Topic: Wanting to replace my DAT...

[deviant]

I have an Sony PCM-M1 DAT, which has been a solid and reliable unit for many years. However, I would really like to move away from tape and moving parts. Late to the game I know, but ready none the less.

With the slew of recorders out there, I'm a bit at a loss of what to buy. Looking for some help...

Here are the facts...

1. I have $500.
2. 90% of the shows I tape are from the soundboard. I would really prefer something where the input can handle the signal without a preamp or attenuator. This is really the most important.
3. 10% are audience recordings, of which most are stealth, so unit size is important.
4. I would prefer 24/96.

The three that fit most of the criteria are the Sony PCM-D50, M-Audio Microtrack II, and Edirol R-09HR.

With how solid the PCM-M1 was, the PCM-D50 could be the perfect unit. But then, size is an issue, being 2 inches longer than the PCM-M1.

A friend has the Microtrack I, of which he had to add an attenuator to handle the sbd signal. Unfortunetly, it doesn't sound like the MT II is any better and with the balanced input issue, the MT II I think would be ruled out. I was really hoping this would not be the case.

I know little about the Edirol R-09. From what I've read here, people really seem to like it, at least with a preamp and mics. I haven't seen any feedback on how is the input is for a sbd signal. If it was good, I would feel comfortable getting the R-09HR. Any feedback would be great.

Are there others anyone would suggest?

Thanks a lot in advance for any opinions and help.

[SmokinJoe]

I have an R-09 (not the new one) and I have pulled quite a few soundboard tapes with it line in, and I've been very satisfied with the results.  I've never needed an attenuator or preamp.  There is a gain scale of 0-30, and I think I have used it from about 3 to 30 with satisfactory results.  One time I had a board feed that was too hot and had to ask the sound guy to turn it down a bit, but I think that would have been to hot for almost anything.

Only downside is that you can't adjust left and right levels separately. Hopefully the sound guy gives them to you balanced, or you just level it in post, which is what I had to do once.

At the risk of starting a holy war, I think many people will agree that the R-09 has the cleanest input section between the 3 you mentioned.

Most of what I have pulled SBDs for has been mixed with AUD, but it you can't find any samples I can dig you up raw SBD samples.

[Belexes]

With how solid the PCM-M1 was, the PCM-D50 could be the perfect unit. But then, size is an issue, being 2 inches longer than the PCM-M1.

Here's a photo comparison as I have 3 out of the 4 recorders mentioned in this post. (That's an R-09 and not the new HR model)

The D-50 looks to be about 1.5 inches more than the M1.  Since you won't be doing that much stealth, you may want to still consider the D-50.  If size is still an issue, the R-09 is wonderful.

[dgale]

I'm not sure about the other two as I haven't checked them out yet but one thing that bothered me about the R-09 is that it doesn't have a digital input...you have to rely on the internal A/D converter.  Not sure how high-quality it is but I'm always a bit dubious of a machine that small with built-in pre and A/D - I'd prefer a recorder that at least has the option of using a higher quality external A/D and just recording the digital feed.  Now obviously for it's size it's great for stealthing and I think they are pretty reliable...I guess I'd be interested if anyone has any insight into the A/D quality on these things.  I'd rather they 86'd the built-in mics and used the saved space for a digital input.

[seabrook]

If you're considering the R-09 then you should also look at the Marantz PMD-620 for its superior mini-jacks, display (OLED) and SD card access.  The noise levels of the line-in are excellent.  On the other hand, the MicroTrack II is not even viable until all its issues are resolved.

[sunjan]

If you're considering the R-09 then you should also look at the Marantz PMD-620 for its superior mini-jacks, display (OLED) and SD card access. 

QFT. Although it's only 24/48, I'd easily sacrifice 96kHz for better build quality. Tascam DR-1 also has similar specs to PMD-620.

Hey deviant, you didn't mention your mic setup for the stealth situations. Are you going for built-in's only?
For ultra-stealth, there's also LS-10 that does 24/96, although it's largely untested in the taper community, and I can't vouch for it's line-in.

[rowjimmytour]

What about the 660 and FR-2LE for all in one preamp/recorders. Might be a little bigger but others have stealthed these units and you would be set for a sdb patch. Plus both units can be Oades/Busman modded to improve performance.
Peace

[bonghitwillie]

get the r9.  i was in the same situation as you.  i have already made many audience recordings with the r9 and 1 sbd.  the sbd patch was really hot.  i think at line level i was around 5.  it sounded great.  i have 2650mah AA rechargable batts.  i get over 10 hrs recording time with them.  i have (2) 8gb sdhc and can record for a long time.  i was told to watch out for the input jack, so i am real careful.  the r9 might be a little hissy during quiet passages.