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Author Topic: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?  (Read 4567 times)

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Offline optimisticpessimist

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Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« on: September 06, 2009, 01:06:44 PM »
Last night I taped a local show as a favor for a friend.  Since I had no vested interest in the band, I've been taping a lot lately and have a backlog of shows, I decided I'd keep this recording simple.  One source, 16/44.1... just to save time and keep things easy on myself.  Afterwards, however, I found out the band might be interested in my recording to splice with a video recording they made.

Now I know that 16/48 are the typical audio specs for splicing with video.  My question is, if I resample my 44.1kHz recording to 48kHz, what, if any, are the repercussions?

Offline Gordon

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2009, 05:05:29 PM »
I do this a lot for dvd authoring where the audio was 44.1

it'll be just fine.
Microtech Gefell M20 or M21 > Nbob actives > Naiant PFA > Sound Devices MixPre-6 II @ 32/48

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Offline ghellquist

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2009, 01:02:59 AM »
Most video editing programs eat 44.1 as easy as 48 nowadays. No need to resample in that case. Otherwise, simply do it.

// Gunnar

Offline Gordon

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2009, 01:35:07 AM »
Most video editing programs eat 44.1 as easy as 48 nowadays. No need to resample in that case. Otherwise, simply do it.

// Gunnar

the program will play/process 44.1 but if the end result is a dvd it needs to be 48 (or 96).  vegas etc will save as 48 but I prefer to properly resample in wavelab etc.
Microtech Gefell M20 or M21 > Nbob actives > Naiant PFA > Sound Devices MixPre-6 II @ 32/48

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Offline optimisticpessimist

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2009, 12:23:03 PM »
Yeah I had already created the resampled file, and it sounds fine and whatnot.  I guess I'm just curious about the technicalities behind it.  I have a file with 44100 samples per second, and I'm asking Wavelab to turn it into a file with 48000 samples per second.  Where do the extra samples come from?  Intuitively it doesn't make sense.

Offline ghellquist

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2009, 08:11:33 AM »
I guess I'm just curious about the technicalities behind it.  I have a file with 44100 samples per second, and I'm asking Wavelab to turn it into a file with 48000 samples per second.

This can be explained at several different levels of technical details. I will do my best to not do the most naive description, but it will definitely not be the full truth. One way to describe it is by talking about the computer algorithm used. The problem with that is that there are actually several different ways to implement the algorithm, and the full truth will not fit into this answer.

First: let us look at the 44100 samples per second. We know that this is only a description of a sound, not the actual sound. The actual sound will only start to exist once it has passed the DA converter. It is like the bits in a .jpg file that is not the picture, the picture comes when you show it on screen or on paper. This comes from an science area called sampling theory that, as witnessed a lot on the net, is a bit too easy to misinterpret. I will try to stay out of those traps here.

Two: we might be looking at it as a DA followed by an AD. This is actually how it is done a lot in the mastering world. Put the signal out to a really good DA-converter. Then create a new file using an AD converter at the new sampling rate.

In order to keep the sound quality both the DA and the AD has to be good. Can we emulate this in software? Sure we can.

Three: a very naive implemenation might be like this. We first translate the input signal into a really good one. How can we know when it is good enough? Let us say that it should have a really high sampling frequency. What about 2116800000 ? The good thing about that frequency is that it same as 44100 x 48000. This would mean that every sample in the 44100 signal will have to create 48000 samples in the new higher frequency. A really naive implementation would simply copy over the bits to a large array. This would be our DA part of the conversion.

Once we have this very high sampling frequency we simply "resample" it using our AD. Take 44100 samples, add them up and calculate the mean value. This is one new of the output samples at the new frequency.

Four: there is however a small problem we have to deal with. The output signal will have spurios noise in it. The reason is that our "perfect" signal at 2116800000 will have some noise at higher frequencys, that is above the 20000 Hz or so we could find in our original file. We need to remove these higher frequencys by using a low-pass filter. Doing a low pass filter in software is easy, making one that sounds good is more complicated but can still be done. So inbetween the AD and the DA we now add a low-pass filter. Actually all real-world DA-s and AD-s has low-pass filters so we are not really destroying the analogy.

Five: of course this is not really how the algorithm is programmed. If nothing else it would be very slow and use a lot of memory. But nowadays computers have both speed and memory which makes it less of a problem. But I leave that to the reader as an exercise ;-)  There are shortcuts you can use, maybe selecting only the frequency 21168000 as the good signal. This is 441 x 480 x 100.

// Gunnar


runonce

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2009, 09:45:13 AM »
Now I know that 16/48 are the typical audio specs for splicing with video.  

Correct me if Im wrong...Isnt the 16/48 thing a DVD playback spec. Unless this is specifically for a DVD disc format - it might not matter.

Isnt any sample rate fine for web video? (avi, divx, youtube, etc...)


Offline optimisticpessimist

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Re: Resampling from 44.1 to 48 for use with video?
« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2009, 10:17:17 AM »
^  Well I'm assuming they will be putting it onto a DVD.

I'm sure for web video you are correct, though.

 

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