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Author Topic: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)  (Read 28457 times)

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Offline (Evan)

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #90 on: March 24, 2009, 03:55:29 PM »
Has anyone made a mini preamp for these yet?

Offline Church-Audio

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #91 on: March 25, 2009, 12:24:22 PM »
Has anyone made a mini preamp for these yet?

I have made a preamp for the cmr its based on my ugly preamp it runs on two 9 volt batteries.
for warranty returns email me at
EMAIL Sales@church-audio.com

Offline Matt Quinn

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #92 on: March 26, 2009, 07:49:19 AM »
Has anyone made a mini preamp for these yet?

I have made a preamp for the cmr its based on my ugly preamp it runs on two 9 volt batteries.


Seriously? More info asap please! I'm about to pull the trigger on an N-Box,but seems like the CMR route could be a little cheaper, which would be great.
In: AT853>PMD620
Out: PC>Tascam US-1641>M-Audio BX8a

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My LMA Recordings

Offline Church-Audio

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #93 on: March 26, 2009, 10:16:03 AM »
Has anyone made a mini preamp for these yet?

I have made a preamp for the cmr its based on my ugly preamp it runs on two 9 volt batteries.


Seriously? More info asap please! I'm about to pull the trigger on an N-Box,but seems like the CMR route could be a little cheaper, which would be great.

It is my ugly preamp 00- 20db of gain two individual gain pots and its about 3x3x1 inch and takes two 9 volt batteries one for bias supply and one for the preamp.
for warranty returns email me at
EMAIL Sales@church-audio.com

Offline Chuck

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #94 on: March 27, 2009, 04:11:17 PM »
Jon recently built me a couple PFAs (his name for the voltage converter/ circuit balancer that fits into an XLR housing) for my Franken-Naks. The three wires per microphone configuration.

I had a chance to very briefly test the PFA's against my AT8533's. The audio output was much better than that from the AT8533's and the PFA's are smaller and lighter than the AT modules.
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: Microtech Gefell M300, AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, Sennheiser MKE 2 elements, CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and mod-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), Audix M1290-o, Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, Naiant MSH-1O, Naiant AKG Active cables, Church CA-11 (cardioid), (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlebox, Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Sound Devices MixPre-6, Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod)

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline Sunday Driver

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #95 on: March 29, 2009, 03:27:00 PM »
Jon recently built me a couple PFAs (his name for the voltage converter/ circuit balancer that fits into an XLR housing) for my Franken-Naks. The three wires per microphone configuration.

I had a chance to very briefly test the PFA's against my AT8533's. The audio output was much better than that from the AT8533's and the PFA's are smaller and lighter than the AT modules.

Do you know what the output voltage was? Was it less than 12 volts? I would love to replace my Nady CBM-40T adapters, pictured in this thread, with two of those.

Offline Chuck

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #96 on: March 29, 2009, 06:30:30 PM »
9v DC.
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: Microtech Gefell M300, AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, Sennheiser MKE 2 elements, CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and mod-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), Audix M1290-o, Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, Naiant MSH-1O, Naiant AKG Active cables, Church CA-11 (cardioid), (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlebox, Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Sound Devices MixPre-6, Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod)

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline Roger Gustavsson

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #97 on: March 30, 2009, 06:23:24 AM »
Jon recently built me a couple PFAs (his name for the voltage converter/ circuit balancer that fits into an XLR housing) for my Franken-Naks. The three wires per microphone configuration.

I had a chance to very briefly test the PFA's against my AT8533's. The audio output was much better than that from the AT8533's and the PFA's are smaller and lighter than the AT modules.



Aha, that is why you are selling your AT8533!

