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Author Topic: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording  (Read 7456 times)

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Offline justme

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Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« on: September 13, 2019, 12:07:29 PM »
The Tentacle Track E

The audio recorder is nearly as small as the Timecode Sync Generator Sync E
Does not need a Sync E device to operate – can easily function as a stand-alone device
Uses 32 bit floating technology for a significantly enhanced dynamic range
An input limiter and a high-pass filter guarantee for pristine recording quality

Tentacle Sync Track E Pocket Sized Audio Recorder

The Track E is the newest addition the Tentacle Sync family. The audio recorder is nearly as small as the Timecode Sync Generator Sync E, so it can easily fit in your pocket for recording on the go. This allows mobile operation for example as a recorder for a clip-on microphone eliminating the need for a radio-link. It offers timecode synchronization over bluetooth based on the well established Tentacle Sync technology. This means that the Track E will work in environments where regular wireless transmitter fail. Controllable through an app for iOS or Android, it seamless integrates into the Sync E synchronization network by the push of a button via bluetooth. But the Track E does not necessarily need a Sync E device to operate – it can easily function as a stand-alone device. As soon as the device is turned on, it will be recognized by the Tentacle Sync app and can be configured wirelessly.

The Track E uses 32 bit floating point technology for recording the audio for a significantly enhanced dynamic range. This means that the volume of the recorded audio doesn’t matter. Audio that was recorded too quiet, can be raised in volume to the desired volume without raising the noise floor. 32 bit floating point also means that no digital clipping will occur, making the Track E a versatile set-&-forget-device that will always deliver high quality audio.

"With the Track E users can treat audio in a similar way as photographers use the RAW camera photo format – all details can be adjusted in post production, significantly reducing the preparation time before you start shooting. We designed the device specifically with YouTubers, documentary or wedding filmers in mind, who don‘t want to miss the perfect timing for a shot, just because they need to adjust something on their recorder. But even large-scale production can benefit from the Track E as a no-frills backup device,“ says Ulrich Esser Co-CEO of Tentacle Sync and developer behind the Track E.

The Track E uses a changeable SD card for recording the audio. An input limiter and a high-pass filter guarantee for pristine recording quality. A screwable mini jack connector offers maximum security for connecting microphones. The Track E features adjustable plugin power for supporting a wide range of microphones. A free license of Tentacle Sync Studio is included with every Track E purchase.






Two in sync and you have a sweet setup.
Let’s hope there will be a 2 channel to follow.

Release early next year they say.

https://www.pinknoise-systems.co.uk/tentacle-sync-track-e-pocket-sized-audio-recorder.html

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2019, 04:01:50 PM »
again they are a bit too generous with the marketing on this

The Track E uses 32 bit floating point technology for recording the audio for a significantly enhanced dynamic range. This means that the volume of the recorded audio doesn’t matter.
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Offline justme

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2019, 04:15:31 PM »
Yes indeed.
32-bit float are some very holy bits for the moment :)

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2019, 04:47:01 PM »
esp with handheld gear like this that likely doesnt have a super low noise floor on the input
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Offline udovdh

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #4 on: September 17, 2019, 02:29:55 AM »
Another device with that 32-bit Zoom technology.
Also two ADCs?
What would I need o do stereo?
Cable? This timesync stuff?

If I need an 'app' to use these I am out.

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #5 on: September 17, 2019, 02:53:40 AM »
as a "bodypack recorder" this will almost certainly not be available in the US due to patent issues
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Offline edda64

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2019, 11:45:13 AM »

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2019, 05:57:56 PM »
The price is right at ~250. It seems to kick the shit out of the Lectrosonics PDR in every area including the ability to run DPAs at full power. (if it powers 406x  correctly it should also be able to run full caps with the MMP-G).

I don’t think the sync-E would really be necessary for our purposes because it doesn’t really lock the clocks it just ‘timecode jams’ (kinda syncs the start of them and then they’re on their own clocks). He was boasting about how good the clocks are so perhaps just two units by themselves would clock close enough for the usual hour or two we need.

