Topic: Some questions about SP-CMC-19 Cardioids (please help, next taping in 2 weeks)

[Liquid Drum]

Hey all,

These are my new mics (which were kindly given to me by a very kind member here) and I'll tape my first show with these mics in 2 weeks. Its a rock concert (Guns N Roses) so will be very loud.

I have a bass roll-off battery box but I've been told by some people that cardioids don't need it as they roll-off so much by themselves. But others have told me that these mics will brick-wall easily and that a bass roll-off is essential.

What should I do?? Maybe use a little roll-off??

Also with cardioids you need to aim at the source right?? Well the clips are a little dodgy as you can either clip them facing downwards or upwards which will probably catch my breathing, will it affect the sound??

Should I try modify them so they point forwards away from me and into the direction of the source?? (surely thats the best way).

Any tips on what to use to do this would be really appreciated,

Many thanks,
Simon.

[Liquid Drum]

Go here for specs, etc...

http://www.soundprofessionals.com/cgi-bin/gold/item/SP-CMC-19

[Oysterhead00]

I'd use the bass rolloff on one of the lower settings.  You could always adjust the sound and add more bass in the EQ process, but if you have a bunch of brickwalling you're screwed.  Better to go the safe route.

The easiest way to tape with little mics in my experience is wear a black T-Shirt and tape the mics to shoulders aiming foward and maybe a little up (ie put them farther back on the shoulders).  Being tiny and black, they shouldn't be spotted and it allows you a little more mobility.  You can buy pretty sticky black hockey stick tape at Dicks or Sports Authority for $3.  Sticky enough to hold them but won't wreck the shirt or leave any sticky crap on the mics.  It's also a dull black fabric tape that will hide them and not reflect the light of any nosey security guards.  I find wearing an NFL jersey (airy mesh) over top of them doesn't harm the sound and acts as both a windscreen and hides the mics further, but you have to be careful not too move too much or you can get a shwooshing sound.

Also, if you have a hat with a black rim on it, you can easily mount them on the underside of the hat and they'll barely be noticeable.  Of course, you'll have to make a concerted effort not to turn your head and talk to friends.  A favorite here is to mount them inside of a Kangol hat, plenty of room and the hat won't really affect the sound quality.

I just checked the link and these are even the tiniest ones.  Go get yourself a cheap pair of sunglasses and some hockey stick tape and tape them to the arms of the glasses.  Then tape up the wires where they start to run down your back.  Walk in to the venue with the sunglasses hanging down by your chest and the wires and everyting will look like some ghetto croakies and not get any attention, when you go to your seat, prop the sunglasses on your head like everybody else and they'll be aiming towards the stage and upwards over all the talkers.  I've done that with SS-DSMs and got great results with 2 babbling teenage girls in front of me screaming at Ben Folds how much they love him

[Liquid Drum]

^^^ Thanks for the help mate, so what roll-off setting should I use??

[Oysterhead00]

^^^ Thanks for the help mate, so what roll-off setting should I use??

On my AT853s (SP-CMC-8) and SPSB-2 battery box I usually used 16Hz.  I taped Tool, A Perfect Circle, Marilyn Manson, Local H, and some other LOUD bands on that setting and was very happy with sound.  You could go higher if you wanted as well as I tend to like my recordings a little heavy on the bass...it's a matter of preference.

What you can do is crank up your stereo with some rap music or something else really heavy on the bass and put your mics right up to it.  Do it on one setting for 30 sec, then go up one, and repeate.  Make sure to keep track of what you do when.  Then give it a listen and see what you think.  It won't be exactly the same as what will happen in the field, but should give you an idea of the amount of bass it lets through in relative terms.

[hyperplane]

Liquid Drum:

What recorder are you using? Is your seat close to the PA speakers?

I would suggest setting the bass rolloff a decent bit higher than the 16 Hz setting... maybe at the 95 Hz or 107 Hz setting.

Those mics (SP-CMC-19) are the lower level Panasonic capsules, and they simply cannot handle super loud sound as well as Audio Technica cardioids, or other cardioids in the same ballpark.

[Liquid Drum]

Liquid Drum:

What recorder are you using? Is your seat close to the PA speakers?

I would suggest setting the bass rolloff a decent bit higher than the 16 Hz setting... maybe at the 95 Hz or 107 Hz setting.

Those mics (SP-CMC-19) are the lower level Panasonic capsules, and they simply cannot handle super loud sound as well as Audio Technica cardioids, or other cardioids in the same ballpark.

I'm using a Sony MZ-RH910 MD.

The gig is in a large arena and I'm about halfway back, probably around the soundboard area, but on the left hand side (I'm on the front row of that block though).

If i go line-in (which I intend to) that would help right?? as the recording would be lower than going mic in.

So, are you saying these mics are no good?? or they just can't handle the loud bass? I want a decent recording as in my previous taping I used the Sony EMC-719 mic and I got very good results so by upgrading to these mics I hope for even better recordings.

Thanks,
Simon.

[hyperplane]

I'm using a Sony MZ-RH910 MD.

The gig is in a large arena and I'm about halfway back, probably around the soundboard area, but on the left hand side (I'm on the front row of that block though).

If i go line-in (which I intend to) that would help right?? as the recording would be lower than going mic in.

So, are you saying these mics are no good?? or they just can't handle the loud bass? I want a decent recording as in my previous taping I used the Sony EMC-719 mic and I got very good results so by upgrading to these mics I hope for even better recordings.

Thanks,
Simon.

Liquid Drum:

The mics definitely are not crap mics; I'm just saying they cannot handle as loud of levels as, say, phantom powered AT853s for example.

You should be able to get very good results. I would definitely put the bass rolloff at the 95 or 107 Hz setting, and definitely go Line In (not Mic In).

I think if you do those things, your recording should turn out very well, barring any unforeseen circumstances (like loud nearby drunks).

[Liquid Drum]

I'm using a Sony MZ-RH910 MD.

The gig is in a large arena and I'm about halfway back, probably around the soundboard area, but on the left hand side (I'm on the front row of that block though).

If i go line-in (which I intend to) that would help right?? as the recording would be lower than going mic in.

So, are you saying these mics are no good?? or they just can't handle the loud bass? I want a decent recording as in my previous taping I used the Sony EMC-719 mic and I got very good results so by upgrading to these mics I hope for even better recordings.

Thanks,
Simon.

Liquid Drum:

The mics definitely are not crap mics; I'm just saying they cannot handle as loud of levels as, say, phantom powered AT853s for example.

You should be able to get very good results. I would definitely put the bass rolloff at the 95 or 107 Hz setting, and definitely go Line In (not Mic In).

I think if you do those things, your recording should turn out very well, barring any unforeseen circumstances (like loud nearby drunks).

Thanks for the help, really appreciated.   

[nihilistic0]

I notice the frequency response on these mics only goes down to 80Hz...

They will pry roll off a ton of bass just by themselves