Topic: New Zoom?

[vegas06]

Some extremely interesting reports on the new Zoom can be seen at http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/naturerecordists/messages/36429?threaded=1&m=e&var=1&tidx=1 - though the bottom line of the reports is that the device did not appear to perform to the published spec and it was returned.

Nice find! I'll test the battery life with my broken in NiMH pair once they've recharged.  And I'll test those XLR flaws as well.

vegas06: What gain setting should I use to test the clipping level? The default (80/100) is extremely hot, and probably not the best for testing high SPL handling.  But you said that low gains make the sound muddy, so I'm not sure what to use...50/100?

For some reason my computer isn't allowing me to upload my audio files.  Mediafire keeps freezing when I try, and other hosting sites won't work either.  I'll try to get them up ASAP.

EDIT:
http://www.homebrewedmusic.com/2009/03/07/first-look-at-the-zoom-h4n/
http://www.bradlinder.net/2009/03/zoom-h4n-audio-take-2-second-time-not.html

My comment in regards to a L (low) gain setting was that the Zoom H2 has a 3 position recorder gain switch on the outside of the unit (L/M/H).  When ever you record a loud environment you have to have the Zoom H2 set to the L (low) gain setting, which I think is a -30 db pad,  or your audio will clip something nasty.  But when you apply the Low gain setting n the H2, the audio tends to get a bit muddy in the high ends.

I don't believe that the older H4 and the H4n have a the ability to internally pad the signal.  Thus you are relying on the new internal pres to hold up to the appropriate recording levels and not clip.  SO when you set your audio to record at 60-70 db or so, the audio won't clip.  That is as long as Zoom setup the internal pres to kick in before, rather than after the recorders gain setting. 

With the H2, the pre amps were set to kick in after recorder gain.  So no matter what level you had the H2 set to below 100, if you didn't have enough padding on your signal your audio would clip.  If you lowered your audio input levels you just get lower recorded clipped audio.

[bgalizio]

Just found out about this recorder. Looks very interesting to me... I was wondering if anyone could do a comparison with the Edirol R-09HR for line-in and internal mics. If the ADC is good and the internal mics aren't terrible, this could make for a quick and easy SBD/AUD matrix recorder.

Also, does anyone know if the Zoom H4N can take a hot SBD feed without an attenuator?

[dallman]

I saw the new Zoom out in the field. I was impressed with it's construction.

I do have a question: (I noticed it ate up batteries)

For external power does anyone know if the usb mini jack will work to supply power in the field, or must you use the standard adapter which the unit also has. Nowadays there are more and more battery packs that work with USB mini, so I am curious.

If anyone can test this it would be good to know.

[vegas06]

Just got the H4n yesterday.
Improvements have definitely been made over the previous H4 and even H2.

1. Improved, quieter pre amps. 
2. Input gain works as it should.  It seems that the pre amps were wired properly on the board, so input control does in fact raise and lower the gain input as it should, which can prevent clipping.
3. Solid bod construction.  Doesn't feel like a piece of puffed plastic.
4. Much larger and brighter screen.  Very easy to read.
5. Control layout is much improved, and access to items in the menu is much easier as well.
6. Built in limiters seem to function better and are more responsive.
7. Rotatable mic capsules are a welcome addition.
8. 1/8 mic input.  I wouldn't need it myself, but it's nice to have.
9. Ability to use built in mics along with dual XLR or 1/8 mic input.  Very nice, and very useful for my recording needs.

Shortcomings that I have noticed so far.
1. Mic elements are a bit thin, and too sensitive.  Their alright for a sub $400 recorder, but just an observation.
2. XLR inputs are still noisy.  They are much improved over the H4, but still a tad noisy.
3. No external L/M/H Gain control.  I liked this as an extra measure to prevent clipped audio.  Just have to be more careful during setup is all.
4. Not able to control L/R XLR channels independently.  At least not that I have been able to see so far.  You are able to control the oboard mic and XLR inputs separately while in 4 Channel record mode.  But you don't have access to control either left or right XLR input level gain.

All in all I am very happy with what I have seen so far form the H4n.  Just have to put it through some hard testing to see if it's a keeper for me.  Mind you this is compared to my Edirol R44 for multi track recording.

[dogmusic]

4. Not able to control L/R XLR channels independently.  At least not that I have been able to see so far.  You are able to control the oboard mic and XLR inputs separately while in 4 Channel record mode.  But you don't have access to control either left or right XLR input level gain.

Someone in another forum said that the latest System Update 1.30 gives you access to a mixer in 4CH mode. Can you check to see if that would allow individual record level control for each of the four inputs?

That would save this unit, if true.

Thanks,

PB

[vegas06]

Do you happen to have the link handy.
As this would be good news if so.

[heyitsmejess]

i thought i read in the manual that there is an option to record 4 mono tracks, instead of 2 stereo (l&r) tracks.

[vegas06]

i thought i read in the manual that there is an option to record 4 mono tracks, instead of 2 stereo (l&r) tracks.

I believe that this is only possible in Stereo mode, not 4 channel.

[dogmusic]

Do you happen to have the link handy.
As this would be good news if so.

http://www.2090.org/zoom/bbs/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=12670&p=129232#p129232

I have to change this from good news to same old news. Here's the latest from the poster who thought we could individually change record levels:

"Oops.
I am wrong.
I misspoke. You can pan L and R for mic or line, but it's still a stereo pair.
Sorry about that."
- ScottB


Oh well, maybe Zoom can still fix that with a future update.

[sunjan]

Cnet posted a test with samples on April 15:
http://news.cnet.com/2300-17938_105-10000726-1.htm

[vegas06]

Cnet posted a test with samples on April 15:
http://news.cnet.com/2300-17938_105-10000726-1.htm

Some pretty nice sound examples in a controlled environment.
Gives a nice example of how much improvement Zoom made in the H4n's pre amps.  And also a good example of what to expect from various onboard compressor/limiter settings.

[north300]

Just found out about this recorder. Looks very interesting to me... I was wondering if anyone could do a comparison with the Edirol R-09HR for line-in and internal mics. If the ADC is good and the internal mics aren't terrible, this could make for a quick and easy SBD/AUD matrix recorder.

Also, does anyone know if the Zoom H4N can take a hot SBD feed without an attenuator?

I am considering this recorder for similar purpose.  Anyone know about SBD recording with this one?  Do the bottom access XLR / TRS inputs accept SBD signal?
Thanks for you help.

Lou

[Walstib62]

I bought one of these. I knew I was going inexpensive, but I feel as though the unit is good for the price. The XLR inputs do need to be attenuated with higher mic SPL's or a line in. This requires a plug-in attenuator. Not a big deal. I haven't used the 1/8 in. mini with an ext. mic yet, but will soon. It only puts out 3Vdc, so a batt box is needed for any mic requiring a higher voltage.
The sound is pretty good, especially is you can keep the gain below about 30 or so. The input limiter will cause problems with a hot input, so it's best to run the levels at -12 dB with the limiter on. I haven't tried the auto gain yet, but it could be useful in a situation where being spotted checking levels would be a problem.
We'll see how long it lasts. I still have a Sony D3 DAT that I bought in 93-still works!