They are a small kickstarter company. I think we should all write them and tell them how we would all gladly buy a two channel unit. Glad that B&H has this listed on their site it suggests zaxcom wont be able to squash em

theres some good discussion at jwsound, including the niche for a 2-channel device. lets write em!

https://jwsoundgroup.net/index.php?/topic/34301-tentacle-sync-track-e-new-minirecorders-with-timecode/
« Last Edit: September 17, 2019, 06:57:44 PM by jerryfreak »
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Offline udovdh

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #8 on: September 21, 2019, 09:10:33 AM »
Two channels.
Start/stop button.
(are level controls even needed?)

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #9 on: September 21, 2019, 10:13:09 AM »
 hard to say that as some have mentioned everybody has their own implementation of how to address the 32 bits dynamic range in terms of multiple processors in parallel etc. It would be fairly easy to gear it towards your typical Mic sensitivities and cover the whole range up to max SPL but if you were putting anything with a line signal in I would expect to pad it to mic level or consumer unbalanced line level

again it’s a black box at this point hard to say
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #10 on: September 21, 2019, 10:14:12 AM »
(dupe please delete)
« Last Edit: September 23, 2019, 03:21:19 AM by jerryfreak »
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Offline IronFilm

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #11 on: September 22, 2019, 04:21:43 AM »
Someone spied "#stereo" on their promotional material, so maybe it is not a mono recorder??

None the less, I'm quite excited by this!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBW5MBbi-uc

Offline Niels

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #12 on: September 22, 2019, 11:15:18 AM »
Someone spied "#stereo" on their promotional material, so maybe it is not a mono recorder??

I asked on their Instagram feed, and they said mono, unfortunately.
Throw a request for stereo their way if you would buy a 2 channel unit - I did. Perhaps they didn’t realize there’s a demand.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #13 on: September 22, 2019, 11:19:13 AM »
Someone spied "#stereo" on their promotional material, so maybe it is not a mono recorder??

I asked on their Instagram feed, and they said mono, unfortunately.
Throw a request for stereo their way if you would buy a 2 channel unit - I did. Perhaps they didn’t realize there’s a demand.

^
I also asked them for a 2 channel unit...  We'll see.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2019, 09:27:38 AM by dactylus »
hot licks > microphones > recorder



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Offline IronFilm

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #14 on: September 23, 2019, 12:16:37 AM »
Even just having stereo recording like the Tasam DR10L does (with a 2nd channel at a lower gain) would be fantastic for those who want to stick with a 24bit workflow instead of leaping over to 32bits

Offline aaronji

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #15 on: September 23, 2019, 02:53:25 PM »
Even just having stereo recording like the Tasam DR10L does (with a 2nd channel at a lower gain) would be fantastic for those who want to stick with a 24bit workflow instead of leaping over to 32bits

Not for most tapers who record live music and want actual stereo...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #16 on: September 29, 2019, 10:20:12 PM »
another youtube vid that seems to imply they have their own timecode generator in each one, so youd only need the phone app, not a separate sync-E to sync multiple units

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azAwB4CTTYE 
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Offline adrianb

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #17 on: September 30, 2019, 03:43:25 AM »
Even just having stereo recording like the Tasam DR10L does (with a 2nd channel at a lower gain) would be fantastic for those who want to stick with a 24bit workflow instead of leaping over to 32bits

Not for most tapers who record live music and want actual stereo...

For that I'm inclined to think that the Roland R-07 with the safety track is the best "set it and forget it" unit for stealth.

