Become a Site Supporter and Never see Ads again!

Author Topic: 12 Gauge Microphones  (Read 9260 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Bradley802

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2011, 08:20:23 PM »
Thanks for the info!

I do have the specs that are associated with the capsule I'm using and plan on making it available as soon as I update my website with the addition of my cardioid model, I honestly didn't expect these things to blow up like they did in the short amount of time they did.

But really these mics aren't made to replace you're neumanns, they're for the lowender like me who wants to get their song in their computer regardless of specs. With of course the added bonus that it looks like a shotgun shell...


Offline Church-Audio

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (44)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 7565
  • Gender: Male
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2011, 10:49:29 PM »
Thanks for the info!

I do have the specs that are associated with the capsule I'm using and plan on making it available as soon as I update my website with the addition of my cardioid model, I honestly didn't expect these things to blow up like they did in the short amount of time they did.

But really these mics aren't made to replace you're neumanns, they're for the lowender like me who wants to get their song in their computer regardless of specs. With of course the added bonus that it looks like a shotgun shell...

I think it would be really cool if your polar pattern plot was a target :)
for warranty returns email me at
EMAIL Sales@church-audio.com

Offline Bradley802

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #17 on: May 03, 2011, 07:28:55 AM »
I really do appreciate all your input and advice, and I've tried to make it a point not to make any claims that I'm a seasoned microphone engineer. These little omni's are nothing more than one of my DIY mics that happens to sound nice and that people seemed to really connect with and enjoy, hence the website to handle the orders.

I feel that my quoted statement is true however, and without getting into an argument, viewing both the schems for the balanced circuits pin 1 and either 2 or 3 are connected to the same terminal on the element. That's all I was saying and I feel you were reading to deep into the statement.

Furthermore I think you're missing the big picture, IT LOOKS LIKE A SHOTGUN SHELL. If what you say is true (not seeing my actual circuit), and my mic kills batteries in 6 hours then I suppose they shouldn't be a go-to for location recording, which I'm positive isn't the reason people are buying them. They're a novelty that happen to sound really nice on certain things. I've had numerous orders from people stating that they're making them permanent talkback/room mics because of their sound and appearance.

Anyway, thanks for all the criticism and I look forward to using you're advice to better my future endeavors. Concerning "withdrawing my product" I'll have to respectfully decline. I've sold over 100 of the RED12 mics with 0 complaints, concerns, or issues.

Thanks again,
Brad Martin

Offline Church-Audio

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (44)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 7565
  • Gender: Male
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #18 on: May 03, 2011, 08:53:24 AM »
I really do appreciate all your input and advice, and I've tried to make it a point not to make any claims that I'm a seasoned microphone engineer. These little omni's are nothing more than one of my DIY mics that happens to sound nice and that people seemed to really connect with and enjoy, hence the website to handle the orders.

I feel that my quoted statement is true however, and without getting into an argument, viewing both the schems for the balanced circuits pin 1 and either 2 or 3 are connected to the same terminal on the element. That's all I was saying and I feel you were reading to deep into the statement.

Furthermore I think you're missing the big picture, IT LOOKS LIKE A SHOTGUN SHELL. If what you say is true (not seeing my actual circuit), and my mic kills batteries in 6 hours then I suppose they shouldn't be a go-to for location recording, which I'm positive isn't the reason people are buying them. They're a novelty that happen to sound really nice on certain things. I've had numerous orders from people stating that they're making them permanent talkback/room mics because of their sound and appearance.

Anyway, thanks for all the criticism and I look forward to using you're advice to better my future endeavors. Concerning "withdrawing my product" I'll have to respectfully decline. I've sold over 100 of the RED12 mics with 0 complaints, concerns, or issues.

Thanks again,
Brad Martin

If ground and Pin 2 or 3 Are connected to ground directly then its NOT a balanced circuit. Furthermore it should if you are running unbalanced tie pin 3 to ground. Why because every console on earth is pin 2 hot pin 3 Neg.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2011, 09:29:19 AM by Church-Audio »
for warranty returns email me at
EMAIL Sales@church-audio.com

Offline Bradley802

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2011, 09:10:43 AM »
In my microphone pins 1 and 3 are not connected directly, they are indeed separated by other components, and I wasn't suggesting the schems on the mentioned link are indicating it was a straight shot from the pins to the capsule. I was merely saying they DO eventually connect to the same terminal on the element, separated by components of course, and I think maybe my statement from gearslutz was taken out of context. I apologize for any confusion! Thanks again for all your comments!

