Topic: Tascam DV-RA1000 DVD Recorder Surprise

[Todd R]

Congrats, Moke!

So, I pulled up the tascam site to learn about this recorder.  It uses the same A/D chip as the V3 -- the PCM1804.  In looking up specs on the PCM1804 chip earlier today, I noticed that it can provide both PCM output and DSD output.

Time to get with Grace to have them mod your V3 for DSD output.  Looks like the DV-RA1000 accepts a digital DSD input, so then you'd be all set.  Of course, if you use the V3 analog outs for the front end, and if both the DV-RA1000 and the V3 use the PCM1804 A/D chip, then maybe there wouldn't be alot of difference anyway.

[bkirby]

Congrats, Moke!

So, I pulled up the tascam site to learn about this recorder.  It uses the same A/D chip as the V3 -- the PCM1804.  In looking up specs on the PCM1804 chip earlier today, I noticed that it can provide both PCM output and DSD output.

Time to get with Grace to have them mod your V3 for DSD output.  Looks like the DV-RA1000 accepts a digital DSD input, so then you'd be all set.  Of course, if you use the V3 analog outs for the front end, and if both the DV-RA1000 and the V3 use the PCM1804 A/D chip, then maybe there wouldn't be alot of difference anyway.

Email sent to Grace Designs...

[bkirby]

I have been seeing prices in the $1200-1300 range. I am going to hold off for a little while and wait and see if a portable unit pops up in the next 6 months or so. I also want to see if this format gets any support where I can burn my own discs and play it on a SACD player. If this becomes a reality soon, I see no point in purchasing a 24bit PCM recorder...

[dmonterisi]

i wonder if mike grace opens his email every day just wondering what kind of off-the-wall requests he's going to get on a given day?

moke-make sure you include a request to incorporate the flux capacitor into the v4 for time travel.

[macdaddy]

I have been seeing prices in the $1200-1300 range. I am going to hold off for a little while and wait and see if a portable unit pops up in the next 6 months or so. I also want to see if this format gets any support where I can burn my own discs and play it on a SACD player. If this becomes a reality soon, I see no point in purchasing a 24bit PCM recorder...

my sentiments exactly.

[bkirby]

Moke,
I don't consider that lame at all. If DSD becomes the format of choice, then I will go that route for a portable unit and probably also purchase the DV-RA1000. If 24bit PCM stays around, then I will keep my Masterlink (for local shows with power), and get a 24bit portable PCM recorder! Either way, I may purchase the Tascam unit anyway just for my own personal listening! I'm just waiting right now! Come on DSD!!!

[Jammin72]

Don't count on being able to make your own SACD's... Sony is going to fight that tooth and nail, but if you can play them in a machine like the Tascam what does it matter really?  So you can't pass it out as SACD to friends who don't have a machine.  We already see this with 16 and 24 bit offers, no big deal.  It's not like there's an SACD portable or Car player that you need to support.  The technology is already there to make the recordings and play them back!  I think that it's going to stay a format of choice for engineers that can hear and be relegated to capturing the most/best data possible for subsequent processing.  For how long were DAT's made that could only be played back on a myriad of esoteric gear before the ability to dump it to CD became available.  It's all part of it.  The way to figure is take a listen... if you can't hear the difference there is already a world of 24 bit PCM recording solutions available to you. If you do hear that DSD is doing something no other medium can then.... whatchya gonna do?

Ummm this is all said by a guy who can't make the jump until after he gets graduated and a real job BTW... so big grain of salt. 

[macdaddy]

Sony is going to fight that tooth and nail, but if you can play them in a machine like the Tascam what does it matter really?

interesting point...

but i thought that is why some of those computer dvd authoring programs cost so much, because you are paying sony the sacd licensing fee...

[Jammin72]

Sony is going to fight that tooth and nail, but if you can play them in a machine like the Tascam what does it matter really?

interesting point...

but i thought that is why some of those computer dvd authoring programs cost so much, because you are paying sony the sacd licensing fee...