If Tentacle (or anybody) brings out a small two channel 32-bit float recorder I'm buying it.
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Offline aaronji

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #18 on: September 30, 2019, 04:57:57 PM »
^ Personally, I don't really need a safety track. I am a pretty good judge of where to set my levels and 24-bit allows you to be pretty conservative. I would love a stereo version of this recorder, though, with its variable plug-in power. An 1/8" locking male to two microdot female Y-cable and a pair of 4060s with that would be awesome...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2020, 08:20:02 AM »
latest response to my query:

thanks for your interest our upcoming audio recorder: Track E. We are still refining the recorder and working hard to get it ready as soon as possible. We hope to release the final version of it at NAB this spring and start selling it shortly after NAB. We will let our customers know about any updates and news via Instagram, Facebook and our newsletter. So please stay tuned.

i told them to make a 2-channel 32-bit float recorder and they would sell a lot of them!
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Offline voltronic

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #20 on: March 22, 2020, 08:26:24 AM »
^ Personally, I don't really need a safety track. I am a pretty good judge of where to set my levels and 24-bit allows you to be pretty conservative. I would love a stereo version of this recorder, though, with its variable plug-in power. An 1/8" locking male to two microdot female Y-cable and a pair of 4060s with that would be awesome...

If that 1/8" stereo input could handle line level so you could use an external preamp or phantom box for full-size mics, it really would be a Lectro SPDR killer, as someone else mentioned.


Regarding safety tracks:

Aaronj, I don't recall if you own one of the new recorders that do 32-bit float or not, but I can tell you that since I have owned my Zoom F6, I am now firmly in the 32-bit float camp. 

It isn't always easy to set conservative levels.  I often record record wide / unpredictable dynamic range music, and I am often performing and cannot monitor levels.  I often had safety tracks save my bacon on 24-bit recordings.  Not any more.  32-bit float truly does mean the set level "doesn't matter" as the input level is fixed (at least on the F6) and you are only adjusting post-ADC.  Some of my recordings have levels way above 0 dBFS, but I just bring it down in post with no loss.  There was much hemming and hawing over how this would work in practice (with some very relevant concerns raised), but for me the jury is out.  I'm never going back.  The only thing you need to be concerned with at all is if the input stage can handle the hottest signal your most sensitive mics are cranking out.

In other words, there is zero reason I can see to have something like the Track E record in anything but 32-bit FP.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #21 on: March 22, 2020, 12:30:51 PM »
im sold on 32-bit as well, but more as a feature and not a game changer

theres no guarantee that the tentacle performs as admirably as the zoom or SD units

input noise and max input level is still a thing and sources need to be somewhat matched to the input
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Offline aaronji

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #22 on: March 22, 2020, 05:15:46 PM »
^^ For loud shows, I just set the gain on the recorder so that the output of the mics at max SPL (the 1% THD point, actually) will be just below the recorder's overload point. Then I put the limiter on for a little added safety. I have recorded disturbingly loud shows that way with no issue. For quieter shows, I up the gain but try to err on the conservative side. Frankly, I am pretty happy with my recorder and really don't see the need to change for the sake of 32-bit, even with SD's patented (and pretty clever, if I read the application correctly) method. By the time I feel the need to upgrade, they will probably all have this feature...
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Offline voltronic

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #23 on: March 22, 2020, 09:28:13 PM »
^^ For loud shows, I just set the gain on the recorder so that the output of the mics at max SPL (the 1% THD point, actually) will be just below the recorder's overload point. Then I put the limiter on for a little added safety. I have recorded disturbingly loud shows that way with no issue. For quieter shows, I up the gain but try to err on the conservative side. Frankly, I am pretty happy with my recorder and really don't see the need to change for the sake of 32-bit, even with SD's patented (and pretty clever, if I read the application correctly) method. By the time I feel the need to upgrade, they will probably all have this feature...

I probably wouldn't have changed anything if I was in your situation either.  I was not saying you should make a switch; just how this new setup has made life much easier for me due to the nature of my recordings.  We all do what works best for us, right?
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Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #24 on: March 22, 2020, 09:38:58 PM »
BTW NAB is cancelled i wonder if they will still launch in April?
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Offline tim in jersey

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #25 on: March 23, 2020, 04:39:56 AM »
Two channels.
Start/stop button.
(are level controls even needed?)