Offline Bradley802

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 6
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2011, 10:30:01 AM »
If your product has an uneven phantom draw, that is a serious problem.  Unbalancing the DC current in a transformer causes saturation which increases distortion.  A nondiscriminating engineer might not notice or care, but it causes the preamp to fail to perform as designed.

First off I want to reestablish that I am in no way an electrical engineer, nor have I ever claimed to be, and therefor completely respect the knowledge and experience of the 3 preamp manufacturers voicing their concerns. However the above quote I deeply disagree with because I don't necessarily view saturation or distortion as a "serious problem." I can absolutely hear the saturation in the acoustic clip I have on my site, and its partly why I like the sound of these mics.

I'm not trying to pull the wool over anyone's eyes. It is what it is, and there is a clip of the audio for everyone to hear.

Furthermore I would be honored to have my mics put in the same category as the karmas and Blondies. Teppei Teranishi of Thrice, a musician and engineer I deeply respect, raves about the blondies and used them on hugely popular recordings. (I beleive the blondies are unbalanced?) If you're implying that the microphones are not "professional" because they are not balanced or perhaps because they make preamplifiers saturate and distort the way "they weren't designed to perform" then I'm afraid I would have to disagree. I've yet to hear a comment with a concern that they will actually do physical damage to the preamp and until I do I see no reason to change the circuit.

Once again I am in no way trying to be confrontational, and I know that in text sometimes comments can be taken the wrong way. I deeply appreciate all the comments and help everyone has given, I just happen to enjoy the way my mics sounds and am happy that some others do too.

Thanks,
Brad Martin

Offline chris319

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 142
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #21 on: May 05, 2011, 11:41:10 PM »
I say let Michael Joly come up with a $300 mod for it ;D

Offline chris319

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Taperssection Regular
  • **
  • Posts: 142
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #22 on: May 06, 2011, 12:16:10 AM »
I say let Michael Joly come up with a $300 mod for it ;D

 ;D I don't think Joly designs circuits though, he mostly seems to do mechanical mods and component swaps.

I bet he could find an old Neumann preamp design to throw in there. That and rip out a layer of mesh from the head basket. Oh wait, it doesn't have a head basket!

Offline goodcooker

  • Trade Count: (24)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 2450
  • Gender: Male
  • goes to 11
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #23 on: May 06, 2011, 01:31:07 PM »
OK dude, whatever.  I am trying to give you free expert mic design assistance, but you are going off on that ol' GS-style appeal-to-audio-engineering authority if a famous audio engineer says it is true, then it must be true; all saturation is good, even if the "engineer" can't predict or understand when or why it occurs . . . and next, what, cable capacitance and lack of common mode rejection as a virtue?

The quote I posted above about the K-Micro being "very good, very directional"?  Famous engineer.  Except it isn't directional at all (except above about 10kHz, which is true of all omnis) and its distortion is . . . let's just say not euphonic.

I could go on, but those would all just be anecdotes.  I prefer scientific measurement . . .

Enjoy it while you are flavor-of-the-month, it is fun if you can scale production with demand.  If you are really crazy, you can even do it for a living!

Jon,

I respect your opinion, admire your work and use your products but this statement came across as really condescending and rude. This guys mics are obviously made for the cool factor as he so clearly stated. If they are being used as talkback mics and such he doesn't really need to improve them. Ease up on the guy.

edit: I understand why you would not want the niche market you vend in to be perceived as a joke or gimmick product since your mics are professional quality tools.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2011, 01:34:28 PM by goodcooker »
Schoeps MK41 > nBob > PFA || MBHO KA300 > PFA
Aerco MP2 || RAD MS2
Marantz PMD706 || PMD620

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/goodcooker

"Are you the Zman?" - fan at Panic 10-08-10 Kansas City

"I don't know who left this perfectly good inflatable wook doll here, but if I'm blowing her up, I'm keeping her." -  hoppedup

