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Author Topic: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions  (Read 7043 times)

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Offline genesisoh

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TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« on: February 18, 2012, 08:42:24 PM »
Hi,

I would like to run two sets of mics into the DR-2D and get a separate recording for each mic.  My only experiences so far have not been in dual mode.  I basically ran a set of CA-14 omnis into a 9100 (set to 11:00 since I typically record loud music) and then into LINE IN.  I record in 24/48 and set the levels to 90 (I know this is rather low but I bring it up in post). 

I want to connect my CA-14 omnis and cards to the DR-2D.  Instead of a preamp (and in order to conserve space), I am going to use 2 battery boxes.  Does it make any difference which mic I hook up to LINE IN and which to MIC IN?  For MIC IN, what setting should I have for the recording level?  I am looking for something conservative that I can bring back up in post. 

If you have experience doing something like this with the DR-2D please give me some advice.  Thanks!!!
Mics: CA-14 cards and omnis
Preamp: CA 9100 (not currently in use - wanna buy it???)
Recorder: TASCAM DR-2D
Video: Sony hx9v; Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS3 (old faithful)

Offline genesisoh

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2012, 12:46:33 PM »
Anyone???
Mics: CA-14 cards and omnis
Preamp: CA 9100 (not currently in use - wanna buy it???)
Recorder: TASCAM DR-2D
Video: Sony hx9v; Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS3 (old faithful)

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2012, 01:28:29 PM »
Run the preamp into the line-input.  Set the line input level to about 95, any lower won't help with a hot signal- your levels will look lower on the display, but you will be overloading the input stage.  At level 95 at least the peak indicator will indicate overload properly.  If too hot, turn down the external preamp or use attenuators.  You can add gain with the external preamp without a problem if you need to.

Run the other pair of mics into the mic-input, with mic power turned on.  Mic input level 67 (menu set to low gain) is about the same level as line-in level 100.  I wouldn't go below something like mic input level 62 for the same reason mentioned above, but you can add as much gain as neccessary for good levels by raising the input level as required without fear.

How much gain you need depends on the sensitivity of the mics and the SPL of the music so I can't help there.  If the mics have the same sensitivity (I dunno if they do) then the omnis probably output a somewhat higher level signal since the're more sensitive in the lower bass and produce more ouput down there.   So if it's loud and you have the recorder set to those minimum gains already (line=95, mic=62) and are peaking on mic input with the omnis, you might swap them with the card to put the omnis through the preamp>line-in chain if the preamp lets you attenuate gain as well as add it (I'm not sure what the minimum gain on the 9100 is).

There are a few variables, you might try it both ways and see which works better, jsut keep the gains on the recorder at line=95/mic=62(set to low gain) or above.

Hope that helps.
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Offline Will_S

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #3 on: February 23, 2012, 01:57:31 AM »
Gutbucket is spot on, except that I think the minimum suggetsed mic-in level should be 67 to be sure you aren't clipping as long as the level meters say you aren't.

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2012, 03:50:05 AM »
Gutbucket helped me out when I got a DR2D. And I STILL Havent used it in the field :(
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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2012, 11:00:54 AM »
Gutbucket helped me out when I got a DR2D. And I STILL Havent used it in the field :(

Lee helped with my battery setup when I bought mine... thanks again!

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #6 on: February 25, 2012, 01:56:35 PM »
Happy to help. 

Bean, go record something.  ;)
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline F.O.Bean

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #7 on: February 26, 2012, 12:36:15 AM »
Happy to help. 

Bean, go record something.  ;)

I did, but Im waiting on my local bar band to play Thursday so I can try the DR2D on something thats not critical if I dont nail it :)
Recording Gear:
Schoeps MK 4V & MK 41V ->
Schoeps 250/0 KCY's ->
Naiant +60v/Low Noise PFA's ->
DarkTrain Right Angle Stubby XLR's ->
Sound Devices MixPre-6 & MixPre-3 ->
SanDisk 128gb Extreme Pro & 64gb Ultra Plus SDXC-I

Portable Playback Gear:
Campfire Audio Andromeda & Dorado IEM's >
Linum G2 SuperBax & Bax {3.5mm} | FiiO LC 2.5c {2.5mm} >
Shanling Audio M5s | Sony NW-A35 DAP's

DAW:
Dell Inspiron 15 5570-5521 Laptop
(Pentium i5/8gb RAM/256gb SSD)

http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/diskobean
http://www.archive.org/bookmarks/Bean420
http://bt.etree.org/mytorrents.php
http://www.mediafire.com/folder/j9eu80jpuaubz/Recordings

Offline genesisoh

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #8 on: February 26, 2012, 11:28:02 PM »
Thanks gutbucket for the great information.  I will be using it very soon :-)  For shows where I know I will not be able to check my levels, is it ok to set the LINE IN to say 90 ( and no extra gain from the 9100) if I am recording in 24/48? 