The "Authoring Programs" that were mentioned here will still not produce an SACD... they work with an create .DIFF files that have to be send to a production facility to produce and actual SACD, they want about $500 for the first pressing and $2 a disc thereafter.

Believe it or not they systems are designed to write the information to TAPE so that you can send it to the production facility!

So you can record to the Tascam or your PC with one of these programs, tweak it in one of the programs, but you still got a get it to the big boys to make an actual SACD disc.

Crazy no...

It's actually part of the reason that I think that there is a chance the big engineers will adopt the format, simply to become exclusive again.  However in this case we get better sound in the deal!

[MattH]

The Sonic Solutions and Discwelder authoring programs take DSD-Raw and converts it to SACD. So you don't really have to send anything to a production house unless it saves money on the 100 SACD copies of the one show you may need to make for all your friends with SACD players.

I think the price of this Tas. unit will come down a lot as they did with the first DAT recorders.

[MattH]

If the V3 can output DSD with it's existing AD chip, then it will need the proprietary SPDIF 3 interface which uses 2 BNC cables, 1 for each channel.

[Brian]

have you guys heard recordings made with this?

if so where can i find them?  i'd like to hear if they have the same characteristics above 8kHz as some of other DSD recordings i've heard on SACD.  i've heard wretched DSD recordings where i preffered the 16/44.1 CD sound over the SACD because of what it did to the high end.  But i've also heard plenty of fantastic recordings as well.  Would just like to see what this puppy does.

edit: moke  if you leave 1 RU space in your rack between your two units you should be ok.

[Brian]

I've got four recordings in the next to weekends after this one.

All four are chamber ensembles. The show starts with a piano and organ duet of a Rachmaninoff concerto, and then the second set is a small baroque orchestra, with piano and organ, and choir. All acoustic music, in nice sounding halls. My last recordings from these halls are for sale by the ensemble at the concerts.
There are two rehearsals, played as if live, to tape. And then the two live peformances.
It'll get a good workout in its first couple of weekends

so your answer to my question is "no i haven't heard any recordings made with this but i will be making some soon" ?

hmmmmm

as for teh DSD output on the V3?  i don't think it will happen.  not enough room in the box or the back panel.  unless they got rid of the all the digi outputs except DSD.  just a speculation on my part at this point though.

i'm skeptical on DSD in general so that's playing a big part in my curiosity in this particular unit.  don't worry, i won't be like bean in the 722 forum.  I'll play nice

[bkirby]

OK,.... care to discuss mounting this unit in a rack?

Single unit rack, or multi-unit rack for air space around the unit for cooling?
Multi unit rack for a power conditioner also?
I realize its all speculation at this point, but I'm thinking about rack mounting this and possibly my tas cdr700 together, but I'm concerned about heat buildup with the two units cooking discs.

any thoughts?
thanks

I have my Masterlink in a 3U rack-bag with my powerconditioner. I have been running this for local 24/96 recordings and I have never had a problem! Also, I have always run an outboard A/D and I am not burning discs in real-time. I have no idea how much heat the Tascam unit creates...

I also like to have my power conditioner with me in clubs/bars where the power is not the most reliable...  

[dmonterisi]

I've got four recordings in the next to weekends after this one.

All four are chamber ensembles. The show starts with a piano and organ duet of a Rachmaninoff concerto, and then the second set is a small baroque orchestra, with piano and organ, and choir. All acoustic music, in nice sounding halls. My last recordings from these halls are for sale by the ensemble at the concerts.
There are two rehearsals, played as if live, to tape. And then the two live peformances.
It'll get a good workout in its first couple of weekends

so your answer to my question is "no i haven't heard any recordings made with this but i will be making some soon" ?

hmmmmm

as for teh DSD output on the V3?  i don't think it will happen.  not enough room in the box or the back panel.  unless they got rid of the all the digi outputs except DSD.  just a speculation on my part at this point though.

i'm skeptical on DSD in general so that's playing a big part in my curiosity in this particular unit.  don't worry, i won't be like bean in the 722 forum.  I'll play nice

DSD in general or its application to live taping?