Topic: Newbie gettin' back into...

[hyperplane]

Even though it appears you've made up your mind, Lhmwrench, I'm going to second the vote to go for an iriver h120. You can score one off ebay for under 2 bills, and no media or batteries to purchase. And no software to use to get the recording onto your computer. Very easy setup to use, and very compact.

[poorlyconditioned]

cheap and impossible easier to transfer to pc: iriver 

Transfer to PC is pretty easy.  Sonicstage over the USB port.

I am in no way supporting Sony's repressive tactics in the past, and still holding over now in many ways.  But the fact is, Minidisc has the nicest interface and solid analog circuitry (preamp, line in) on these units.  Oh yeah, and long battery life (6-8 hours on a single AA 2500mAh battery).  They really are marvels of modern engineering as far as I'm concerned.

I think Edirol R09 may overtake MD if the mic and line are as good as we expect.

  Richard

[macroint]

I'm going to second the vote to go for an iriver h120. You can score one off ebay for under 2 bills, and no media or batteries to purchase. And no software to use to get the recording onto your computer. Very easy setup to use, and very compact.

Wasn't too long ago that any post asking for recorder advice would get, at least, one recommendation for the NJB3...why the lost love for the JB3? I love mine!

[Javier Cinakowski]

why the lost love for the JB3?

1, they do not make it anymore.

2, the ADC is poor

3. No mic pre

4. No support or firmware updates

5.  The iriver is very similar to the jb3

[Gawain]

yeah, Richard, I know about the MD advantages too  actually I was hesitating before get the H120 between it and a Hi-MD  they are solid, stealhty, not expensive and with a nice interface, I agree...but the media matter decided me (and also the look and can store 20-40GB on it...and rockbox!)...and now I couldn't be happier with my toy 

[Lhmwrench]

Thanks anyway thegreatgumbino but I'm gonna stick w/new...
Choice narrowed down to the  SONY-MZ-RH1 and the Sony MZ-M100...
The latter'll win cause I'll need it for a Sat. gig...

[svenkid]

lol,  I LOVE my jb3

[Lhmwrench]

Oh yeah, I forgot to add that every review of the IRivers TRASHED the product...to the letter...so...

[china_rider]

What he said... but I think that analog is only available at 44.1 unless I am missing something.  Also was able to get 2 recorders (one plus a back up) at less than $100 each
 on ebay.

[hyperplane]

why the lost love for the JB3?

1, they do not make it anymore.

2, the ADC is poor

3. No mic pre

4. No support or firmware updates

5.  The iriver is very similar to the jb3

windorabug, i am not arguing with you but i would like to point out that several of your stated reasons apply to the iriver.    if i'm not mistaken, it has the same ADC chip as the JB3. the H120/H140 are no longer made (and have not been in production for "at least one year" according to iriver when i called them a couple weeks ago).

as for firmware updates, i don't think that's a "necessary" thing so long as there is a stable firmware. for instance, i contacted Edirol late last year regarding any future firmware upgrades for the R-1, and they said the firmware was stable so there would be no further development for that product. not a huge deal, but it does seem reasonable that if a product has stable firmware - why upgrade/change it?


raoulduke - question: you say the iriver "has mic and line inputs, with the ability to add or subtract gain"... i might be going blind, but i only see one input (Line In / optical in) on the iriver. what did you mean by "mic input?"

also, according to latest reports, the iriver cannot do 16/48 kHz. just stating that so no one is mislead.

oh, and i still agree with raoulduke, i.e. no media costs and no battery costs really can save money. with the battery upgrade i performed, i can get over 12 hours of recording per charge up, and since i never tape festivals, this is more than ample for my needs of maximum 4 to 5 hours of recording in a single day.


now, poorlyconditioned (or anyone who can answer it) - i have a question about the newer MD units. when you refer to SonicStage and USB for transferring, is the transfer in "real time"? or is it more like 3 minutes for a 2 hour (~1.3 GB) recording? (that's how long it takes to upload from my iriver to my HDD... so i'm purely interested in knowing this info for knowledge's sake.)

[poorlyconditioned]

now, poorlyconditioned (or anyone who can answer it) - i have a question about the newer MD units. when you refer to SonicStage and USB for transferring, is the transfer in "real time"? or is it more like 3 minutes for a 2 hour (~1.3 GB) recording? (that's how long it takes to upload from my iriver to my HDD... so i'm purely interested in knowing this info for knowledge's sake.)

The newer HiMD units use USB to upload.  It is reasonable, but not super fast like the NJB3 firewire!  I would say about 3 or 4 times real time for PCM and about 10 times real time for ATRAC.  But pretty solid.

I'm glad to hear the iRiver optical is stable.  I might get one.  But what about the analog in?  Is there any hard drive noise like the NJB3?  Is there *real* analog gain?  Finally, how good is the ADC?  I'm inclined to think MD is better, but you never know.

