Topic: NOS characteristics

[mhibbs]

Anyone have any insight into the characteristics of running NOS vs. say ORTF or DIN?  Obviously the difference in angle and spacing causes a different phase difference as compared to say ORTF, but what exactly does that "sound" like?  In other words, if you were to run ORTF vs NOS in the exact same spot on a given night, in *theory* what would the difference in sound be?  I've looked all over for some theory, but nobody can really nail it down.  Even the really good stereo recording text book I have dances around any discussion of characteristics of NOS.  They mention that the phase differences caused by ORTF results in the "spacious" sound listeners find desirable, but for NOS, they merely mention the difference in spacing as compared to ORTF, but fail to discuss how it changes the sound.  Anyone have any thoughts?


mitch

[JAH]

I would think one would "get" more separation but may have a hole if you use hypers.  Best used with wide cards (subs).  That being said, I also think it would create less focus too (omitting sub usage).  I've played w/ it but like DIN better.  Prolly best outside where reflections are minimized/eliminated.

peace
jah

[Roving Sign]

In many situations NOS will have your mics pointed right at the stacks - my NOS tapes always have more PA than room...I've never heard a hole - but I think things might get odd if you are too far away with NOS. Also - I think you have to be DFC with NOS - more so than with other patterns...If the mics end up pointing just inside, dead on, or just outside the PA - NOS should be fine...if they look like they are pointing at the walls - try another pattern...

[mmmatt]

I used Nos outside a few times and didn't like it... sounded sorta phasey to me but I wasn't centered so that may have been it.  However I found it very lifelike and realistic in a small bar/club when I ran it there (again off center).  I like din, ortf, and x/y best.  Which one depends on the situation and the mics I'm using.  Here is ome good info:
http://dpamicrophones.com/

Matt

[Swanny]

Has anyone run subcards DIN. How much difference do you really get spacing them 30cm compared to 17-20?

[Nick's Picks]

i've run nos a few times...and dont really care for it.  no focus.  no solid imaging.

I wouldn't do it w/anything less than subs or omnis

[mmmatt]

i've run nos a few times...and dont really care for it.  no focus.  no solid imaging.

I wouldn't do it w/anything less than subs or omnis

how is it with omni's nick... I'm guessing on stage you would get some image but any distance would be pretty lifeless.  Is this a correct assumption?

Matt

[Nick's Picks]

i'm thinking of John Lynns WSP bonarroo '02 recording that was un-freakin' believable as a reference here.
but that was AKG 482>248>500e NOS and just amazing.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

I got an NOS kwon bar for my AK43s and I won't run anything else upclose.   I only reach for the ORTF bar now if I need to be lower profile or when running cards.  What I got using the AK43s NOS was a super wide soundstage, lots of air with a full sound.   I only ran the AK40s NOS once.  That tape was good and there was no hole in the middle, but the sound was not as expansive as the AK43s.  "spacious" is a good description of what I got.  I always ran NOS up close or in small places.   I agree with what others have posted - it's probably not a good fit for the back of a hall but outside you may get away with being at a greater distance.  In my tapes I didn't really sense a lack of detail over using the cards ORTF.  I did run the subs ORTF quite a bit and I think that NOS gave a bit better image just for the fact that subs ORTF seemed to overlap too much causing there to be a big middle (the opposite of a hole in the middle, if that makes sense).   Subs ortf still sounded great, but the NOS was been my favorite with the AK43s.

Honestly, the best thing to do is try it and see for yourself.

[Nick's Picks]

I"m just the opposite.  Give me the ak40s XY up close.
I love that shit.

[Lil Kim Jong-Il]

I ran XY forever and I got really wierd about not wanting to run anything else, but the ORTF and NOS rule my face now.   Sometime I need to try XY again.   I still like XY best at a distance, but I try to not be in teh section anymore.

[F.O.Bean]

NOS w/ the ck62's ehh may have to try that sometime soon

[mmmatt]

I"m just the opposite.  Give me the ak40s XY up close.
I love that shit.

I'm with Nick on this... well, cards in general in x/y on stage are awesome to my ears.  The times I've used x/y from a distance I didn't like it, but I haven't yet with the mbho's so that may swing me back to a distance x/y fan.  If I do Omni's I usually have them split, but may try NOS with the omni's.

Matt

[it-goes-to-eleven]

Honestly, the best thing to do is try it and see for yourself.

To eval different configs, it would be fun to get a couple of acoustic guitar guys just jamming (drum circle would probably work too) and adjust the mic positions realtime while listening on headphones.