Trading shows not for shows

[spcyrfc]

I have been wondering about the ethic of trading a show for something other than cash and other than a show. 
say, trading a show for a bike part or something.
it seems to me that this is ethical, seeing as it is a service for a service - but am i then bootlegging and not simply taping the shows that i tape?

thanks
luke

[eric.B]

hmm ..   I would think that trading a CD with noncommercial music on it for anything else other than a CD with noncommercial music on it is unethical..

in other words..   trade noncommercial cd's for noncommercial cd's only..
anything else just puts a value on the music.. 

[cfrancis]

I would then ask if this is a usual occurence or not.  Of course there are differences to any rule.  If that is what you decide to trade for and both parties are OK with that then I would say cool.  But if you made a habit of trading for other items other than shows then I would say it isn't cool

[Brian Skalinder]

in other words..   trade noncommercial cd's for noncommercial cd's only..
anything else just puts a value on the music.. 

What if one trades the monetary value of the blank CDs for the monetary value of something else.  Say...$1.20 in CDRs (that happen to have music on them) for a $1.20 bike part?  There's no value associated with the music, only the medium on which the music resides.  How is this different from people trading CDRs for CDRs?

[Chuck]

I've recently been thinking about the ethics of giving a club owner recordings of concerts at his club and getting free admission to some shows at his club. I'm thinking it's not a good idea.

[twatts]

I given people burned audio discs as trade for various services - helping fix my car, doing me favors, buying me beers, etc...  Its always been a thing between friends, and always the choice to the recipient of the CDRs...    

But I've actually given away more than I've ever traded...  I recently dumped about 200 PH CDRs onto some recently married friends as a congrats...  Afterall, they did feed me and get me drunk at their wedding!

I've also taken 1000s of analogs and several 100 CDRs up to the bar and given them away.  Some folks buy me a beer as thank you.  Some gave me nothing...  

I think, yes, the materials have some value, and yes, in a economical sense, you are losing money giving them away...  But the Karma you get from it, as well as the props from total strangers and friends is worth it...

That's all the "trade" I need...

Terry

[twatts]

in other words..   trade noncommercial cd's for noncommercial cd's only..
anything else just puts a value on the music.. 

What if one trades the monetary value of the blank CDs for the monetary value of something else.  Say...$1.20 in CDRs (that happen to have music on them) for a $1.20 bike part?  There's no value associated with the music, only the medium on which the music resides.  How is this different from people trading CDRs for CDRs?

I would agree with this, if any value was to be assigned to "used CDRs".  As CDRs are about $0.33 per, I'd say you are ok to sell a 3 disc show for $1.00 in materials.  Or trading 9 discs for a beer...

T

[nickgregory]

I've recently been thinking about the ethics of giving a club owner recordings of concerts at his club and getting free admission to some shows at his club. I'm thinking it's not a good idea.

why not?  I give a local clug owner copies of everything I tape there.  He throws me on the guestlist for a handful of shows...not a one for one relationship...but I see nothing wrong with it.

[eric.B]

hmm again..
I see your points..  I have just sent in my rebates for 3 spindles of fuji/TY disks from best buy, which(after rebate) brought the cost down to 16cents for each cdr.. 

If you wanna burn 100 cds for 16dollars worth of stuff..  I guess thats cool.. 

100 cds to get into say two shows(maybe)?   Id rather spend the 16 dollars myself..

In time spent alone in the burning process it just doesnt seem worth it.. 

[admkrk]

i'm always giving out discs, usualy because of someone doing me a favor something. never did the "i'll give you the * show for * deal though.  however the time alone to burn 100 discs has to be worth more than $16

[Just Taper Mark from NC]

I'm with nick,I give copies of stuff to club owners and bartenders who ask because they
like to hear shows from their club too,it is a way of keeping them taper friendly in my eyes.
I have been guestlisted a few times for this and i've been given free sodas and water more
times than I wanted but hey can't bitch for a little kick back on something so minor IMO.

[Steve J]

in other words..   trade noncommercial cd's for noncommercial cd's only..
anything else just puts a value on the music.. 

What if one trades the monetary value of the blank CDs for the monetary value of something else.  Say...$1.20 in CDRs (that happen to have music on them) for a $1.20 bike part?  There's no value associated with the music, only the medium on which the music resides.  How is this different from people trading CDRs for CDRs?

Wouldn't that be bartering? Would those CD's hold any intrinsic value (outside of coasters) unless the recordings on them were desirable? In that case, to use it in bartering, doesn't that increase the value of the service provided by the artist and aren't they entitled to compensation if one decides to use the recording for purposes other than were originally negotiated (i.e., that you would only trade in equal numbers of media for similar recordings of the same or other artists)?

[JasonSobel]

I've recently been thinking about the ethics of giving a club owner recordings of concerts at his club and getting free admission to some shows at his club. I'm thinking it's not a good idea.

why not?  I give a local clug owner copies of everything I tape there.  He throws me on the guestlist for a handful of shows...not a one for one relationship...but I see nothing wrong with it.

yeah, I see nothing wrong with this either.  There's a band that plays every Tuesday at a bar (no cover).  I always give the musicians copies of the shows, and in exchange, I'm "with" the band, and get free beers.  I think it is mutually beneficial

[sickrick43]

I've recently been thinking about the ethics of giving a club owner recordings of concerts at his club and getting free admission to some shows at his club. I'm thinking it's not a good idea.

why not?  I give a local clug owner copies of everything I tape there.  He throws me on the guestlist for a handful of shows...not a one for one relationship...but I see nothing wrong with it.

Ditto here...

What's a "clug owner"?  I've got a club where I'm friendly with the owner.  I give him a copy of my stage pull, and some photo's - he usually gives me a copy of his board DAT, plus I get into shows where that band hasn't guest-listed me already.

Then again, most of the time I pay to get into shows - why grub a $15-20 ticket from the BAND, when you can afford to pay for it.  If you can afford to buy ALCOHOL, you can afford to pay for a ticket.  Even when I guest-list large shows, I ask for backstage/photo passes and pay-for seats.

In the context of this thread though, giving copies of shows played at his club to a club-owner, and getting consideration from him to get into shows is ethical (IMHO), as the owner actually has something to do with the music being traded.

Trading copies of a show, where the item traded for exceeds the value of blank(s) is SELLING the recording (ex: Bon Jovi show for Chrome Handlebars), especially in the case where the guy you're trading with has nothing to do with the show itself. 

The net piracy act got even more specific on this when it came to software trading (since music is considered "software" also in alot of cases) - it eliminated the "profit motive" from copyright violations, and essentially said that any unauthorized distribution of copywritten material, whether in exchange for value or not, was piracy.

Rick