Newbie editing questions... Any help at all appreciated!

[TandJam]

Hi guys.  The newest of the newbies here.  I'm jumping into taping and learning as I go.

I've been reading around here for a little while to educate myself before buying gear, now I have some of my gear, enough to start anyway, and I have been making my first recordings. My husband thinks I'm nuts spending my time and money on this. But I'm loving it.  I'm nervous here asking my first questions...

I am looking for help in post. I have no idea what I'm doing or what most of the lingo means that I see when people talk about using audacity. I downloaded the free version and it all looks so foreign to me. I need a teacher, a mentor...I need help.

If anyone has time to teach me in simple words how to fix this show up in post I would sure appreciate it.

Obviously we have a problem with people in the crowd trying to get into a fight. (they actually succeeded, but that's another story...) My real question is why does my recording sound so far away?  Why do the vocals sound too far back?    I don't have a pre-amp yet...is that to blame?  What can I do to make this sound better? Cleaner?


mp3:
http://www.box.net/shared/ki4aaj58bd

Here is the original .wav :
http://www.box.net/shared/gy13jjjtvp

This is the rig I used:
SP-CMC-20>SP-SPSB-9>Edirol R-09

Actually, any comments or feedback on this recording would be very, very welcome.

Thanks so much.

-TandJam

[ilduclo]

the audience noise just kills this, nice try, though. I'd say what you need to do is to get closer to the stacks, or to use a mic stand to get above the loudest ones....I don't think the sound quality is bad, I hear a bit of brickwall in it, but your levels are pretty well ok. Post processing of this I'd suggest finding the loudest of the talking/claps where you don't mind cutting it out, between songs and that, then use graphic eq to boost the mid range, the bass is pretty decent and the highs are high enough to even sound a bit shrill. All in all, a good effort for 1st tape!!

[Brian Skalinder]

My real question is why does my recording sound so far away?  Why do the vocals sound too far back?    I don't have a pre-amp yet...is that to blame?  What can I do to make this sound better? Cleaner?

As ilduclo suggests, try getting closer to the sound source.  Where were your mics relative to the stage and/or stacks?

The vocals sound as I'd expect through a PA.

I'm not familiar with your mics / battery box, but your levels seem okay, so a preamp may not be needed as long as the sound source is loud enough.  I'm sure someone will chime in about whether the mics + battery box are sufficient for loud concert recording without brickwalling, distortion, etc.

Best thing you can do to make it sound better / cleaner is get your mics into a good position within the venue, where the sound seems to "float" all around you, rather than coming from a specific location / set of speakers.  This is the "sweet spot", and it varies from venue to venue, night to night, etc.

Obnoxious crowd!  When they're not blathering and screaming loudly, the music sounds pretty good.

[TandJam]

... then use graphic eq to boost the mid range, the bass is pretty decent and the highs are high enough to even sound a bit shrill. All in all, a good effort for 1st tape!!

Thanks for the feedback!  Can anyone explain to me how to 'use graphic eq to boost the mid range'?  Can I do that on the free version of audacity?

Where were your mics relative to the stage and/or stacks?

Thanks Brian for your feedback. I was standing about second or thrid row almost in line with the left speaker stack...not the best place to be I guess.

[ilduclo]

actually that's not a real bad spot generally, but you had a pretty bad crowd. Like I said, try to see where you can cut out the worst of it without hurting the musical continuity, then amp up the midrange with a graphic eq, and I'd rate it a solid B+ recording, which is pretty good for 1st tape (you should hear a couple ones I did!)

as to audacity, I'm not sure, I have soundforge and cool edit.

ildu

[Brian Skalinder]

Can anyone explain to me how to 'use graphic eq to boost the mid range'?  Can I do that on the free version of audacity?

Ensure Audacity is configured properly, import the WAV, highlight a small section as a test, then toy around with main menu Effects | Equalization.  Keep in mind it's easier to make a recording worse through EQ than make it sound better.  Pretty difficult to do, IME, especially if one doesn't have a decent way to monitor the results - monitors, good headphones (still problematic), and/or full stereo system, etc.

A few threads worth scanning:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,72791.0.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,60093.0.html
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,53916.0.html

[TandJam]

Thank you so much for the input and the links to check out...I have so much to learn but I'm having a great time learning.


Another question...What if I just chop off the first say 10 seconds of the track to get rid of the fight?  It wouldn't impact the music.  Is that just out of the question for something that would be shared?

Also, what causes the 'clicks'? How can I avoid getting them in the future?

[Brian Skalinder]

Another question...What if I just chop off the first say 10 seconds of the track to get rid of the fight?  It wouldn't impact the music.  Is that just out of the question for something that would be shared?

Totally discretionary - you made the recording, you decide what's best.  In general, many TSers like to include the complete recording when sharing.  But not everyone does this.

Also, what causes the 'clicks'? How can I avoid getting them in the future?

I've not listened real thoroughly, but don't recall any clicks on a quick listen.  What clicks?

[TandJam]

I've not listened real thoroughly, but don't recall any clicks on a quick listen.  What clicks?

Clicks...for example at 0:49 and again at 0:56...and so forth. 

[Brian Skalinder]

Clicks...for example at 0:49 and again at 0:56...and so forth.

I hear what sound like claps very close to the mics at 0:49 and 0:56.

[TandJam]

I hear what sound like claps very close to the mics at 0:49 and 0:56.

Oh. I'm so embarrassed. claps....ok.

Well, I did what I could do and this is what I came up with.  I'm not thrilled, but I think it sounds better.  I think I may have listened to this track over and over way too many times... Please give me brutally honest opinions! Should I leave it untouched, or is this better?

http://www.box.net/shared/6infff3618

[dorrcoq]

I just listened to both with my crappy laptop speakers, so take this for what it's worth.  I think I liked the original better.

[Brian Skalinder]

Oh. I'm so embarrassed. claps....ok.

Don't be embarrassed...I've often heard what I thought were artifacts but turned out to be sounds within the recording environment.  It's all part of the learning process.

Please give me brutally honest opinions! Should I leave it untouched, or is this better?

Kudos for asking for brutally honest feedback - that's the best way to learn.

[TandJam]

.
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Thank you for the feedback!! 

I just listened to both with my crappy laptop speakers, so take this for what it's worth.  I think I liked the original better.

Ok. That first try was shit. Never mind that one.  I've worked another 8 or 9 hours messing with stuff and came up with this:

(8/13 edited this post to fix a bad link to the file...)

Edited:  http://www.box.net/shared/32yedy2thg


(Original: http://www.box.net/shared/i89v9vrufu)



I'm still looking for brutal honesty...   (This time I actually tried to 'use the graphic eq to boost the midrange'...did I?)


I really can't thank you guys enough for the feedback.  Thanks so much.