Third buttom. HOLD. So it jusn't get knocked off...


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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #26 on: March 23, 2020, 05:18:51 AM »
this site listing 3/31 release date, prob a pre-order as B&H has 'early june' listed for availability. Gotham says 'end of may'

https://www.pinknoise-systems.co.uk/tentacle-sync-track-e-pocket-sized-audio-recorder.html
« Last Edit: March 23, 2020, 05:44:18 AM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #27 on: March 23, 2020, 12:21:26 PM »
this site listing 3/31 release date, prob a pre-order as B&H has 'early june' listed for availability. Gotham says 'end of may'

https://www.pinknoise-systems.co.uk/tentacle-sync-track-e-pocket-sized-audio-recorder.html

I think the only real answer is: Whenever worldwide manufacturing and transportation is back to running at close to normal so we can source the parts we need to build things.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #28 on: March 23, 2020, 07:37:49 PM »
We all do what works best for us, right?

That's the way I look at it!

In general, given the wide dynamic range of some modern recorders, like the first generation MixPres or the F8, it is pretty easy to record the full scope of pretty much any live music event (even a highly dynamic symphony played by a full orchestra in a live setting is usually quoted as around 70 - 80 dB, call it 90 if you assume a preternaturally quiet audience and a super loud performance) with 20 or 30 dB of headroom available in 24-bit. So it comes down to what you are comfortable with. Personally, I view at is being kind of like an automatic versus a standard transmission. The automatic is easier and you don't ever have to worry about grinding gears or stalling, but it is not as much fun as driving a standard and (perhaps) you might be able to get a little bit better performance from the standard if you do it right...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #29 on: March 23, 2020, 08:21:39 PM »
yeah, for our purposes, literally any modern converter from this century with over 110 dB dynamic range is more than adequate with a little forethought. its more about understanding your gear (mic sensitivity, preamp output levels, etc) and matching it at least a little bit

32bit is a good feature but not really a panacea. may save the odd take for someone who seriously messes up, but our understanding and control of out inputs is generally within a certain range

auto vs manual tranny is a great analogy!




We all do what works best for us, right?

That's the way I look at it!

In general, given the wide dynamic range of some modern recorders, like the first generation MixPres or the F8, it is pretty easy to record the full scope of pretty much any live music event (even a highly dynamic symphony played by a full orchestra in a live setting is usually quoted as around 70 - 80 dB, call it 90 if you assume a preternaturally quiet audience and a super loud performance) with 20 or 30 dB of headroom available in 24-bit. So it comes down to what you are comfortable with. Personally, I view at is being kind of like an automatic versus a standard transmission. The automatic is easier and you don't ever have to worry about grinding gears or stalling, but it is not as much fun as driving a standard and (perhaps) you might be able to get a little bit better performance from the standard if you do it right...
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Offline IronFilm

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #30 on: May 01, 2020, 02:29:56 AM »
^ Personally, I don't really need a safety track. I am a pretty good judge of where to set my levels and 24-bit allows you to be pretty conservative. I would love a stereo version of this recorder, though, with its variable plug-in power. An 1/8" locking male to two microdot female Y-cable and a pair of 4060s with that would be awesome...

If you're using this a bodypack recorder (and it looks like it would blow past any competition! Superior to the Tascam, and priced way way waaaaay under the Zaxcom / Lectrosonics products. Although... the new Deity TRX would now be tough competition for it!) then having a safety track mode would be fantastic.

If that 1/8" stereo input could handle line level so you could use an external preamp or phantom box for full-size mics, it really would be a Lectro SPDR killer, as someone else mentioned.

Regarding safety tracks:
<snip>
In other words, there is zero reason I can see to have something like the Track E record in anything but 32-bit FP.

