Topic: hyper advice

[jibooer]

Hey now! 
Got my hands on some akg hypers and going to take 'em out for the first time tonight, prolly run DINa. I would like to use them in combination with another pair of mics for a 4-channel mix in case I can't get a SBD patch.

Location will be DFC, 10-15' from stage, PA's flanking corner of small 20' wide stage @7-8'up. The band is Elephant Stone, and is your traditional rock outfit with the exception of a sitar.

My question is what should I use for the other set of mics - an X/Y single-point AT-822, or CK1x's?

Thanks for your time.

[achalsey]

Is this the room?
 
http://divanorange.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/P1010499___.JPG

I'd use the CK 1Xs in the same pattern just to see how they stack up against each other.  If you're doing it to mix together though, I'd run cards onstage if possible.

[acidjack]

I'm generally in the camp - after experimenting some myself - that this 4-mic mixing stuff up on a stand from the same place is kind of pointless.  I had this debate with a buddy today.  To me, unless something is vastly different in the sonic character of one mic, combining them just makes kind of a mess.  Here, you have two good pairs of AKGs.  Combining them together won't really make them sound better.

If you insist on doing it, I'd use the hypers more like a center channel and run them almost a-b or at most PAS, not in DINa. In DINa you're making them even more redundant with the CK1x. 

FWIW my favorite 4-mic mixes are either omnis + hypers - to give the hypers a controlled amount or room noise - or the DPA 4021/KM150 mixes Dan Lynch used to do.  The ORTF 4021s plus the extremely crispy and direct sound of the 150s pointed almost dead ahead was a nice contrast and gave the 150s a nice character while still getting that great direct sound they get.  Even though this is technically "wrong" I think it worked.  When I've run, say, 4 channels of Schoeps or other mics by the same manufacturer, I've been less pleased.

I'd definitely not throw in that AT822; I'm pretty sure it's just flat out inferior to your AKGs.

[jibooer]

Yep, that's the spot. I am hoping to set up at the 2nd table from stage centre.
Thanks for ideas. Never did stage recording there for amplified music....we'll see I guess.

[page]

this 4-mic mixing stuff up on a stand from the same place is kind of pointless.  I had this debate with a buddy today.  To me, unless something is vastly different in the sonic character of one mic, combining them just makes kind of a mess.  Here, you have two good pairs of AKGs.  Combining them together won't really make them sound better.

I heartedly agree.

If you want to mix 4 channels, at least mix two pair that aren't even close to each other in the room. Stuff on the same pole or right next to each other is a waste to me cause what you gain in sonic adjustments, you lose in phasey mush.

[F.O.Bean]

I cant wait to run mk41 and mk21 but i dont combine the two sources

[jibooer]

Much appreciated. I like to throw in omnis as much as possible, and have had great results as well. Just taking hypers out for the first time, and the omnis will have to stay home tonite. Anyway, since I got the toys, might as well play.

Once I get them fancy active cables, should be more advantageous...
 

Nope you definitely do not get much of a sonic benefit by combining two sources of the same pattern/spacing, and I have tended to almost ignore one or the other source and have used only what parts of it I could salvage to mixdown, but at least it gives you a good comp. and another source. I think that's what I'll strive for tonite.

[F.O.Bean]

Trust me, run DINa/DIN if youre FOB/DFC!!! If youre farther back or off center, Point At Stacks

[audBall]

Check out Fig 5, p. 6 of this PDF as it may help with your setup:
http://www.microphone-data.com/media/filestore/articles/Stereo%20zoom-10.pdf

Fixed angles across the board have a tendency of limiting the versatility of our rig's potential. Granted, the above PDF might be more useful when recording unamplified acoustic sources rather than a PA.

[page]

Check out Fig 5, p. 6 of this PDF as it may help with your setup:
http://www.microphone-data.com/media/filestore/articles/Stereo%20zoom-10.pdf

Fixed angles across the board have a tendency of limiting the versatility of our rig's potential. Granted, the above PDF might be more useful when recording unamplified acoustic sources rather than a PA.

The Williams doc should be required reading for anyone who is interested in consistently bringing their A game.   

[F.O.Bean]

I ALWAYS Bring my A game and I dont read SHIT

[page]

I ALWAYS think I Bring my A game and I dont read SHIT

fyp

[F.O.Bean]

I ALWAYS think I Bring my A game and I dont read SHIT

fyp

Just tryn to lighten the mood For real tho, I record every show like its my last

[page]

For real tho, I record every show like its my last

fair enough, fair enough. I won't dispute that. 

[F.O.Bean]

For real tho, I record every show like its my last

fair enough, fair enough. I won't dispute that. 

Ive been REALLY into the hobby since around 2002 even tho my first recordings were in 1994 In 2002 I got "SERIOUS" about the hobby, and my passion for it is more than its ever been I see myself taping until I can no longer do it physically