Roger

Offline Chuck

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #98 on: March 30, 2009, 09:44:49 AM »
Yeah. For me, it's a better solution.
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: Microtech Gefell M300, AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, Sennheiser MKE 2 elements, CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and mod-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), Audix M1290-o, Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, Naiant MSH-1O, Naiant AKG Active cables, Church CA-11 (cardioid), (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlebox, Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Sound Devices MixPre-6, Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod)

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #99 on: April 14, 2009, 04:18:47 PM »
i just did a bunch of comps last night

4v>cmr>church ugly>R09 line-in
4v>cmr>church ugly>R09HR line-in
4v>cmr>batt box>R09HR line-in
4v>cmr>batt box>R09HR mic-in lo sens
4v>cmr>batt box>R09HR mic-in hi sens
4v>cmr>batt box>R09 line-in
4v>cmr>batt box>R09 mic-in lo sens
4v>cmr>batt box>R09 mic-in hi sens

will upload when i can
in:
small: MK4/4V > CMR > V3 or J.Williams Mod MicMan Jr or no pre at all >AD2K/R07/PCM-A10/Oade Warm 661/DR100-MKIII

smaller: 4061/4099 CORE or 4011/4018V> d:vice MMA



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shop: Musical Fidelity VLink 192 Asynchronyous> coax> DAC1 > Rokit RP8 active monitors

Offline OOK

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #100 on: April 15, 2009, 08:02:11 PM »
Jon recently built me a couple PFAs (his name for the voltage converter/ circuit balancer that fits into an XLR housing) for my Franken-Naks. The three wires per microphone configuration.

I had a chance to very briefly test the PFA's against my AT8533's. The audio output was much better than that from the AT8533's and the PFA's are smaller and lighter than the AT modules.


HHHMMM very interesting......got any pictures......

Peace
OOK
DPA/HEB 4060's > R09HR
MBHO648/KA100Lk/KA200/KA300/KA500 > SD702

Offline Chuck

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #101 on: April 15, 2009, 08:53:41 PM »
I am very happy with the PFA adaptors I recently bought from Jon. As he said, everything is bult into Neutrik XLR connectors.

Here is a link to the PFA: http://www.naiant.com/studiostore/cleverdevices.html

I bought them to replace the AT8533 phantom power modules I had for my Franken-Naks. They are smaller and lighter than the AT8533's and don't use transformers for impedance matching.

Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.

Microphones: Microtech Gefell M300, AKG C 480 B comb-ULS/ CK 61/ CK 63, Sennheiser MKE 2 elements, CAD GXL1200 (cardioid and mod-cardioid capsule & electronics mod), Audix M1290-o, Micro capsule active cables w/ Naiant PFA's, Naiant MSH-1O, Naiant AKG Active cables, Church CA-11 (cardioid), (1) Nady SCM-1000 (mod)
Pre-amps: Naiant littlebox, Naiant littlekit v2.0, BM2p+ Edirol UA-5, Church STC-9000
Recorders: Sound Devices MixPre-6, Tascam DR-680, iRiver iHP-120 (Rockboxed & RTC mod)

Recordings on the LMA: http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/ChuckM
Recording website & blog: http://www.timebetweenthenotes.com

Offline dactylus

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #102 on: March 16, 2010, 02:26:12 PM »

...note for future reference in lightening those gear bags...

 ;)

hot licks > microphones > recorder



...ball of confusion, that's what the world is today, hey hey...

Offline NOLAfishwater

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #103 on: May 10, 2010, 01:21:46 PM »
I found what I was looking for
« Last Edit: May 10, 2010, 02:16:11 PM by NOLAfishwater »

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Schoeps CMR (mshilarious please enter!)
« Reply #104 on: February 02, 2019, 03:01:38 AM »
hey now!

time to revive this old dog of a thread as im about to order my lectrosonics SPDR which can power the CMRs directly (same front end as all the transmitters they make, which these are designed for)

so basically CMR specs look like this


lectrosonics front end looks like this
Dynamic mic: 300 Ohm impedance, 0.5 mV to 50 mV input level

Electret lavaliere: Input is virtual ground with servo adjusted constant current bias (very low impedance), Nominal 2 mV to
300 mV input level

