Edirol R-09 input woes

[Nick's Picks]

IMO, yanking out the internal mics and wiring up a ta3 jack on each side.  one for "in" and while at it...one for "out".  its even close enough to the same diameter that it should fit easily.

thats what I'd do...if I still had one.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

Do NOT attempt to replace or bypass these jacks as there is a mechanical ground switch the deck uses to turn MIC/LINE jack ON when plug is inserted.  If you bypass or replace the jacks, the deck will not select anything external and use the internal mics ONLY.

Since that mod would remove the mics, selecting between them and the jack is not a consideration. The jack can be live all the time.

I haven't dug into the switchcraft parts and I don't know the exact terminology, but what about using a switched jack?  I remember those on many devices... insert the headphone and the speaker is cut, etc.

While I'd rather not install a selector switch, it is another option.... or just hardwire the deck to line in only.

I figure after this mod it'd be an r10.    Anything else that could push it to 11?

[guysonic]

Before you guys go on to 'fix' these jacks consider that Roland may have already placed low viscosity glue on the bottom BEFORE SOLDERING these down to the board.  If done right, the entire bottom side of the jack will be securely fastened down to the PCB with PROPER toughened 'instant type glue or epoxy adhesive and be ALMOST as durable as having the correct jacks with through-hole rivet posts.

Only way to tell if this has been done is to spot some of the glue from looking through the unused rivet holes from back of board or wait to see if the jack doesn't break off the board again in a year's time of using with the usual stress inducing plugs. 

Of course trying to unsolder and remove the jacks might also tell if these are now bottom-glued down, but then there's good chance of weakening or doing more harm than good to the delicate circuit pads.

Asking Roland about what might have been done with newer production runs to fix this problem is difficult in getting an answer from someone who really knows the production steps used in China when making these newer board versions.

[spyder9]

Was the problem ever nailed down to a certain production run or was it a design flaw?

I just got mine so I'm wondering.

They definitely had a problem with the first few batches.  Mine was retailed last August.  Edirol confirmed mine was from a flawed batch.  Edirol is a good company, so I am confident they'll take care of my situation.  I just hate waiting. 

On a side note:  I can definitely tell the difference between the R09 and R-1 when in my chain.  R-1's ADC sounds harsh when compared to the R09.  The bass is not as tight, either.   

Got mine back from Roland 2 weeks ago.  Everything is working fine.  No issues to report.  I use a Switchcraft RA now on my cable. 

Only complaint: weak packaging by Roland on the return shipping.  Looked like an eBay newb had boxed it up.  No bubble wrap or foam.  R09 was in a rubber band, wrapped with folded paper on one side (1.20 firmware instructions), placed in a box with heavy paper for padding.  It also had heavy tape residue on the back, which was NOT there when I shipped it out.  And I shipped it to them in bubble wrap.  I expect better from a company like Roland.

First 3 pictures is how I received my stuff from Roland.  The last 2 is how I received my stuff from AKG.   

[Gutbucket]

Before you guys go on to 'fix' these jacks consider that Roland may have already placed low viscosity glue on the bottom BEFORE SOLDERING these down to the board.  If done right, the entire bottom side of the jack will be securely fastened down to the PCB with PROPER toughened 'instant type glue or epoxy adhesive and be ALMOST as durable as having the correct jacks with through-hole rivet posts.

Only way to tell if this has been done is to spot some of the glue from looking through the unused rivet holes from back of board or wait to see if the jack doesn't break off the board again in a year's time of using with the usual stress inducing plugs. ...

It doesn't appear that Roland put any glue under the jacks on my replacement board - examining the unused rivet holes reveals nothing but clean plastic.  There is epoxy in there now.   

