Topic: SHURE WL184,185, WL51B, MC51B or SHURE BETA A/C !!!

[igene]

Looks like SHURE has stepped up their miniture game.
I'm looking at the specs on the mics and they don't look too bad.

They caught my eye and I'm curious about them.

The WL184(C) & WL185(SC) look like DPA 4021's
http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/other/wl183-wl184-wl185-dynamic-lavalier-microphones
The WL51B & MC51B are lav. mics.
http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/other/wl51-wireless-lavalier-microphone
http://www.shure.com/americas/products/microphones/other/mc50b-mc51b-lavalier-microphones

Does anyone know anything about them ?
Could be good for stealth ?

I've never been a Shure user or fan, but maybe they sound better now ?

[flipp]

A few years ago I looked at the MX series of the 18x caps (wired rather than wireless though both have 4' attached cables) and found there wasn't much info about them other than they were fairly popular with some nature recordists. Do a google search for the model# + nature recording and you should get several useful returns.

After looking into them I decided it would be at best a minor improvement over my EV-CO90s and for as seldom as I stealth or record nature decided to keep the EVs in my mic locker and spend the money on some LDs.

< I see individual replacement caps as well as capsule housings are now available seperately. Could be an interesting option for the DIYer. >

[Hypnocracy]

WL183,4,5 have been out since 2005? You would think someone has used them...

I like the look of the Omni response curve on the PDF below:

http://www.shure.com/idc/groups/public/documents/webcontent/us_pro_wl183_wl184_wl185_ug.pdf

I'm not knowledgeable on spec's. How do the numbers for noise and SPL hold up vs the AT853?


AT853's
U853PMWU
Frequency Response: 30Hz-
20,000Hz
Maximum Input Sound Level:
124dB SPL, 1kHz at 1% THD
Dynamic Range: 102dB, 1kHz at
max SPL
Signal-Noise Ratio: 72dB, 1kHz
at 1 Pa

[igene]

Well, it's electret vs. condenser

U853R Cardioid Condenser Microphone Specifications:

    ELEMENT: Fixed-charge back plate, permanently polarized condenser
    POLAR PATTERN cardioid
    FREQUENCY RESPONSE: 30-20,000 Hz
    LOW FREQUENCY ROLL-OFF : 80 Hz, 18 dB/octave
    OPEN CIRCUIT SENSITIVITY: —39 dB (7.9 mV) re 1V at 1 Pa
    IMPEDANCE: 250 ohms
    MAXIMUM INPUT SOUND LEVEL: 139 dB SPL, 1 kHz at 1% T.H.D.
    DYNAMIC RANGE (TYPICAL): 115 dB, 1 kHz at Max SPL
    SIGNAL-TO-NOISE RATIO: 70 dB, 1 kHz at 1 Pa
    PHANTOM POWER REQUIREMENTS: 11-52V DC, 2 mA typical
    WEIGHT (microphone): 0.5 oz (14g)
    DIMENSION (microphone): 1.34" (34.0 mm) long, 0.48" (12.2 mm) diameter
    CABLE: 25.0' (7.6 m) long (permanently attached to microphone), 0.13" (3.2 mm) diameter, 2-conductor, shielded cable with TA3F-type connector
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
SHURE MX Microphone Specifications:

Type  Condenser (electret bias)
Frequency Response  50 to 17,000 Hz
Polar Pattern  MX183: Omnidirectional
                    MX184: Supercardioid
                    MX185: Cardioid
Output Impedance  EIA rated at 150 ohms (180 ohms actual)
Open Circuit Sensitivity (at 1 kHz, ref. 1V/Pascal*)
                   MX183: -27.5 dB (42.2 mV)
                   MX184: -33.5 dB (21.1 mV)
                   MX185: -35.0 dB (17.0 mV)
    All settings -12 dB at 0 gain *1 Pascal = 94 dB SPL
Max SPL (1kHz at 1%THD, 1 k ohm load)
                   MX183: 116.7 dB
                   MX184: 122.7 dB
                   MX185: 124.2 dB
    All settings +6 dB at 0 gain
Equivalent Output Noise (A-weighted)
                  MX183: 20.5 dB
                  MX184: 26.5 dB
                  MX185: 28.0 dB

Signal to Noise Ratio (referenced at 94 dB SPL)
                  MX183: 73.5 dB
                  MX184: 67.5 dB
                  MX185: 66.0 dB
Dynamic Range at 1 k ohm load   102 dB 

Power Requirements  11 to 52 Vdc phantom, 2.0 mA
Common Mode Rejection  45.0 dB minimum
Polarity  Positive sound pressure on diaphragm produces positive voltage on pin 2 relative to pin 3 of output XLR connector.
Environmental Conditions   Operating Temperature Range: -18 to 57 degrees C (0 to 135 degrees F)
                                       Storage Temperature Range: -29 to 74 degrees C (-20 to 165 degrees F)
Cable   Shielded 1.2 meter (4 ft.) cable terminated with a 4-Pin Female Mini Connector (TA4F)