Line level: 2.7 k Ohm impedance, 17 mV to 1.7 V input level



lectrosonics recommended wiring to mic-in as follows:

Quote from: lectrosonics
Schoeps shield to pin 1
Pin 4 jumped to pin 1 (shuts off servo bias)
Schoeps blue wire to pin 2 (+5 Volts)
Schoeps white wire to a 1.5k resitor in series with pin 3 (audio in) You can substitute a 500ohm resistor for the 1.5kohm resistor if you are looking for more gain.

i asked bernhard about this he said

Quote from: bernhard
"That resistor controls the gain. The smaller you choose it the higher the sensitivity of the input - but this may lead to overload for higher SPLs. We do not recommend to choose the resistor such small, we would use 3k3."

so basically if the resistor is too small it might (brickwall?) the input? in another email Bernhard said

Quote from: bernhard
any resistor in line with the mic in will increase the ground noise floor, so we recommend to keep it as low as possible, this means adapted to the maximum sound pressure level under your special recording conditions. We recommend not to choose too much headroom for this reason.

so we dont want to choose too high of a resistor and raise noise floor.

The lectrosonics claims a wide dynamic range (117 dB), but we have no idea how clean the pres are. so we dont want to put a big resisitor in line (noise) and then add a bunch of preamp gain (more noise).

Knowing that our application is the typical concert environment, max 130 dbA with 50-70 dB of dynamic range at best in a room, what would be a good resistor value? Again on mic in:
Dynamic mic: 300 Ohm impedance, 0.5 mV to 50 mV input level
cmr output level into lowZ input: something less than 0.56V (though CMR manual recommends minimum 5K impedance... i am confused


I asked Bernhard:


Quote from: jerryfreak
Lectrosonics provided me more information on the input impedance for the various inputs. i believe the CMR would be considered a dynamic mic. Do the numbers below help with resistor selection? ideally I want the dynamic range of the mic output to be a match for the recorder, in loud situations (80-130 dBA). I notice on the CMR spec it says max voltage of 0.56V at 2kohm, and 0.9V at 20 kohm. it also says minimum recommended input impedance of 5kohm (much higher than any of the transmitter's inputs). so in this case is the resistance additive? in other words if i add a 4.7K resistor to the mic in, is the effective impedance then 5K ohm?

If i went directly into line-in with impedance of 2.7K, it seems the max voltage of CMR would be slightly above 0.56V ( based on the 0.56V@2kohm, but possibly reduced from this as the mic is only getting 5V input).

I am not so concerned if the levels are very low going into the Lectrosonics unit, as the dynamic range of the Lectrosonics should exceed that of the mic by 30-40 dB

the reason i mentioned reduced output due to 5V input is because apparently the CMR can take 4V-10V, and has lower output at lower voltage, though bernhard couldn't quantify the difference between 4V and 10V when asked (i guess based on the widely varying input impedance of different devices). This is as much as he would say:

Quote from: bernhard
With a 10V supply it will have a higher output capability but will not reach the CMC's value. 4V are the absolute minimum requirements, the maximum output level is significantly lower already under these conditions.

.. no I did not measure it but following the schematics it is obvious. The precise value also depends on the load impedance. So to reach maximum level you should switch the following input to its highest impedance, if possible.

my battery boxes have always run directly off a 9V in the 7-8.5V range. i have no idea if the 5V provided by the lectrosonics circuit above will compromise performance





« Last Edit: February 02, 2019, 03:51:41 AM by jerryfreak »
in:
small: MK4/4V > CMR > V3 or J.Williams Mod MicMan Jr or no pre at all >AD2K/R07/PCM-A10/Oade Warm 661/DR100-MKIII

smaller: 4061/4099 CORE or 4011/4018V> d:vice MMA



out:
home:Benchmark DAC1 HDR > Dynaudio BM15A active monitors
shop: Musical Fidelity VLink 192 Asynchronyous> coax> DAC1 > Rokit RP8 active monitors

 

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