Topic: M/S Question

[NOLAfishwater]

I am trying my first M/S recording tonight and was wondering what channel (R or L) to designate as the Mid and the Side.  Using 414>V3. I am planning on running lip of stage so was going to use the subcard for the mid. Any thoughts?  Also, this will be my first 24bit recording using an MTII. Just installed my Audiophile 24/96 card tonight and was completely amazed with the 24bit playback.  Can't wait to get home and give a listen to the recording. Thanks in advance for your help.

[rowjimmytour]

Left=Side figure 8 facing left perpendicular to stage
Right =Mid straight ahead Card or hyper
Good luck and have fun!! and +t for the MS.
Peace

[Brian Skalinder]

I think sub-card is a good choice for Mid when running on-stage.

Actually, I think RJT has it backwards.

Mid = Left
Right = Side, with the positive lobe (the "front" of the 414s) of the figure-8 pointing left

I think most M-S decoders assume the above.  So if you use a different setup, you'll either want to decode manually, or adjust in post for the decoder to work properly.  The good news is even if you screw up the channel assignments or +/- lobe directions (as I've done a few times), you can fix it in post.

[DSatz]

I happen to prefer L for M and R for S. "Left/right" and "mid/side" are the order in which I normally say those two pairs of things; I find that the association makes more sense that way.

But whichever way you do it isn't actually important to the result, as long as you write down what you did--and keep what you wrote (and read it, and check your wiring when you hook up the matrix for playback).

I aim the 0-degree axis of the figure-8 microphone to the left. That actually matters. M/S matrixes are always designed to follow L = M + S and R = M - S, so if S is inverted, you end up with the L and R channels reversed.

Good luck! Be sure to let us all know how it goes.

--best regards

[rowjimmytour]

I think sub-card is a good choice for Mid when running on-stage.

Actually, I think RJT has it backwards.

Mid = Left
Right = Side, with the positive lobe (the "front" of the 414s) of the figure-8 pointing left

I think most M-S decoders assume the above.  So if you use a different setup, you'll either want to decode manually, or adjust in post for the decoder to work properly.  The good news is even if you screw up the channel assignments or +/- lobe directions (as I've done a few times), you can fix it in post.

My bad your right its been a little while since I ran MS and mixed it up. +t for correcting me.
Peace

[John Willett]

I happen to prefer L for M and R for S. "Left/right" and "mid/side" are the order in which I normally say those two pairs of things; I find that the association makes more sense that way.

Yes, this is the correct way - this standard comes from the days of analogue tape; so if an MS recording was played back on a mono machine you would still get the mid mic. and a true mono recording.

I aim the 0-degree axis of the figure-8 microphone to the left. That actually matters. M/S matrixes are always designed to follow L = M + S and R = M - S, so if S is inverted, you end up with the L and R channels reversed.

Yes - I will underline this important point.

[NOLAfishwater]

First off. +T all around. Thanks for the heads up. I think I got it set up right. Now I am just trying to figure out how to mix it in Sound Forge 8.0. I found the menu of Pan/Expand there are a few system presets in the drop down menu:

-Compress Stereo Image
-Expand Stereo Image
-Left to Right (Exponential)
-Left to Right (Linear)
-Normal Mix of M/S recording (L-Mid, R-Side)
-Right to Left (Exponential)
-Right to Left (Linear)

I was previewing the Normal Mix of M/S recording and it sounds pretty good. Guess that is the selection that I want. However, I don't know how to change ratios to increase or decrease the mid or side. Below the presets menu there is a process mode dropdown menu offering me the opportunity to go beyond the factory presets and adjust the sound to my liking.  Here are the choices:

-Pan (Preserve Stereo Separation)
-Pan (Mix Channels before panning)
-Stereo Expand
-Mix M/S Recording to left and right channels

Either way, I am STOKED. Learn something new everyday. Plus this 24bit stuff rawks. 

[NOLAfishwater]

So after trial and error, I decided to invert the files. Then I used the M/S mix and reduced -25%. Since I was still getting a flatter response, I used the Expand Stereo Image preset and came out with what I think is one of the best recordings I have ever made. Need to learn more. If only I knew what all the settings did. Look forward to more M/S recordings. Guess this solidifies that I will probably never sell my 414XLS.