Topic: Is there a decent mid-price option?

[yousef]

I've probably been here long enough to know better than to ask such a vague question but I'm going to ask anyway...

Over the last six or seven years I've moved from MD to DAT to Iriver to Microtrack and have been less than overwhelmed since the move away from my trusty old D8.

I picked up a Denecke AD-20 a little while back in the hope of inproving my MT recordings but find the thing a little too bulky for most of the shows I tape. And I've got the impression from a couple of comments on here that the AD-20 isn't really much of an improvement on the MT's ADC anyway.

Soooo I reckon I need a new (pocket-sized) recorder. The R09 seems to be the budget choice at the moment but I don't like some of the things I've heard about build quality, the lack of digi-in and am a little hesitant to go for another 'cheap' machine after grappling with the Microtrack's various idiosyncracies.

So, what next? Is there a realistic option amongst the mid-price machines such as the Sony D50, the Marantz PMD 620 and that new Olympus model? Or is it going to be better in the long-run just to splurge on something more expensive?

It probably speaks volumes that I can't even name any high-end recorders, let alone guess what one might cost...

Basically, I'm asking when the law of diminishing returns kicks in when looking at budget vs. quality of recordings and whether I might be better sticking with the MT for a little longer while I get the funds (and nerve) together to buy a much more expensive machine.

FWIW, I'm currently using a pair of off-Broadway DPA 4060s with a Soundpros BB.

Any thoughts on any of this (including the merits of running the AD-20 into the MT) would be most welcome.

[BayTaynt3d]

You need to set an upper limit on price, lol...

Then we can comment.

I own an R9, and H120, and recently picked up a Oade PMD660, and I'm liking that last option more and more everytime I use it. It's a little bigger than the other options, a little more expensive, and no digi in, only 16-bit, but I love it nonetheless.

[rastasean]

I am right there with you. It seems like the makers of these things are going away from what we tapers and people who buy this stuff want to something less expensive and slightly better than a tape recorder (I know that is not exactly true). The same is happening with camcorders. Go into any BestBuy and try and find a camera with mic in and headphone out without spending $2000. The camcorder I use has both of those and its high 8, I know its not minidv or high def but it at least has mic in and headphone out PLUS it was less than $800.

It seems like those who want serious equipment that will last a long time will have to drop the serious money, like DAT recorders used to be. There are a couple recorders I have in mind but I am not pleased with the lack of digital in. I know analog has been around for much of a longer time but the makers of these things should still listen to those who are willing to buy their product.

Maybe we just want too much for too little of a price.

[yousef]

You need to set an upper limit on price, lol...

Then we can comment.

I own an R9, and H120, and recently picked up a Oade PMD660, and I'm liking that last option more and more everytime I use it. It's a little bigger than the other options, a little more expensive, and no digi in, only 16-bit, but I love it nonetheless.

I guess my absolute limit would be around £500 ($1000) but I wonder if I might creep a little above that...

The PDM660 looks like a tempting option but I'm not too sure about spending that sort of money on a 16-bit-only device. Never gone above 16-bit thus far, but I'd like to future-proof myself a little. Also, being in the UK I'm a little wary of having to send gear across the Atlantic to get mods done. Although, would I be right in thinking that you just buy Oade-modded gear direct from Oade? In which case, what sort of premium do you pay for the PMD660?

Maybe we just want too much for too little of a price.

I suspect that this might be my problem. When I got my MT, I did get a feeling that it was more of a souped-up MP3 player than a serious recorder - it felt like a real step down from the D8. Which was hardly a fully-featured item to begin with....

Then again, the Sony looks like a possibility - I did like the sound of my D8 and some people here seem to swear by the preamps in Sony minidiscs, so perhaps that might be the way to go.

[rastasean]

I suspect that this might be my problem. When I got my MT, I did get a feeling that it was more of a souped-up MP3 player than a serious recorder - it felt like a real step down from the D8. Which was hardly a fully-featured item to begin with....

Then again, the Sony looks like a possibility - I did like the sound of my D8 and some people here seem to swear by the preamps in Sony minidiscs, so perhaps that might be the way to go.

That is a good way of describing the microtack devices. I mean, it even has a non-interchangable battery. What devices still use that anyway?!
For me, I am leaning towards the r-09 & the fostex fr-2LE with a mod. I would prefer if the device didn't have an internal hard drive. I have nothing against buying any kind of memory cards since you won't have to be replacing a hard drive.
I was looking at the PMD660 for a little while but I don't like th fact it is only 16 bit and $600 because as soon as I buy that, a 192 bit recorder will come out for the same price. haha. I know technology is ALWAYS being replaced but there has to be a happy medium where you and the technology can meet.
For me, I don't have a real need for the internal mics of the Sony D50.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

I have an mt and it is a poorly engineered and implemented product. So I'm never surprised to read complaints. I love my r09 and 722...