[igene]

most of these specs look better...and it's tiny

Shure MC51B  :
MC51  Measured with RPM626 Preamplifier

Type   Condenser (electret bias)   
Polar Pattern    Cardioid
Output Impedance   136 ohms actual (rated at 150 ohms)
Output Level  -46.0 dBV/Pa (1 Pa=94 dB SPL)
Maximum SPL   143 dB at 1% THD/1 kilohm load
Frequency Response   20 to 20,000 Hz   
Dynamic Range   108.0 dB
Output Noise   (equivalent SPL, A-weighted) 35 dB typical; 38 dB maximum
Signal-to-Noise Ratio   59 dB at 94 dB SPL
Power Requirements  11 to 52 Vdc (positive on pins 2 and 3, return on pin 1) Current Drain  4.6 mA
Polarity Positive pressure on the diaphragm produces a positive voltage at:   pin 2 relative to pin 3 of the output connector of preamplifier.
Overvoltage Protection   +/- 75.0 Vdc maximum from pins 2 and 3 to pin 1.
Cap and Overmold Material    Polypropylene
Environmental Conditions   Operating Temperatures: -18 to 57 degrees C (0 to 135 degrees F)
Storage Temperatures: -29 to 74 degrees C (-20 to 165 degrees F)
Humidity: 0 to 95%
Packaged Weight   305 g (10.76 oz.)   305 g (10.76 oz.)
Net Weight   121 g (4.3 oz.) with cable, connector, and preamplifier.   121 g (4.3 oz.) with cable, connector, and preamplifier.
Cable and Connector   1.5 m (5 ft.), small-diameter, shielded, with miniature female 4-pin connector (TA4F type).   
1.5 m (5 ft.), small-diameter, shielded, with miniature female 4-pin connector (TA4F type).

http://www.sesystems.com/Assets/ProductImages/Shure_MC51B.jpg

[igene]

what do you think of this Shure mic on paper, Beta 98 A/C
I'm looking at this one as well.

    Type: Electret Condenser
    Frequency Response: 20Hz-20kHz
    Polar Pattern: Cardioid
    Output Impedance: 179 ohms
    Sensitivity (at 1kHz, open circuit voltage): -48.0 dBV/Pa (4.0 mV)
    Maximum SPL (1kHz at 1% THD) 1,000 ohm load: 144dB
    Signal-to-Noise Ratio (referenced at 94dB SPL at 1kHz): 64dB
    Dynamic Range (at 1kHz) 1,000 ohm load: 114dB
    Common Mode Rejection (20Hz-20kHz): >50 dB
    Clipping Level (1kHz at 0.25% THD): 1,000 ohm load: 1.0dBV (1.26V)
    Self Noise (typical, equivalent SPL, A-weighted): 30dB SPL
    Polarity: Positive pressure on diaphragm produces positive voltage on pin 2 with respect to pin 3
    Connector: 3-pin XLR, male, balanced
    Power Requirements: 11-52Vdc phantom, 3.6mA

[igene]

so basically - small clubs not arenas.
Thanks.
Looks like same would go for the others small Shures.

That's kind of the application I was looking for.
The question is, what do they sound like ?
some have reduced low/high freq. pickup.
Some are 20-20 and have decent dynamic range & sensitivity.

Hard to know for sure w/o listening/ using them.

[illconditioned]

I've tried WL183 (omni) and WL185 (cardioid).  They are OK, but not great.  I would rate them a bit better than AT853, but not as good as Sennheiser KE40, for example.

The self noise (for some reason) is pretty low on the Omni but not as nice for the cardioid.

  Richard

PS: Any interest in buying them from me?  If so, send an offer...

[igene]

I ended up getting a pair of SHURE BETA A/C mics.
They are WAY smaller then I expected.

In the box > mic w/ clip, foam screen, shock mount, PFA and 25' cable [miniXLR to 4 pin miniXLR], SHURE vinyl zip bag.

I ran a bunch of tests w/ my livingroom stereo w/ different music (studio & live).
Tried a bunch of my preamps to see what would sound best.

Since the connection is miniXLR - I started with my CA-9100 w/ miniXLR.
It powers it up and sounds OK. Low output, but I expected that. (11-52V needed)

Then using the included cables and PFA I tried the bigger pre's.
The F5 TS-2 gives it lots of juice and has a high output.
This may be a good choice, I need to test further at a show.
PSP-2, sounded good, but low output @ 48V phatom.
I'm not sure why. It sounded pretty good though.
SD mixpre sounded best. Nice hi output. Clear & full sound.
I need to take this to a show to get a better idea.

That's all I tested for now.
Still need to test the X-2 & V-2.

So far, I think I made a good choice with these mics, but time will tell.

[illconditioned]

That beta98a looks like the same capsule as the wl18x, just a small phantom power adapter behind it.

I haven't tried my wl18x capsules recently, but I think the best mini cardioid mic is the sennheiser mke40, also sold by microphone madness, at approx $250/pair.

  Richard

[JLMoore3rd]

Here's a quite affordable option to the WL 183: Shure Microflex MX391... It is a boundary mic with the 183 inside. The biggest difference is that the internal 183 is straight-cabled, instead of a right-angle attachment. If you use them as boundaries, say on an array box, they have a lower self-noise (15dB) than if used open (around 20dB).

Oh, yeah... the affordable part: http://www.ebay.com/itm/310342713598 $28 each! (You might offer $25, which I did, and pick up a pair for $50!)

John "Alpha Flying Monkey" Moore