Thanks again.
Mics: CA-14 cards and omnis
Preamp: CA 9100 (not currently in use - wanna buy it???)
Recorder: TASCAM DR-2D
Video: Sony hx9v; Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS3 (old faithful)

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2012, 10:09:18 AM »
I wouldn't go below 95.  The danger is that you reach a point in line-input gain somewhere in the low 90's where the input stage distorts but the meter levels look OK and the peak light doesn't indicate overload.  You could set up a test to determine exactly where the overload point is, but as mentioned 95 (line-in) and 67 (mic-in) are the minimal input gain settings which have been determined to be safe. 

So I'd start there.  If you find yourself in a situation where your external pre is turned all the way down and you are still clipping, then the only choice is to turn the DR2d input gain down a bit more and hope for the best.  If you only need to reduce things by a few digits you might get away with it and if you can do that without overdriving the input circuitry into distortion then you've determined your new lowest-possible input gain level.  If you do get distortion you'll need to attenuate input level further, possibly by using external attenuators, switching to lower sensitivity mics or using an external preamp that can add less gain (or even negative gain, which is attenuation).
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline Drgiggles1

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2012, 10:13:58 PM »
In a post below you advise to have mic power on. If Genesisoh is using 2 battery boxes as mentioned shouldn't he have mic power "off"
Mics: CA-14 (o,c,o)
Remote Power: CA-9100 pre-amp, CA-UBB battery box
Recorders: Sony PCM-M10, Tascam DR-2d
Cable/s: custom 6" GAKables Mini Starquad
Batteries: Maha 9.6V Imedion, Maha Powerex 2700 mAh
Chargers: Maha MH-C9000, MAHA MH-C490F 9 Volt

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #11 on: March 10, 2012, 04:40:05 AM »
In a post below you advise to have mic power on. If Genesisoh is using 2 battery boxes as mentioned shouldn't he have mic power "off"

yes
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline Drgiggles1

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #12 on: March 11, 2012, 11:32:00 PM »
In  >:D situation does it make sense to try 4 omni's especially where you know the sound is very good with optimal seating, or would it be preferential for 2 cards-2 omni setup. Any negatives to going 4 omni's. I personally prefer the sound of recordings with omni's vs. cards but I can see where in certain situations cards are better, In those situations I would agree with the 2 card- 2 omni setup.
Mics: CA-14 (o,c,o)
Remote Power: CA-9100 pre-amp, CA-UBB battery box
Recorders: Sony PCM-M10, Tascam DR-2d
Cable/s: custom 6" GAKables Mini Starquad
Batteries: Maha 9.6V Imedion, Maha Powerex 2700 mAh
Chargers: Maha MH-C9000, MAHA MH-C490F 9 Volt

Offline Gutbucket

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2012, 09:57:11 AM »
Sure, as long as you set things up to take advantage of it.  It doesn't make much sense to put two omnis next to each other unless you want to eliminate as many other variables as possible for comparison of two seperate two channel stereo recordings.  But if the intent is mixing multiple channels to advantage, consider that omnis are no longer omnidirectional when mounted on something.  Four channels, four directions, and the ability to fine tune balance and overall directivity.
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<<

Offline Mr.Scully

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Re: TASCAM DR-2D Dual mode questions
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2014, 07:29:56 AM »
Guys, I'm sorry to bring to life such an old discussion but I'm having some minor troubles with the correct settings of the dual mode on my Tascam DR-2D that I bought recently.

I'm a taper of loud rock gigs and I want to record two stereo tracks using two different cardioid microphones. I actually own three mics: Church CA-14 with battery box, SP-CMC-9 with battery box and Sony ECM-719. For a short test I tried to record a snippet at a local club where a Queen tribute band was playing. I plugged the Sony mic into the mic input and the CA-14 with the battery box into the line-in input. I also read some of your advices in this thread.

Line-in setting: volume 100 (max).
Mic setting: low gain, volume 70, mic power on (I wanted to use power off and use battery in the mic but the mic battery was probably dead so I switched it off on the mic and switched it on in the Tascam settings).

Result: the mic track was quiet. I did another test with the "middle gain" setting and volume around 70 and that worked much better. I still had to amplify the recording in sound editor significantly but I guess that's normal.
But the line-in track was VERY VERY quiet. I had to increase the volume by 1500% or something to get to normal levels. What am I doing wrong? When I use my Edirol with its line-in input, the standard settings are similar as with using a mic (volume around 70%). But here with Tascam the volume is incredibly quiet even when I set it to 100 which is the maximum possible level. Have I overlooked something? Could the battery in the battery box be dying or something?

(Also the CA-14 track sounded slightly worse than with the old cheap Sony mic but that could have been related to having to amplify the volume in sound editor like fifteen times).

So my questions are:
1. What should I do to record from line-in at a normal volume?
2. The mic recording without battery box sounds good. Should I actually use a battery box? (With hidden taping it's more difficult to smuggle in more gear past the security). Or is it sufficient to set "power on" in the Tascam settings instead?

Thank you.

 

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