The r09 with a good pre in front is a Very good option... Haven't tried a 620 but the ability to take a hotter signal could make it better than the r09. The FR2LE looks good as an all in one. It remains to be heard if it is better than an r09 when run behind a pre-amp.

722/r09 comp:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,99237.0.html

[yousef]

722/r09 comp:

http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,99237.0.html

Looking forward to giving that a listen when my ears have had a rest this weekend.

I guess my big limiting factor here is the need for a device that will slip in and out of a pocket fairly easily; another reason why I'm leaning towards the Sony, even if if it does have those annoying built in mics.

I'm a bit suspicious of the 620 - it looks even cheaper and nastier than the MT on the photo and the 1/8"-only inputs don't really match up to what I'm looking for. Then again, if the sound is up to scratch, that's all that I need.

An Oade 660 is looking quite tempting though...

[flintstone]

You should take a look at the Fostex FR-2LE.  It's $600 most places, but it appears regularly on eBay for less than $425.  I purchased one, and am quite happy with it.  It's not a good choice for stealthy recording.  I think it sounds great stock, but if you care to upgrade, look to http://www.busmanaudio.com

Flintstone

[nickee]

I guess my big limiting factor here is the need for a device that will slip in and out of a pocket fairly easily; another reason why I'm leaning towards the Sony, even if if it does have those annoying built in mics.

An Oade 660 is looking quite tempting though...

The 660 isn't exactly shaped to go into pockets, but is great carrying around on your shoulder and is fun to use. A size comparison AD-20/660/R09 (yes I'm a slut!)...

[rastasean]

You should take a look at the Fostex FR-2LE.  It's $600 most places, but it appears regularly on eBay for less than $425.  I purchased one, and am quite happy with it.  It's not a good choice for stealthy recording.  I think it sounds great stock, but if you care to upgrade, look to http://www.busmanaudio.com

Flintstone

The more I think about it, the more I go back to this device. I would get a mod from the Oade people. I like it because it provides phantom power and because it looks rugged although it may not be.
How have you liked it for your use?

[yousef]

I do like the look of the Fostex but, as you say, I think it's possibly a little too bulky for low-profile taping. Ditto the 660 now I've seen the comparison photo - I must have misread a measurement somewhere because I'd imagined it to be just slightly bigger than a D8...

Thanks for all your thoughts - I think I'm leaning towards the the Sony now, pending hearing any horror stories about it in action.

Although it would be nice to have something a bit more substantial for open taping...

[nickee]

I do like the look of the Fostex but, as you say, I think it's possibly a little too bulky for low-profile taping. Ditto the 660 now I've seen the comparison photo - I must have misread a measurement somewhere because I'd imagined it to be just slightly bigger than a D8...

I had forgotten how big the D8 was...

[yousef]

I had forgotten how big the D8 was...

You really do have a lot of gear there, don't you 

[professorhalfbaked]

I'm a bit suspicious of the 620 - it looks even cheaper and nastier than the MT on the photo and the 1/8"-only inputs don't really match up to what I'm looking for. Then again, if the sound is up to scratch, that's all that I need.

In my opinion, the 620 is built much better than the MT.  I think most of the reviews/comments I have read agree.  But if 1/8" is a killer, than the 620, D50, R09, LS-10,and H2 are all out.  Maybe the MT2 or the Fostex are your best options?  Or just spring for that 702!   Sigh...

[seabrook]

Winfield Audio (http://www.wingfieldaudio.com/index.html) has sound samples of the flash recorders they sell.  Most are of acoustic music but the spoken word samples do reveal what background noise each deck adds.  In particuliar it shows why the Sony PCM-D1 is worth $1,849, easily trumping the PCM-D50.  But for stealthing the PMD-620 can't be beat with better mini-jacks over the Edirol R-09.  Meanwhile on the followup sound sample page there are few live jazz music samples to consider.

BTW, Winfield Audio sells the PMD-620 for pretty much what everyone else sells it for ($399 w/free shipping) but they also throw in high capacity Ni-MH batteries, a charger (w/12-volt car adapter) and a 2-Gb hi-speed SD card to help get you started.  I can vouch for them as I just got one from them.