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Author Topic: Acoustic Recording Techniques  (Read 1507196 times)

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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Acoustic Recording Techniques
« Reply #135 on: August 04, 2025, 05:41:28 PM »
Starting with Julian Lage immediately optimizes the talent factor!

Mounting the omnis under the stage lip essentially turns that pair into dedicated audience/room-facing mics (they'll still provide low frequency reinforcement in either position).  That can be good for providing more isolation of that stuff from the direct stage sound, which allows for mixing in more of it when appropriate and is where the level riding / compression of it described above can be best applied, or it can be a not so good thing if you are relying on the omni channels for pickup of some of the on-stage sound as you describe.

Regarding the level riding of that content, either done manually or automated, as described above-  I tend to simplify thinking about it to essentially targeting 3 different levels: An increased level of ambient / audience / room content between songs and during quiet passages, the standard amount you'd typically use in a mix if you weren't making further adjustments or automation of it, which probably gets applied to the bulk of the performance made at intermediate SPLs, and a reduced amount whenever things get loud enough to begin "overloading" the reverberant room acoustics, thus lessening the tendency for things to start sounding overly crowded and muddy.

No doubt that's rather advanced mixing strategy.  I'm sure some TS members reading this are rolling their eyes. Certainly no need to go that far unless you want to play around with taking things further to see how far you can optimizing a recording made in this way. There are plenty of other things you might optimize without doing this kind of post work.  I really only mention it because recording in the way you are doing makes it possible, its a cool thing to be aware of, and it can influence how you think about recording things moving forward.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2025, 05:43:55 PM by Gutbucket »
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Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to for the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: Version 4 provided in individual sections rather than a single booklet)

Offline voltronic

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Re: Acoustic Recording Techniques
« Reply #136 on: November 14, 2025, 07:40:52 PM »
Thanks to Earcatcher over on GS Remote Possibilities, I have been exploring an array he suggested based on Alan Blumlein's original 1931 stereo patent and later revisited by Michael Gerzon in the 1980s: Omnis at 22 cm spacing, 20 deg opening angle, and shuffling EQ in post. I'm quite happy with my latest results, and I think the imaging is quite accurate to real life (I sing in this choir so I know everyone's voices and where they were standing). It's certainly far more accurate than any other AB omni setup I've used. I'm surprised that this setup isn't used more often, but if not receiving the suggestion about it via DM I would have never thought to try it.

There's a lot of discussion in that thread on this, including links to research papers which show Blumlein actually had 20 cm omnis with a baffle in between. This array widens that to 22 cm and does not use a baffle.

https://gearspace.com/board/all-things-technical/1441717-blumlein-delta-shuffler-settings-2.html#post17620449

« Last Edit: November 14, 2025, 07:44:35 PM by voltronic »
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Offline rocksuitcase

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Re: Acoustic Recording Techniques
« Reply #137 on: November 14, 2025, 10:57:06 PM »
Thanks to Earcatcher over on GS Remote Possibilities, I have been exploring an array he suggested based on Alan Blumlein's original 1931 stereo patent and later revisited by Michael Gerzon in the 1980s: Omnis at 22 cm spacing, 20 deg opening angle, and shuffling EQ in post. I'm quite happy with my latest results, and I think the imaging is quite accurate to real life (I sing in this choir so I know everyone's voices and where they were standing). It's certainly far more accurate than any other AB omni setup I've used. I'm surprised that this setup isn't used more often, but if not receiving the suggestion about it via DM I would have never thought to try it.

There's a lot of discussion in that thread on this, including links to research papers which show Blumlein actually had 20 cm omnis with a baffle in between. This array widens that to 22 cm and does not use a baffle.

https://gearspace.com/board/all-things-technical/1441717-blumlein-delta-shuffler-settings-2.html#post17620449
brilliant!
Dig the photo of your array.
I read the shuffling part in the paper heathen rec'd, and had a double deja vu to a TS thread where it was discussed.
thanks for posting the GS thread.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Acoustic Recording Techniques
« Reply #138 on: November 17, 2025, 10:54:16 AM »
Will check out that GS thread.

I very much like what shuffling can do for a relatively narrowly spaced pair of mics, essentially making them sound wider-spaced at low frequencies (correcting for what would otherwise be an overly narrow spacing in that frequency range) while above the corner frequency where the shuffling is no longer active the narrower spacing is appropriate for the higher frequency range.  Otherwise can't really achieve both at once without using additional channels.  This achieves it with minimal complexity from a simple stereo pair - just need to apply the shuffling afterward in post.  To my ear, its a good alternate to using an additional mic or pair in the middle between a wide-spaced omni pair, since both approaches achieve similar low frequency behavior, only in different ways.

I'm reminded of your use of shuffling last winter, discussed earlier in this thread.  Interested folks can find that starting here- https://taperssection.com/index.php?topic=203942.msg2423527#msg2423527

I read the shuffling part in the paper heathen rec'd, and had a double deja vu to a TS thread where it was discussed.

I didn't realize it was this thread until I went back to look just now!
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to for the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: Version 4 provided in individual sections rather than a single booklet)

 

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