Line level would indeed be a FANTASTIC option, perfect as a mini back up recorder I can feed a mix from my main recorder, light enough to even use for run&gun bag days.

However, is something else than 32bit needed? ABSOLUTELY! Too many productions have and expect a 24bit workflow. You can try fighting that if you wish at your own peril, but you likely have better battles to pitch your tent at, especially if you're just a day player. Is why I'd take a 24 bit "safety track" approach over 32bits in most scenarios for myself.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 02:34:58 AM by IronFilm »

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #31 on: May 01, 2020, 03:10:47 AM »
thanks IronFilm! few of us are in your field we probably wouldnt have seen those

both those products look interesting
the existing HD-TX (https://www.deitymic.com/hdtx/) is a good alternative to the tentacle at a similar price
pro tentacle: 5V PIP and 32-bit float
pro deity: 48V phantom and optional TX if needed

walkthough of HD-TX: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOpR1RLr5Eg
doesnt look like you can adjust levels once you start recording :(


as for the newly announced BP-TRX, its almost got the features of the lectrosonics SPDR for our purposes, though it would need a battery box to power most mics (not like the SPDR is all that on mic powering, but it can barely power CMRs and DPA 406x (both at higher noise than if they were properly powered). And of course the spdif input of SPDR is useless since it resamples everything
for $250 it looks pretty solid for a basic 2-channel recorder, with a ton of features we sont need but still cool to see bascially a universal SOC computer that can do so much
https://www.deitymic.com/bp-trx/



« Last Edit: May 01, 2020, 04:47:10 AM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #32 on: May 01, 2020, 09:17:14 AM »
If you're using this a bodypack recorder (and it looks like it would blow past any competition! Superior to the Tascam, and priced way way waaaaay under the Zaxcom / Lectrosonics products. Although... the new Deity TRX would now be tough competition for it!) then having a safety track mode would be fantastic.

Except I am not (or wouldn't be, anyway). Like most people here, I record live music. Given the choice of "stereo OR safety track", I would choose stereo a million times over. I guess "stereo AND safety track" would be cool, though.

Too many productions have and expect a 24bit workflow. You can try fighting that if you wish at your own peril, but you likely have better battles to pitch your tent at, especially if you're just a day player. Is why I'd take a 24 bit "safety track" approach over 32bits in most scenarios for myself.

People here are mostly their own "production". A lot seem to like 32-bit and, since they are controlling the whole process from start to finish, nobody is expecting a 24-bit workflow from them.

Tapers (for the most part) aren't doing sound for film. It'll seep in one of these days...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #33 on: May 01, 2020, 12:59:31 PM »
If you're using this a bodypack recorder (and it looks like it would blow past any competition! Superior to the Tascam, and priced way way waaaaay under the Zaxcom / Lectrosonics products. Although... the new Deity TRX would now be tough competition for it!) then having a safety track mode would be fantastic.

Except I am not (or wouldn't be, anyway). Like most people here, I record live music. Given the choice of "stereo OR safety track", I would choose stereo a million times over. I guess "stereo AND safety track" would be cool, though.

Too many productions have and expect a 24bit workflow. You can try fighting that if you wish at your own peril, but you likely have better battles to pitch your tent at, especially if you're just a day player. Is why I'd take a 24 bit "safety track" approach over 32bits in most scenarios for myself.

People here are mostly their own "production". A lot seem to like 32-bit and, since they are controlling the whole process from start to finish, nobody is expecting a 24-bit workflow from them.

Tapers (for the most part) aren't doing sound for film. It'll seep in one of these days...

I honestly wasn't thinking about a film/TV set workflow, so that makes sense why 24-bit is heavily favored.  Maybe that will change in the future; who knows?

