Topic: Please tell me what went wrong with my recording (samples attached)

[jjazzfusion]

Last night, I recorded Vital Information at Martyrs'. When I listened back to the recording, I noticed a very bassy ambience to it. I used Core Sound Binaural mics (Bass Roll-Off "FLAT") along with the Edirol R-09HR plugged into the line-in jack, Limiter: OFF, Low Cut: OFF, Mic Gain: LOW w/ the levels set at 65. Today I noticed that the Plug-In Power switch might've been ON. Check out the sound sample. I also included a chart I drew of the stage setup, and where I was sitting, marked by an X mark. I sat on an angle facing the drums directly, which were also on an angle. The arrows illustrate this. Please let me know what you guys think. Was it my position (wish I could've got a center seat more towards the back), settings or both? I know you guys can help a lame-ass like me. I appreciate it very much

[Belexes]

I use to own those mics and they produced very bassy recordings for me in small clubs.  It may have helped to be center and further back in venue.  I brought up the high range in your sample with EQ and it sounds very nice to my ears.  It doesn't sound like the drums were amplified in the house mix much.

[boojum]

Omnis really pick up bass.  In a small room it can be more pronounced.  Just attenuate it in post.     

[acidjack]

Last night, I recorded Vital Information at Martyrs'. When I listened back to the recording, I noticed a very bassy ambience to it. I used Core Sound Binaural mics (Bass Roll-Off "FLAT") along with the Edirol R-09HR plugged into the line-in jack, Limiter: OFF, Low Cut: OFF, Mic Gain: LOW w/ the levels set at 65. Today I noticed that the Plug-In Power switch might've been ON. Check out the sound sample. I also included a chart I drew of the stage setup, and where I was sitting, marked by an X mark. I sat on an angle facing the drums directly, which were also on an angle. The arrows illustrate this. Please let me know what you guys think. Was it my position (wish I could've got a center seat more towards the back), settings or both? I know you guys can help a lame-ass like me. I appreciate it very much

Agree w/ Belexes, it's not your position, it's really just the mics - first that they are omnis and are picking up a lot of room reflection, second that CSBs in general always seemed to be on the bassy end of things.  You might try using the Cores' own bass rolloff.. it's a pretty mild rolloff but when I ran the CSBs I found it helped a lot, and rarely if ever was it "too much" bass rolloff.  Obviously if you prefer, you can deal with it in post. I find those mics often benefit from a gradual bump to the high end in post, too.  It's a good recording overall IMHO. 

Also: How high up were the mics on your person?  I.E., were they mounted on glasses/head, or further down, such as shoulders?  Getting them up higher will help somewhat with muffling the high frequencies. 

Ideally of course with the CSBs (and any omni mics) you'd be pretty close to the sound source, and in the center, but they should perform fine where you were.  I wouldn't try moving further back in the room - that would make your problems worse, not better.

[jjazzfusion]

Agree w/ Belexes, it's not your position, it's really just the mics - first that they are omnis and are picking up a lot of room reflection, second that CSBs in general always seemed to be on the bassy end of things.  You might try using the Cores' own bass rolloff.. it's a pretty mild rolloff but when I ran the CSBs I found it helped a lot, and rarely if ever was it "too much" bass rolloff.  Obviously if you prefer, you can deal with it in post. I find those mics often benefit from a gradual bump to the high end in post, too.  It's a good recording overall IMHO. 

Also: How high up were the mics on your person?  I.E., were they mounted on glasses/head, or further down, such as shoulders?  Getting them up higher will help somewhat with muffling the high frequencies. 

Ideally of course with the CSBs (and any omni mics) you'd be pretty close to the sound source, and in the center, but they should perform fine where you were.  I wouldn't try moving further back in the room - that would make your problems worse, not better.

Thanks for your advice. Len from Core Sound told me that if I needed to use roll-off, to use the Edirol's Low Cut function, and NOT the CSB's, as the CSB roll-off is dependent on the recorder's input impedance. Other people on this formum told me to NEVER use any roll-off with my setup . So everyone has their opinions. The mics were mounted on my t-shirt's collar, about 12" apart. Where can I get fake glasses to mount my mics on? Man, I wish there was a way to get a perfect recording every time....

[acidjack]

Agree w/ Belexes, it's not your position, it's really just the mics - first that they are omnis and are picking up a lot of room reflection, second that CSBs in general always seemed to be on the bassy end of things.  You might try using the Cores' own bass rolloff.. it's a pretty mild rolloff but when I ran the CSBs I found it helped a lot, and rarely if ever was it "too much" bass rolloff.  Obviously if you prefer, you can deal with it in post. I find those mics often benefit from a gradual bump to the high end in post, too.  It's a good recording overall IMHO. 

Also: How high up were the mics on your person?  I.E., were they mounted on glasses/head, or further down, such as shoulders?  Getting them up higher will help somewhat with muffling the high frequencies. 

Ideally of course with the CSBs (and any omni mics) you'd be pretty close to the sound source, and in the center, but they should perform fine where you were.  I wouldn't try moving further back in the room - that would make your problems worse, not better.

Thanks for your advice. Len from Core Sound told me that if I needed to use roll-off, to use the Edirol's Low Cut function, and NOT the CSB's, as the CSB roll-off is dependent on the recorder's input impedance. Other people on this formum told me to NEVER use any roll-off with my setup . So everyone has their opinions. The mics were mounted on my t-shirt's collar, about 12" apart. Where can I get fake glasses to mount my mics on? Man, I wish there was a way to get a perfect recording every time....

I have never used the low-cut function on the R-09HR... that may work, though it strikes me as a bad idea for some reason.  I have had much better luck with the CSB's built-in rolloff - I am kind of surprised Len was so against that. In any event, yeah, TS.com conventional wisdom - and there is a lot of truth to this - is basically you can't put what what you've taken away, i.e., just record everything and cut bass down later.  I just find with CSBs that they consistently needed a little roll off (and with my Coresound DPA 4061 omnis, the same is true) and I usually am happy with what their box gives me when I engage the rolloff. 

Pretty sure it's not too hard to find non-vision-correcting eyeglasses.  A quick google search turned up this:  http://celebritystyleblog.wordpress.com/2008/02/22/clear-glasses-fake-non-prescription-clear-glasses-1080/

Also, any store that sells vision-correcting eyeglasses will sell you some with just glass lenses in them.  Also, I suspect that drugstore OTC glasses provide so little vision correction that they might work. 

Another alternative is to wear a hat of some kind and attach the mics to that.  I wear contacts usually, and I find wearing glasses can be annoying, though I do it from time to time.   I assume you are recording with permission and are not that concerned about concealing what you're doing. If that is not the case, send me a PM, as discussing concealment methods is frowned upon in public forums.