are what made me love AUD tapes.
so that carries over to the 402x series.
Milab VM-44 Links- I have the 44 classics modular full body. The links have the remote cables with a Small body. The caps are short too. These have the option of Card, Super-card, and omni and are less coin but not less quality than the above.

These are just a few things to investigate. All of the above will make super sweet tapes if you are willing.

[taperdave]

Thanks for the replys so far guys, I have been reading like a fiend for couple of weeks whenever I get a spare moment (a mobile version would be great), and my wife said to me this morning, " you aren't going to find the perfect mics, regardless of how much you read, so just order something already"  I did get response from Chris Church so I will have the CA14 bundle to tide me over as I decide on how to spend bigger bucks   

Schoeps mk41 > nbox or tinybox KCY when avail

Hey H2O - I have seen that (or similar) config in many folks sigs here, I guess I'm a little uncertain on the KCY deal.  It's a cable that takes the place of a mic body and cable to your connection right? so your whole rig consists of 2 seperate mic capsules that need to match>KCY cable>tinybox which is a phantom power/pre-amp combo>deck, right?  If I eventually decide on that route, I will definately spy out a deal in the Yardsale on the caps.

http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=153777.msg1946059#msg1946059

these r great!

Hey mark - I previously took a peak at those and decided I would rather have the CA14s as my next baby step, as the pricing is very competitive right now (lower than the YS by a good bit) and the CA14s are supposed to be an upgrade in sound quality though bigger in size. thanks for the suggestion

SNIP

Planet - wow now that is a manifesto I can chew on for a bit, lots of info to compare and digest, I certainly appreciate the effort. I am bookmarking for reference.
Budget wise I would like to stay under $1500 (already have a deck), though if the pieces arrived slowly so as to avoid arousing the notice of my significatnt other I could see the budget expanding a bit.
Being as my most frequent taping target is loud arena rock  (ninja mode) I don't see many comparison recordings of higher end gear.  And without trying to draw fire from other fans, the "open taping allowed" artists tend to be a completely different bag of fish. Lots of great gear comparisons for outdoor jam bands, not so much for Aerosmith and thier ilk indoors.
many thanks
Dave

[hoppedup]

I started with Church mics and preamp about three years ago and have felt no need to upgrade. I even find that sometimes when I tape alongside much more expensive equipment, I still prefer my own tape. YMMV.

mterry has some really nice Audix hypers in the yard sale that I could easily stealth with and can be run by the 9200 with a cable from Church:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=146910.0

Not sure how hypers sound stealthing, though. I'm working on a CA-14 stealth rig with fixed stereo configurations even though I don't really stealth much.

[taperdave]

I started with Church mics and preamp about three years ago and have felt no need to upgrade. I even find that sometimes when I tape alongside much more expensive equipment, I still prefer my own tape. YMMV.

mterry has some really nice Audix hypers in the yard sale that I could easily stealth with and can be run by the 9200 with a cable from Church:
http://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=146910.0

Not sure how hypers sound stealthing, though. I'm working on a CA-14 stealth rig with fixed stereo configurations even though I don't really stealth much.

Maybe i am on crack but I thought the Audix Hypers required 48v and the 9200 only provides 9v, so much reading, can't keep it all straight.
Dave