I was thinking from the perspective aaronj laid out.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #34 on: May 01, 2020, 04:45:40 PM »
Tapers (for the most part) aren't doing sound for film. It'll seep in one of these days...

if taping ever became my job id probably find a way to hate it
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #35 on: May 02, 2020, 05:48:34 AM »
I reached out to Deity support with our usual wishlist for a 2-ch recorder (proper PIP voltage, spdif in, 32 bit float, BT remote, etc)

will be interesting to see if they have any desire to accomodate our niche market. even simply adding spdif input to a recorder of that size/price point would be a huge win
« Last Edit: May 02, 2020, 05:50:15 AM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #36 on: May 02, 2020, 09:12:02 AM »
Are there any handheld recorders out there with “proper PID voltage”?
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #37 on: May 02, 2020, 02:22:05 PM »
tentacle claims it will offer proper 5V

lectrosonics servo input manages 4V but my 4061s were decidedly noisier when used with it, relative to my d:vice

most lavs work fine with 3v pip for dialogue and other moderate spl sources
« Last Edit: May 02, 2020, 02:23:50 PM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #38 on: May 02, 2020, 06:55:57 PM »
Are there any handheld recorders out there with “proper PID voltage”?

The Marantz PMD620 provides ~ 5V plug-in power. Someone here measured it as slightly lower at some point (maybe 4.6V; sorry I don't remember exactly), but several tapers reported no problems powering DPA 4060/1s, which are pretty demanding. I have used that recorder with Sennheiser MKE2s many times with only one issue, which was a WAY louder than expected segment of a show. I might have been OK if I had the opportunity to turn the gain down a bit...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #39 on: May 02, 2020, 07:06:56 PM »
from what DPA has told me bias voltage is 2.75V

so PIP circuits should have in excess of this voltage when mics are plugged in

there are other factors (like adequate current primarily), but if your PIP is 2.3-2.7V like many handhelds with mics plugged in, its virtually assured that they will distort at some SPL less than the max under normal powering
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #40 on: May 04, 2020, 09:51:35 AM »
Are there any handheld recorders out there with “proper PID voltage”?

The Marantz PMD620 provides ~ 5V plug-in power. Someone here measured it as slightly lower at some point maybe 4.6V
I measured the PMD620 at 4.85V. Powered the DPA 4061 just fine.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #41 on: May 04, 2020, 02:27:23 PM »
4.85 w/mics attached?

i can measure my pmd661 (though i consider it a brick not a handheld)

i imagine with some varying resistance you could accurately determine the max current the input is set to provide ( by determining resistance, ie. 5V over 10k ohms, etc.)
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #42 on: May 04, 2020, 07:36:18 PM »
i can measure my pmd661 (though i consider it a brick not a handheld)

I may be mistaken, but I seem to recall that the 1/8" input on the PMD661 is line only, with no plug-in power.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #43 on: May 04, 2020, 07:37:45 PM »
I measured the PMD620 at 4.85V. Powered the DPA 4061 just fine.

Thanks! I did search for this, but I couldn't find the earlier posts...
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #44 on: May 04, 2020, 07:47:28 PM »
i can measure my pmd661 (though i consider it a brick not a handheld)

I may be mistaken, but I seem to recall that the 1/8" input on the PMD661 is line only, with no plug-in power.

well i guess ill have to measure my tascam brick lol
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #45 on: June 23, 2020, 08:09:31 AM »
If you're using this a bodypack recorder (and it looks like it would blow past any competition! Superior to the Tascam, and priced way way waaaaay under the Zaxcom / Lectrosonics products. Although... the new Deity TRX would now be tough competition for it!) then having a safety track mode would be fantastic.

Except I am not (or wouldn't be, anyway). Like most people here, I record live music. Given the choice of "stereo OR safety track", I would choose stereo a million times over. I guess "stereo AND safety track" would be cool, though.

Fair enough, fair enough, in my niche of the world we're rarely if ever recording stereo mics.


I honestly wasn't thinking about a film/TV set workflow, so that makes sense why 24-bit is heavily favored.  Maybe that will change in the future; who knows?

