Phantom Power

[sweatboard]

OK, My head is spinnig but I think after reading this forum for 5 hours straight I've made some progress .  I want to run a nomad jukebox 3 with this mic set up (SP-cmc-2) then get the $100 upgrade from SP for the power adapters. This provides modules so the mics can plug into the mp-2, ua-5, etc.

My question is what are the mp-2 and ua-5 in full names and the best place to find them, I'm assuming they are the actual phantom power supply is this correct.  If I buy the jb3 minidisc recorder and the sp-cmc-2 mic's with the upgrades, and either one of these (mp-2 or ua-5), will I be ready to record?  Do I still need transformers?  I really need to get to the bottom of all this before My Morning Jacket starts thier mini tour. Thank you for your help,

Brian

[sweatboard]

Also is the Denecke PS 2 also a phantom power source?  Can my setup look like this.....  sp-cmc-2 (modified)>PS2>JB3.  and be complete?  It looks like I'm set with mic, power to mic, and recording device but I'm not sure about "Gain". 

[Evil Taper]

Those mics aren't really worth running that much gear behind.  At least get the sp-cmc-4 (at853), alot of people here run those phantom with great results.

[sweatboard]

Correct, I'm going for which ever used the (at853), I guess I ment the sp-cmc-4's.

[Evil Taper]

I believe so, but most people run at853>ps2>ad20>jb3.  The ad20 is a pre-amp and a/d converter.

[Diamond_D]

if you are going to get the 853's with the phantom mod, I (and many others) would probably suggest getting "the real deal" and getting a pair of true Audio Technica AT853Rx's direct from a dealer, such as Alpha Sound and Lighting who had a real good price of under $300 for the pair (near what you'd pay anyway with the mod from SP). The PS-2 gives you phantom power, and ends in 2 XLR cables. You need something to give you gain and go from XLR to optical (a/d conversion), which is what the Denecke AD-20 does. That's the pre I and several others who have the same rig use. It's a nice entry level pre and gets the job done nicely. From the AD-20 you use an optical cable into the JB3.

If you go with the Eridol UA-5, it provides phantom power and gain and a/d conversion, so you can go mics -> UA-5 -> JB3. The reason not everyone uses it is because it's larger and it's tough to sneak it in to most stealth shows. Hope this helps.

[Evil Taper]

Are you planning on open taping or stealthing this rig?

[Brian Skalinder]

I'm sure you've already seen it...for full names of the MP2, UA5, & PS2 and an overview of each unit's capability (phantom, gain, etc.), check this Where To Begin thread.  The answers are here if you look for them!    Seems like you've already taken a look, and when starting out, it's a lot to absorb - thanks for taking some initiative and seeking the info first before asking!   So...to address some of your specific questions...

I want to run a nomad jukebox 3 with this mic set up (SP-cmc-2) then get the $100 upgrade from SP for the power adapters. This provides modules so the mics can plug into the mp-2, ua-5, etc.

Yup, sounds about right.

My question is what are the mp-2 and ua-5 in full names and the best place to find them, I'm assuming they are the actual phantom power supply is this correct.

• MP2 = Sound Devices MP-2.  Provides phantom power and gain.  They pop up used fairly regularly and may or may not still be available new.
  
• UA5 = Edirol UA-5.  Provides phantom power, gain, and ADC.  *Great* combo with your JB3 if you're open taping, not practical for stealth.  No longer available new, but pop up used fairly regularly.  Make sure to check out the UA5 FAQ in the Archive | Pres, A/Ds & Processors forum.

If I buy the jb3 minidisc recorder and the sp-cmc-2 mic's with the upgrades, and either one of these (mp-2 or ua-5), will I be ready to record? Do I still need transformers?

Transformers provide gain.  Since both the UA5 and MP2 provide gain, you won't need the transformers.  Both of these setups are essentially complete (obviously not including things like cables, power, etc.):

Mics > MP2 > JB3
Mics > UA5 > JB3

Also is the Denecke PS 2 also a phantom power source?  Can my setup look like this.....  sp-cmc-2 (modified)>PS2>JB3.  and be complete? It looks like I'm set with mic, power to mic, and recording device but I'm not sure about "Gain".

• PS2 = Denecke PS-2.  Provides phantom power only.  If you run mics > PS-2, you'll still want a way to add gain before feeding the signal to your JB3.  That's where the inexpensive line transformers come in.

I really need to get to the bottom of all this before My Morning Jacket starts thier mini tour.

I suspect tapers will document fairly well their mini-tour.  Their 5 shows with Wilco will undoubtedly get recorded,with the possible exception of Montreal (any Montreal tapers here?).  Bonnaroo - guaranteed.  The others - all areas with taper strongholds.  You could always consider skipping the recording gear and meet up with the tapers at the shows to see if they'll send you a copy or seed via BT, etc.  Or, just get enough gear to patch if you want to take the recordings home.

ET's right, we need to know:  Will you tape primarily open or stealth?  And I'll add a question:  What's your budget?

[sweatboard]

Thank you all, I guess you could say I will be recording stealth, I'm not really worried about hideing anything as much as being hands free and not hauling around a bunch of bulky equipment.  I want to have a jb3 for sure so I basically need ideas for two rigs, one that I can afford now to get the upcoming shows (I am considering an AT 822 straight into the jb3) and one I will upgrade to eventually(AT853RX >PS2>need help here with a transformer>jb3).  How Big is this UA-5, I don't mind straping something to a fanny pack but I don't want to be hunched over all night, Is the mp2 smaller?  What is the consensus, PS2+ transformer, MP-2, or UA-5?  Thanks again,

Brian

[Brendan]

hey im running At853 C's>PS-2>Jb3... what will i need to do about gain? I do not have an Ad-20.. i want to tape the Mars volta and The White Stripes

[jcrab66]

hey im running At853 C's>PS-2>Jb3... what will i need to do about gain? I do not have an Ad-20.. i want to tape the Mars volta and The White Stripes

as previously mentioned you could get an AD 20 or you could just go with what you got. If your stealthing and plan on getting in tight with the stacks you'll be fine....

[Brendan]

what do you mean by getting in tight with the stacks?? like i know what a stack is but whats the tight your talking about.. how far/ close

[Evil Taper]

That's a bad suggestion.  Stack taping is only good when the venue sounds like total ass and you can't find a spot with a decent sounding mix.  Tape FOB with that rig, it'll sound nice.

[sweatboard]

Can someone clarify what "Stack Taping" is, and FOB.  Thank You.

[Evil Taper]

Stack Taping = "humping a stack" or taping right in front of the stage speaker stacks.  This technique has it's advantages if you're taping in an underamped venue like a hole in the wall bar and the sound is terrible, but most of the time it's going to make an unbalanced recording because the cabinet you're in front of will be much louder than everything else.

FOB = "front of board" = in front of the venues rear mixing console.  The big house mixer is usually set up in the sweet spot of the room so the sound guy can make a good mix of the stage sound.  You'll usually get a nice and even recording from an FOB position and you also get a great ambience from roomplay (which sometimes will not be positive but usually is a bonus).  Listen to some recording and see what you prefer, they're you're tapes.