As far as batteries go, I'm tempted to just get an external battery pack to augment the built in one in the iRiver.  I do that with the NJB3 now.

  Richard

[hyperplane]

The newer HiMD units use USB to upload.  It is reasonable, but not super fast like the NJB3 firewire!  I would say about 3 or 4 times real time for PCM and about 10 times real time for ATRAC.  But pretty solid.

I'm glad to hear the iRiver optical is stable.  I might get one.  But what about the analog in?  Is there any hard drive noise like the NJB3?  Is there *real* analog gain?  Finally, how good is the ADC?  I'm inclined to think MD is better, but you never know.

As far as batteries go, I'm tempted to just get an external battery pack to augment the built in one in the iRiver.  I do that with the NJB3 now.

  Richard

Thanks for that reply, Richard! That is very adequate transfer time for the MD with Sonic Stage software.

While using the rockbox firmware, it says it has up to 24 dB of <analog> gain and any gain above that is augmented by <digital> gain.  And in fact, there is an (A) while you're within the analog gain beside the dB amount of gain; and should you need to use digital gain and you add set the levels at higher than 24.0 dB, then a (D) will appear beside the gain amount.

One nice thing that isn't mentioned often about the iriver, IMO, is that you can set the gain for each channel individually. True, not often "needed," but say you aren't centered or mic sensitivity is a few dB difference... now you can set each channel individually.

I have listened to several recordings I've made with the iriver, in headphones, and I cannot hear HDD noise. FWIW, the only shows I've taped with the iriver have been fairly loud... so I have yet to test it with more quiet, acousitc (amplified or unamplified) music, but I'll get there.

IMO, the ADC of the iriver is decent. Yes, there is better out there. I ran the iriver head to head against the Edirol R-1 (which many people around here agree sounds very good), and thanks to china_rider for hosting (?) the sample:

http://www.aztapers.org/Test_iriver_vs_R1.flacf.zip

It's a .ZIP file with two FLAC files (total size = approximately 60 MB). I did not label which source is the Edirol R-1 and which source is the iriver. But I will happily tell anyone the answers via PM. I'd be interested in knowing what the so-called "golden ears" think of the comparison. [Note: certainly not my best recording, but the point is that it's a head to head, blind comparison between the ADC chips in the two units.]

[poorlyconditioned]

Thanks for that reply, Richard! That is very adequate transfer time for the MD with Sonic Stage software.

While using the rockbox firmware, it says it has up to 24 dB of <analog> gain and any gain above that is augmented by <digital> gain.  And in fact, there is an (A) while you're within the analog gain beside the dB amount of gain; and should you need to use digital gain and you add set the levels at higher than 24.0 dB, then a (D) will appear beside the gain amount.

One nice thing that isn't mentioned often about the iriver, IMO, is that you can set the gain for each channel individually. True, not often "needed," but say you aren't centered or mic sensitivity is a few dB difference... now you can set each channel individually.

I have listened to several recordings I've made with the iriver, in headphones, and I cannot hear HDD noise. FWIW, the only shows I've taped with the iriver have been fairly loud... so I have yet to test it with more quiet, acousitc (amplified or unamplified) music, but I'll get there.

IMO, the ADC of the iriver is decent. Yes, there is better out there. I ran the iriver head to head against the Edirol R-1 (which many people around here agree sounds very good), and thanks to china_rider for hosting (?) the sample:

http://www.aztapers.org/Test_iriver_vs_R1.flacf.zip

It's a .ZIP file with two FLAC files (total size = approximately 60 MB). I did not label which source is the Edirol R-1 and which source is the iriver. But I will happily tell anyone the answers via PM. I'd be interested in knowing what the so-called "golden ears" think of the comparison. [Note: certainly not my best recording, but the point is that it's a head to head, blind comparison between the ADC chips in the two units.]

Hey thanks hyper!  I'll download that and take a listen.  We need more of this, comparisons and analysis.  It is too easy to spout off on stuff we have not tested/confirmed.  Myself included

  Richard

[Gawain]

concerning mic in-line in: go to "recording", "recording settings", then to "source" and there you can choose in advance mic, line, or digital  (and all plugging in the same hole)

the HD noise...mmm...I had a little problem when I got mine and I heard some noise (while saving data), but now seems to be fixed, I don't hear nothing in the recordings.

[George]

I have listened to several recordings I've made with the iriver, in headphones, and I cannot hear HDD noise. FWIW, the only shows I've taped with the iriver have been fairly loud... so I have yet to test it with more quiet, acousitc (amplified or unamplified) music, but I'll get there.

I taped mmw at a small hall (kinda like a church) back in April.  It's stunning.  Lemme know if you would like a copy.

edit: as for HDD noise, I recall reading it was there when using iriver's firmware when recording.  I imagine this was corrected with rockbox since I haven't heard any HDD noise when listening back to some tapes.  I'll post some samples tonight of recordings I've made with my iriver.