Will be a sloooooooooow transition before 32bit is demanded as *essential* from us.

Remember, there isn't even a single professional field recorder on the planet that does 32bit recordings at the moment!
(noooo... I'm not going to be counting the F6 or MixPre Gen2 series, they're semi-pro)

There are plenty of professional mixers still using the likes of a Cantar X2 / SD664 / 788T / Deva V / Nomad / etc... it will take years before everyone has transitioned off their current machines (or even their next machines, which likely won't have 32bit either, as we could well still be another generation away? Although, it is rumoured the Sound Devices 8 Series will get 32bit first via a firmware update)

And (except for drop bag scenarios) 32bit is not solving any problems that we've got.

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #46 on: June 23, 2020, 08:45:20 AM »
If you're using this a bodypack recorder (and it looks like it would blow past any competition! Superior to the Tascam, and priced way way waaaaay under the Zaxcom / Lectrosonics products. Although... the new Deity TRX would now be tough competition for it!) then having a safety track mode would be fantastic.

Except I am not (or wouldn't be, anyway). Like most people here, I record live music. Given the choice of "stereo OR safety track", I would choose stereo a million times over. I guess "stereo AND safety track" would be cool, though.

Fair enough, fair enough, in my niche of the world we're rarely if ever recording stereo mics.


I honestly wasn't thinking about a film/TV set workflow, so that makes sense why 24-bit is heavily favored.  Maybe that will change in the future; who knows?

Will be a sloooooooooow transition before 32bit is demanded as *essential* from us.

Remember, there isn't even a single professional field recorder on the planet that does 32bit recordings at the moment!
(noooo... I'm not going to be counting the F6 or MixPre Gen2 series, they're semi-pro)

Merging Anubis?
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #47 on: June 23, 2020, 09:04:22 AM »

Will be a sloooooooooow transition before 32bit is demanded as *essential* from us.

Remember, there isn't even a single professional field recorder on the planet that does 32bit recordings at the moment!
(noooo... I'm not going to be counting the F6 or MixPre Gen2 series, they're semi-pro)

Merging Anubis?

https://www.soundonsound.com/reviews/merginganubis

That isn't a professional field recorder.

There are only four brands active at the moment in usage on sets:
Zaxcom
Sound Devices
Sonosax
Aaton

You could potentially count a couple more:
Tascam (but they're inactive, having never updated their HS-P82)
Nagra (but arguably they're not active either, having not updated their Nagra VI. With the company seemingly forgetting about their film users, and instead focusing on the Hi-Fi audiophile)

Only the prosumer ranges are offering 32bit at the moment:
Zoom F Series
Sound Devices MixPre Series

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #48 on: June 23, 2020, 01:54:13 PM »

Only the prosumer ranges are offering 32bit at the moment:
Zoom F Series
Sound Devices MixPre Series

Didn't Paul mention at some point the the Scorpio and 8 series have the hardware to do 32-bit float recording, but it's not currently firmware-enabled?
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #49 on: June 23, 2020, 02:21:22 PM »
Yes he did I wonder why it hasn’t been enabled

perhaps as iron film is saying the market just doesn’t exist for it

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #50 on: June 24, 2020, 12:43:58 PM »
i see that B&H now has pricing for it on their page ($349) but no ship date

maybe they will make their june launch target, afterall
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #51 on: June 24, 2020, 06:20:37 PM »
i see that B&H now has pricing for it on their page ($349) but no ship date

maybe they will make their june launch target, afterall

I suppose that price is in line with their other products, but $700 for two channels is getting quite steep.  You could get yourself a used SD 702T for less right now - no 32-bit, but much better for pure audio recording.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #52 on: June 24, 2020, 06:30:26 PM »
^ Two of these are still a heck of a lot more stealthy than a 702, though. Especially in the era of wands and walk-throughs.