Offline hi and lo

  • Trade Count: (29)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 2286
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #24 on: May 06, 2011, 02:35:21 PM »
If I am an ass for saying that, so be it.

nah.. you're just passionate! We all appreciate your advice, even when it's not what we'd like to hear. :)

Offline Gutbucket

  • record > listen > revise technique
  • Trade Count: (13)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 12131
  • Gender: Male
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #25 on: May 06, 2011, 02:57:51 PM »
Jon I just want to say thanks for your openess and willingness to share your expertice even with those who seem not to care to further improve their understanding.  For those us of who take the time to look beneath the surface and choose to place our trust (and spend dollars) with those who design well thought out and properly engineered gear, people like yourself are an increasingly rare breed.  Please don't give up on us!

FWIW I also agree completely with Jon's assesment of GS, which is why I tend to spend far more time around here.
volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values | numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
made easy- >>Improved PAS table<< | made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline Chuck

  • Trade Count: (41)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 10480
  • Gender: Male
  • time between the notes...
    • My recordings on the LMA
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #26 on: May 06, 2011, 03:54:37 PM »
X2 on the GS site. There is lots of good info over there, but trying to carry on an science based conversation about audio is nearly impossible anymore.
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: (2) Microtech Gefell M300, (2) AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, (2) CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and sub-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), (2) Audix M1290-o, (2) Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, (2) Naiant MSH-1O, (2) Naiant AKG Active cables, (2) Church CA-11 (cardioid), (2) CAD C9, (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod), Denon DTR-80p

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline leehookem

  • Trade Count: (3)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 4439
  • Gender: Male
    • Texas Tapers
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #27 on: May 06, 2011, 04:01:47 PM »
Jon I just want to say thanks for your openess and willingness to share your expertice even with those who seem not to care to further improve their understanding.  For those us of who take the time to look beneath the surface and choose to place our trust (and spend dollars) with those who design well thought out and properly engineered gear, people like yourself are an increasingly rare breed.  Please don't give up on us!

Well said. 
« Last Edit: May 06, 2011, 04:04:57 PM by leehookem »
www.texastapers.org


AKG c480b ck61/ck63 > Tascam DR-70D
Oade ACM Marantz PMD-671
AKG ck61/63 > NBob Actives > Naiant PFA > Tascam DR-70D
Oade ACM Marantz PMD-671
Audiophile 2496 > Mytek Stereo96 DAC > Sony MDR-7506
Dual 1229 > Marantz 2270 > Kimber Kables > Cerwin Vega VS120

Canon Rebel XSi, EF 50 mm f/1.8, EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS

Offline Todd R

  • Over/Under on next gear purchase: 2 months
  • Trade Count: (29)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *****
  • Posts: 4874
  • Gender: Male
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #28 on: May 06, 2011, 05:27:48 PM »
That was a lot to type when nobody is going to read it :(

I read it.  :)

And as usual enjoyed reading the in-depth technical discussion.
Mics: Microtech Gefell m20/m21 (nbob/pfa actives), Line Audio CM3, Church CA-11 cards
Preamp:  none <sniff>
Recorders:  Sound Devices MixPre-6, Sony PCM-M10, Zoom H4nPro

Offline Church-Audio

  • Site Supporter
  • Trade Count: (44)
  • Needs to get out more...
  • *
  • Posts: 7565
  • Gender: Male
Re: 12 Gauge Microphones
« Reply #29 on: May 06, 2011, 05:59:33 PM »
OK I did not want to do this but I am announcing a new product. Its the New Church Audio 50 CAL BMG CAFS stealth.

With the new CAFS STEALTH gone are the issues of getting mics past security. With a slew rate faster than the speed of sound and a frequency response of 2k to 6.8932k these mics have a very low distortion of less than 12% at 85db. The can also be fired from a gun and "sent to a friend" with a 3 mile range. Notice the capsule mounted at the back like a firing cap. Is it a bullet is it a mic no its both!
for warranty returns email me at
EMAIL Sales@church-audio.com

 

RSS | Mobile
Page created in 0.27 seconds with 42 queries.
© 2002-2018 Taperssection.com
Powered by SMF