Topic: Stage Lip: Cards or Omnis?

[Dede2002]

I'm going to tape this show tomorrow night. I'll be almost on the stage, mics hat mounted ( instrumental band, no vocalist). The PA on this venue is composed by two gigantic speaker boxes ranging from the ceiling, like 12 feet above me and slightly behind my back. Question: cards or mics ( in this case HLSC-1 and HLSO-Micro - both Sennheiser based).
Thanks in advance 

[stevetoney]

Tough call actually.  Intuitively, I like omni's at the stage lip or on-stage because you like to pick up what's happening on the stage and not be limited by the directionality of the mic capsules.  However, if you feel that the ambience of the instruments from the stage will be drowned out by the volume of the gigantic PAs, then I'm not sure going with the omni's would add much presence because the PA volume would be predominant.  I've run stage lip before when the PA volume is really loud and my recording sounded like crap because it sounded like my mics were distant (which they weren't since the stage volume was low and the PAs were the major sound source that particular setup). In that case, I might opt to back up a little bit in the crowd, go with cards and point them at the PAs.  When you run omni's you always run the risk of picking up more crowd noise from behind, so you also have to take that into consideration regarding whether the volume of the PA speakers will predominate.  My point is that if you aren't gonna be picking up much stage presence with the omni's because of the volume from the PAs, then you might want directional mics to pick up the PA and cut down on the crowd.  However, if you expect that the volume from the stage is good and won't be drowned out by the giant PA speakers, then DEFINITELY go with the omni's and stand at the stage lip.

[Dede2002]

Tough call actually.  Intuitively, I like omni's at the stage lip or on-stage because you like to pick up what's happening on the stage and not be limited by the directionality of the mic pickups.  However, if you feel that the ambience of the instruments from the stage will be drowned out by the volume of the PAs, then I'm not sure going with the omni's would add much presence because the PA volume would be predominant.  I've run stage lip before when the PA volume is really loud and my recording sounded like crap because it sounded like my mics weren't pointed to the best sound source (which they weren't since the stage volume was low and the PAs were the major sound source that particular setup). In that case, I might opt to back up a little bit in the crowd, go with cards and point them at the PAs.  When you run omni's you always run the risk of picking up more crowd noise from behind, so that's what you have to balance in considering whether the volume of the PA speakers will predominate.  My point is that if you aren't gonna be picking up much stage presence with the omni's because of the volume from the PAs, then you might want directional mics to pick up the PA and cut down on the crowd.  If the volume from the stage is good, then DEFINITELY go with the omni's.

Thanks a lot for your reply. You have a good point, but I'm not sure about the volume stage quality.

[PH]

Since you said the mics are hat mounted, I really don't think it will matter all that much since they are going to be somewhat directional in any hat application.

[nameloc01]

O's.

[Dede2002]

Since you said the mics are hat mounted, I really don't think it will matter all that much since they are going to be somewhat directional in any hat application.

How come? I don't think I understood you.
Thanks for your reply  

[Dede2002]

O's.

Thanks, friend.
Any specific reasons for this choice?

[paulbaptiste]

a seated show?  I'd still probably run omnis' , if you have an idea of the artist/crowd/venue relationship.  If they will be respectful and such.  And as for omni's being hat mounted, that exactly how you want them to be, your head will act as a natural buffer.

But granted up front isn't always the place to be.  I taped The Gin Blossoms 3' from the stage, which wasn't the best sounding area, but it was for me to steer clear of the drunks.  The drunks came anyway, and i had lots of wine stains by the end of their set.  None of that last paragraph may have been useful.   

[nameloc01]

Well, if you're THAT close, I'd want to grab as much of the entire stage as possible. Now, there *may* be other factors in regards to the stacks, the crowd..but those are "unknowns and maybes"..and I,myself would just go for what I know for sure..that I want to get the whole stage.

[guitard]

There's a little joint that I tape at occasionally from the stage lip.  It's a 2-3 foot high stage, so when you are right there at the edge, the stage monitors are actually a few feet below and in front of you.  Of course, they are pointed back toward the band members, but you still catch a LOT of sound from them with a mic placed at head level.

Just another factor to consider ~ the importance of which is largely dependent on the stage setup.

[Dede2002]

Thanks everyone. Yes, it's a seated show. No drunks bumping around, but a lot of talking. That's what I'm trying to avoid. It's a music club for like 300 people. Also, I'm thinking about going stage lip because this venue is not exaclty known for it's sound mix. PA sounds, most of the time, muffled but not terribly loud. It's a Blues, R&B and Jazz club. This is a 4 piece band: 2 guitars, bass and drums. Sounds pretty much like Jim Weider's Project  Percolator.

[dean]

Tough call actually.  Intuitively, I like omni's at the stage lip or on-stage because you like to pick up what's happening on the stage and not be limited by the directionality of the mic capsules.  However, if you feel that the ambience of the instruments from the stage will be drowned out by the volume of the gigantic PAs, then I'm not sure going with the omni's would add much presence because the PA volume would be predominant.  I've run stage lip before when the PA volume is really loud and my recording sounded like crap because it sounded like my mics were distant (which they weren't since the stage volume was low and the PAs were the major sound source that particular setup). In that case, I might opt to back up a little bit in the crowd, go with cards and point them at the PAs.  When you run omni's you always run the risk of picking up more crowd noise from behind, so you also have to take that into consideration regarding whether the volume of the PA speakers will predominate.  My point is that if you aren't gonna be picking up much stage presence with the omni's because of the volume from the PAs, then you might want directional mics to pick up the PA and cut down on the crowd.  However, if you expect that the volume from the stage is good and won't be drowned out by the giant PA speakers, then DEFINITELY go with the omni's and stand at the stage lip.

What he said.   

[Dede2002]

Tough call actually.  Intuitively, I like omni's at the stage lip or on-stage because you like to pick up what's happening on the stage and not be limited by the directionality of the mic capsules.  However, if you feel that the ambience of the instruments from the stage will be drowned out by the volume of the gigantic PAs, then I'm not sure going with the omni's would add much presence because the PA volume would be predominant.  I've run stage lip before when the PA volume is really loud and my recording sounded like crap because it sounded like my mics were distant (which they weren't since the stage volume was low and the PAs were the major sound source that particular setup). In that case, I might opt to back up a little bit in the crowd, go with cards and point them at the PAs.  When you run omni's you always run the risk of picking up more crowd noise from behind, so you also have to take that into consideration regarding whether the volume of the PA speakers will predominate.  My point is that if you aren't gonna be picking up much stage presence with the omni's because of the volume from the PAs, then you might want directional mics to pick up the PA and cut down on the crowd.  However, if you expect that the volume from the stage is good and won't be drowned out by the giant PA speakers, then DEFINITELY go with the omni's and stand at the stage lip.

What he said.   

Thanks!

[Gutbucket]

What he said.   

Also.   

[stevetoney]

What he said.   

Also.   

What they said, about what I said.