I cleaned the board & jacks with denatured alcohol and scuffed the surface of the jacks a bit, then mixed and applied JB Weld brand epoxy around the perimeter of the input jacks and to the mounting holes to secure them to the board. I had the JB Weld on hand and have used it for other projects in the past so I was familiar with it's working properties.  It's a high-strength 'slow cure' non-conductive epoxy, but does have 'fillers' of some sort added for strength.  Lacking toothpicks, I cut some matchsticks to make some nice pointy applicators.  The pointy matchsticks also worked well to herd and remove excess epoxy and keep it from covering the solder pads so that I can still solder on leads to other jacks at some point.  I was careful not to get epoxy in any of the openings in the jack housings, let everything dry overnight and reassembled this morning.  I'll try it out tonight.

[guysonic]

NO glue under the jacks from Roland is disappointing news.  Hard to believe at this late date.  Hoping to look at recently purchased R-09 run for something proactive to good repair service like the correct jacks or better glue BEFORE soldering these down in production.  Have a MOD-3 to do on one that may show something different being done, or not.  Let you know if there's any improvements found.

Gutbuckets gluing seems very clean.  I have not considered placing glue at the board's top edge around the input jack like he's done, and glue application on the sides of the jack seems a little too light to maybe not have enough surface to hold well.  Time will tell if this technique meets expectations.  Let us know down the road how this is holding up.

[Gutbucket]

...
Let us know down the road how this is holding up.

Will do.

The jack worked just fine over the weekend, I just have to mentally recalibrate my gain settings back to using line in vs. mic in.  I'll probably put a second layer if epoxy on the side areas.  I didn't want to go too heavy for the first layer to help keep the epoxy only where I wanted it and away from where I didn't.  I keep a short, low profile RT angle cable plugged in most of the time now anyway.

[Arni99]

can someone tell me HOW I can open my R-09?
after removing the 2 screws I can lift the upper half of the front cover but it seems to be stuck somewhere near the mics.
thx
arni

[Gutbucket]

can someone tell me HOW I can open my R-09?
after removing the 2 screws I can lift the upper half of the front cover but it seems to be stuck somewhere near the mics.
thx
arni

Halfway down page 3 of this thread.

[guysonic]

NO glue under the jacks from Roland is disappointing news.  Hard to believe at this late date.  Hoping to look at recently purchased R-09 run for something proactive to good repair service like the correct jacks or better glue BEFORE soldering these down in production.  Have a MOD-3 to do on one that may show something different being done, or not.  Let you know if there's any improvements found.

Did the MOD-3 (www.sonicstudios.com/pa_x.htm#mod3) on a newly purchased R-09 finding NO INDICATION of glue showing underneath the input jacks.  However, soldering on both the jacks to the board pads was top-notch excellent.  So like I've done in the past with MOD-3 service, the jacks also were epoxy'd down just to make sure they provide good reliable service for my customer.

At this late date, I can't help but hope we are just not seeing a reasonable amount of structural adhesive applied UNDERNEATH these input jacks before Roland's soldering operation.  Until I know they are doing something like this in manufacturing, AND it is holding these jacks reliably so the board isn't torn up in a few months of using, I will continue to glue these jacks down, and suggest everyone else considers doing the same if at all possible or use a jack externsion like that shown on the review page at www.sonicstudios.com/r-09revw.htm.

[cangurutopia]

I opened my R-09 today which I bought last December (Dec 2006). The jacks seem to be fastened to the board with some lucent glue. I think there is no picture of this kind here. I'm posting this picture just for an information.

I used R-09 for a couple of times and the Mic/Line jacks work well.

I'm considering to add some epoxy-glue around the jack as Gutbucket has done to his one.

[guysonic]

Unless I'm missing something, your photo shows NO glue whatsoever.

[cangurutopia]

I think lucent material over the terminals is glue.

I'm not specialize in electrics. If it's not glue, sorry for wrong informations.

[Nixoo]

Ohyeah, that's glue allright! I'm quite happy with this, since I don't dare opening up mine right now. It's not a lot of glue but seems enough to spread the strain over a larger area, so less chance of loosening. Kinda good news, thanks for your efforts!

[it-goes-to-eleven]

Great photos of the little dabs!

In this case, I don't think a dab will do ya...  That film layer just seems too thin to do much.  I'm wondering if they touched up the solder pads on a re-work station and the film is just a protective sealant?