[EDIT TO ADD:] A stereo version would be awesome, of course...
« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 06:32:11 PM by aaronji »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #53 on: June 24, 2020, 06:39:30 PM »
^ Two of these are still a heck of a lot more stealthy than a 702, though. Especially in the era of wands and walk-throughs.

See, that's never been part of my world so I never even consider that aspect.  Good point, though.  Also, I realize that the nature of these Tentacle units means you never need to even look at them or set levels, so even better for that application.  If they ever made a 2-channel unit in a similar form factor, that would really be something.

I can't imagine getting something like a 702 into a venue, but I'm sure people have done it.
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #54 on: June 24, 2020, 07:29:38 PM »
let’s not get out ahead of our skis before we hear it. we’ve already demonstrated the lack of advantage of 32 bit vs 24 bit in the zoom thread...

in a unit this size it’s quite possible the input stage may be inferior to the other small stereo recorders on the market. remember its intended for newsshooters, for all we know it may overload quite easily
« Last Edit: June 24, 2020, 11:21:45 PM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #55 on: June 26, 2020, 07:53:59 PM »
Hmmm.  Newshooters might be particularly keen to have a unit which doesn't overload when bombs go off and bullets fly.  Perhaps they might be the user group needing wider dynamic range than anyone, and have the least time for level setting.  Just a thought.

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #56 on: June 26, 2020, 08:22:50 PM »
perhaps this will be the first 32 bit device to actual offer increased dynamic range. in that package size, i’m leery
« Last Edit: June 27, 2020, 12:22:39 AM by jerryfreak »
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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #57 on: July 10, 2020, 05:11:51 AM »

Only the prosumer ranges are offering 32bit at the moment:
Zoom F Series
Sound Devices MixPre Series

Didn't Paul mention at some point the the Scorpio and 8 series have the hardware to do 32-bit float recording, but it's not currently firmware-enabled?

I think Paul said something along the lines of it is theoretical possible and they might investigate into seeing if this could be enabled.

But the impression I got was that there was no promise of this happen, and definitely no timeline of when it might maybe arrive.

Because like I said, there is extremely small demand for this from the post side for a PSM to provide in a professional setting.

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Re: Tentacle Track E - 1CH of 32 bit FP recording
« Reply #58 on: July 10, 2020, 05:14:06 AM »
i see that B&H now has pricing for it on their page ($349) but no ship date

maybe they will make their june launch target, afterall

I suppose that price is in line with their other products, but $700 for two channels is getting quite steep.  You could get yourself a used SD 702T for less right now - no 32-bit, but much better for pure audio recording.

Hmmm... it is a fair bit more expensive than their other product: $229

But then again, there is nothing else on the market which is as small as this which provides TC recordings!! They stand out unique in this manner. So can't complain about the price?

Plus remember all the bodypack recorders with TC that they're competing against are many times more expensive! (except kinda the new Deity)

^ Two of these are still a heck of a lot more stealthy than a 702, though. Especially in the era of wands and walk-throughs.

See, that's never been part of my world so I never even consider that aspect.  Good point, though.  Also, I realize that the nature of these Tentacle units means you never need to even look at them or set levels, so even better for that application.  If they ever made a 2-channel unit in a similar form factor, that would really be something.

I can't imagine getting something like a 702 into a venue, but I'm sure people have done it.

Tentacles have always had a stereo output, I'm holding out hope it could be a stereo recorder??

Hmmm.  Newshooters might be particularly keen to have a unit which doesn't overload when bombs go off and bullets fly.  Perhaps they might be the user group needing wider dynamic range than anyone, and have the least time for level setting.  Just a thought.

Personally I see these as being a strong attack on the bodypack recorders market, which has always been a bit of a niche area in location sound due to the pricey price of them and also the constant threat of Zaxcom lawyers.

And having 32bits is fantastic for bodypack recorders because you can't adjust/monitor those levels once you've set it up to go.
« Last Edit: July 10, 2020, 05:17:14 AM by IronFilm »

 

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