Tascam DR2d - part 2

[Gutbucket]

The usuable Line-input adjustment range when in Dual_Line mode is only between 95-100 anyway, so there is not that much usefulness in adjusting it on the fly.

I think if the recorder is placed in Line-input only mode instead of one of the Dual modes, the level buttons on the side will adjust the line-input gain.  Not sure but I think so.  Perhaps that's what may have lead to the confusion.

[Bluegrass]

Thanks everyone for your responses.  I have quite a bit more clarity about how to
record using dual recording in Line mode.

Ed D.

[chinariderstl]

Hey now!

In! 

Just picked up a Minty DR-2D (Thanks Tony!) for a friend of mine.  She's new to recording and I'm new to the DR-2D.

Chris.

[daspyknows]

My new one looks like it's a freebie.  Ordered it on ebay as new.  Person never responded to my emails for tracking info and sent it after I was supposed to receive it.  I opened a case when it didn't arrive in time.  Poorly packed and no original packing materials so I complained to ebay and they credited my money back.  If the seller responds I'll send it back, if not its a free one.

[daspyknows]

I'll send it back if the seller contacts me, but if they don't I won't.  They have yet to return any messages so who knows.

[jagraham]

The usuable Line-input adjustment range when in Dual_Line mode is only between 95-100 anyway, so there is not that much usefulness in adjusting it on the fly.

I think if the recorder is placed in Line-input only mode instead of one of the Dual modes, the level buttons on the side will adjust the line-input gain.  Not sure but I think so.  Perhaps that's what may have lead to the confusion.

I believe this is correct. You can always adjust this if running 2 channels. When in Dual, you can do the same but only with the mic input.

[fandelive]

I recently bought a Tascam DR-2d and will tape my first show with it tomorrow night.

So I poped a hard rock CD, put my mics in front of a speaker and turned the volume up loud (I needed ear-plugs to stay in the room - the sound at a rock show is gonna be louder thought).

My first try was :
* DPA 4061 > SP Battery-Box (flat) > Mic-in (low) : recording level set @ 68/100 (unity gain)
* MM-HLSC-1 (w/4.7k mod) > Chruch Audio CA-9100 preamp cranked to the max > Line-in : recording level set @ 96/100 (unity gain)

As a result, both mics barely reached the -21dB mark...
I then had to play around with my gear alot to finally find a satisfying combo :

* MM-HLSC-1 (w/4.7k mod) > SP Battery Box (flat) > Mic-in (med) @ 86/100
* DPA4061 > CA-9100 cranked @ 3 hours > Line-in @ 96/100 (unity gain)

Both levels then reached the -6dB mark.

Doing this way, I get equal levels and will still be able to add/remove gain on the fly for both mics.

I think the Mic-in setup will give me enough room if I still have to add or remove gain.
On the other hand, I should probably crank the CA-9100 @ 12 hours (so less gain from the CA to start with) and set Line-in levels @ 100/100 so that I would get more room to play with if I have to add more gain. What do you think ?

I've read several time on this thread that I should set the Mic-in to LOW.
The fact is that my 4.7k modded MM-HLSC-1 have an even lower sensitivity than the DPA4061.
Is there a risk to get in trouble when setting the Mic-in to MED ? I'll still be able to lower the gain on the Tascam until the 68/100 limit.

[danny3]

^ If you haven't already done, do a test with the MIC in set to LOW, and raise the input level up to 100.

[fandelive]

^ If you haven't already done, do a test with the MIC in set to LOW, and raise the input level up to 100.

Already done and I was around -20dB.

I've read the whole thread and found an interesting quote  by Gutbucket about setting the Mic-input gain to MID :

If you need to max out the mic-input gain at 100 with it set to LOW and are still getting recording levels that aren't high enough and have noise floor problems, you'll benefit from more gain.  Not sure what the good range of settings will be in that case; you'd need to experiment to find out.  However, with mic-gain set to MID you will be able to set the mic-gain lower than the established "do not go below level" of LOW/67 on the mic-input if necessary.  How much lower I don't know.  The upper limit should simply be that which clips the meters for whatever you are recording, assuming you have the limiter and auto-gain turned off.

So I guess it's not always a bad thing...

[Sebastian]

Already done and I was around -20dB.

When recording to 24 bits, this really isn't that bad. I have many recordings that peak around or even below -20dB, but still sound excellent!

Keep in mind that you did your test with your home stereo. SPLs at a rock show will be waaaaay higher. There's no way you could reproduce those SPLs with a regular home system. Not even closely...

And if you're still peaking below -20dB, just switch the mic sensitivity to mid between songs. Mid is 12dB more gain than low, so you might also want to turn down gain on the recorder.

I always try to peak around -12dB. That gives me plenty of headroom and I can easily boot the levels in post. Considering that, peaking at -20dB isn't that far off.

Bottom line: I think you should be fine.

[fandelive]

Keep in mind that you did your test with your home stereo. SPLs at a rock show will be waaaaay higher. There's no way you could reproduce those SPLs with a regular home system. Not even closely...

It depends... I think if caps can touch the speaker, you get something pretty loud.
Your brain would certainly burst out when touching the speakers at any amplified show

I always try to peak around -12dB. That gives me plenty of headroom and I can easily boot the levels in post. Considering that, peaking at -20dB isn't that far off.

So I did a final test following your advice, hi-fi @ ear-bleeding levels, and here's what I got :

* MM-HLSC-1 > SP battery-box (flat) > mic-in (low) @ 100/100
* DPA4061 > CA-9100 preamp (set @ 12 o'clock) > line-in @ 100/100

Both peaked @ around -12dB. Way to go

I'm gonna stay with this setup now and try to check levels tonight during opening act and first song of main act.

Many thanks for helping me out

[capnhook]

Back off one notch tonight, for insurance. 

[fandelive]

Back off one notch tonight, for insurance. 

Following your advice as I don't like to live with regrets
Now @ -18dB in front of my hi-fi speaker. Let's go to the show !

[fandelive]

Back from the concert and I received a "Write timeout" error and the Tascam stopped recording in the middle of the main act's set.
I tested the SD card before and let the Tascam record until the 2Go limit, just to see if it will automatically start a new file (which it did). Nothing wrong happened during the test... I'm so disgusted !!

The SD card is a SanDisk Ultra SDHC 16GB (15MB/s), so not a shitty card.

On the other hand, both recordings do sound really good. The HLSC's peak is around -8dB which is fine. The DPA's a little quieter thought (-18dB).

[fandelive]

The SD card is a SanDisk Ultra SDHC 16GB (15MB/s), so not a shitty card.

I know there's a list of supported SD cards somewhere (did not take the time to look for it yet).
But I also know some users got in trouble with cards that were on the list.

So... any feedback on a SD card that won't fail ?
Should I format my SD card before each use ? Formatting using the computer or the Tascam ?

I don't want to fuck up my recordings every other time.

Thanks