Soundboard recording with an iRiver H120

[AALLJJ]

I have recently purchased an H120 and I will record some shows directly from the soundboard in the not so distant future. If the board has an optical out, there should not a problem using the S/PDIF in on the iRiver. If the out is a digital coaxial it wouldn't post much a problem either, I guess, since there are conversions from coax to S/PDIF.

My question is relating to an analog board signal. Is there any sense in running it through av A/D before entering my H120, hopefully through the S/PDIF.

I have checked out the Denecke AD 20 for this reason, but I will need a - 22 db attenuator to match this task.

Is there a better way of doing this, that is in the sam pricerange as the AD 20 ??

I thank you in advance for your help.

[rokpunk]

The board won't have a digital out. Just run line level into the iRiver and you'll be fine. Bring a mini->RCA cable, plus RCA->1/4" adapters and you'll be fine. Slim chance you'll need XLR adapters as well, but I doubt it.

[BayTaynt3d]

I've needed XLRs on NUMBEROUS occasions FWIW.

[jebi]

I've needed XLRs on NUMBEROUS occasions FWIW.

i've needed xlr's on 3 diffferent boards this month. 

[twatts]

I have 2 Hosa XRM 105 cables - 3pin XLR > RCA.  Nylon tied together, it provides me with XLR>RCA for use with my RCA>1/8" cable.

Terry

http://www.sweetwater.com/store/category/c861

[ScottT]

there are conversions from coax to S/PDIF.

Just for semantics sake:  S/PDIF (Sony/Philips Digital InterFace) is a format for transferring a digital signal.  A coax cable can carry a S/PDIF signal.  You want an optical cable to receive a S/PDIF signal with your iRiver.  Here's a definition

S/PDIF

S/PDIF (Sony/Philips Digital Interface) is a standard audio transfer file format. It is usually found on digital audio equipment such as a DAT (Digital Audio Tape) machine or audio processing device. It allows the transfer of audio from one file to another without the conversion to and from an analog format, which could degrade the signal quality.

The most common connector used with an S/PDIF interface is the RCA connector, the same one used for consumer audio products. An optical connector is also sometimes used.

Semantics aside, I have never run across a board with a digital output.  I'm sure they exist, but it's unlikely you'll encounter one.  Rokpunk's suggestion is the place to start.  If you bring an RCA>mini cable and a couple 1/4">RCA converters you'll probably be fine.  As others added if you want to be sure you have every possibility covered, get some XLR cables that you can convert down to mini (1/8").

[BayTaynt3d]

I'll be much stronger about this than ScottT. If you want to take a SBD, you better be able to handle RCA, 1/4", and XLR because depending on the board it could easily be any one of the three. My personal experience has been about 1/3 chance for any of the three, and of the last three SBD's I've taken, 2 were XLR.

[Church-Audio]

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

I'll be much stronger about this than ScottT. If you want to take a SBD, you better be able to handle RCA, 1/4", and XLR because depending on the board it could easily be any one of the three. My personal experience has been about 1/3 chance for any of the three, and of the last three SBD's I've taken, 2 were XLR.

[Will_S]

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

[mmmatt]

On one occasion I patched into a digital board (I've done 100+ board patches usually mixed with mics).  It was a festi in Indiana and the sound company hauled gear from FL to do the job, so they were traveling light.  The little yamaha digital board he used was tiny (~19" x24") and with a rack of adat pre's he was able to use it for 32 channels effectivly.
     the house engineer warned me against using the s/pdif signal because he didn't run his board hot and there is typically no way to amplify a digital signal on most recording devices (except in post).  It will be an extreemly rare occasion that you see a digital console in use at a venue.  For the record, 90% of the board's I patch I get xlr, but that is not to say that rca wouldn't also be available in most cases.  I use ballanced inputs so I prefer a ballanced out from the board when I can get it (Iriver is unballanced so unballanced is fine) .  I also typically mix board and mics, and through the matrix out you can usually get a signal without the effects which is my preferance when mixing board and mics.  Carry all 3 adapters for sure!!!!!!!!!

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

Man!  You guys must think this Irvier is one bad mama-jama! It is just 2 channel and the guy just wants a board patch!  Chris... Mr. Old School  ... are there current production boards that have hot pin 3?  I'm asking not attacking!  I don't *think* I have ever run into this.  However I do carry phase reversing adapters so that when I run my mics pointing at the audience from the stage I can match the polarity of the board.  If the board out was backwards I wouldn't need them!

Matt

[firmdragon]

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

Out of curiosity what would a recording with reversed polarity sound like?

[Church-Audio]

If you are using room mics with a board feed, and your room mics are (+) with respect to pin 2 and your board feed is (-) with respect to pin 2. You will notice a lack of bottom end and other things that are dependant on his or her mix and if you took a stereo feed vs. a mono feed and panning and your room mic placement and how identical the board feed sound is to the P.A / room sound.

So it's a hard question to answer but generally speaking it's a lack of bottom end that is the first clue, much less then was present on the day of the recording when you listen to the playback. This is a very often overlooked problem, as is time alignment between the room mics and the board feed so they arrive at roughly the same time. These two factors IMHO can make or break a live concert matrix recording.
And is the challenge of any real live recording engineer.

Chris Church

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

Out of curiosity what would a recording with reversed polarity sound like?

[mmmatt]

If you are using room mics with a board feed, and your room mics are (+) with respect to pin 2 and your board feed is (-) with respect to pin 2. You will notice a lack of bottom end and other things that are dependant on his or her mix and if you took a stereo feed vs. a mono feed and panning and your room mic placement and how identical the board feed sound is to the P.A / room sound.

So it's a hard question to answer but generally speaking it's a lack of bottom end that is the first clue, much less then was present on the day of the recording when you listen to the playback. This is a very often overlooked problem, as is time alignment between the room mics and the board feed so they arrive at roughly the same time. These two factors IMHO can make or break a live concert matrix recording.
And is the challenge of any real live recording engineer.

Chris Church

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

Out of curiosity what would a recording with reversed polarity sound like?

Good use of the word Matrix Chris

Firm Dragon, if it is just a 2chan board patch you most likely won't notice any difference.  That kind of differance takes a pretty keen ear.  As Chris said though, a mix of multiple sources with the polarity oposite is going to sound almost mono, lacking in bass, and generally like ass.

Matt

[Church-Audio]

Thanks I knew you would see that I learn things here too like the word matrix.

If you are using room mics with a board feed, and your room mics are (+) with respect to pin 2 and your board feed is (-) with respect to pin 2. You will notice a lack of bottom end and other things that are dependant on his or her mix and if you took a stereo feed vs. a mono feed and panning and your room mic placement and how identical the board feed sound is to the P.A / room sound.

So it's a hard question to answer but generally speaking it's a lack of bottom end that is the first clue, much less then was present on the day of the recording when you listen to the playback. This is a very often overlooked problem, as is time alignment between the room mics and the board feed so they arrive at roughly the same time. These two factors IMHO can make or break a live concert matrix recording.
And is the challenge of any real live recording engineer.

Chris Church

MAKE sure you talk about polarity too:) You should also have phase reverse cables incase a boards XLR output is pin 3 hot insted of pin 2 hot so your output will be in phase with your room mics

Chris Church

Of course, if your editing software has a polarity reversal option, you can fix this in post if you don't have the right cables.

Out of curiosity what would a recording with reversed polarity sound like?

Good use of the word Matrix Chris

Firm Dragon, if it is just a 2chan board patch you most likely won't notice any difference.  That kind of differance takes a pretty keen ear.  As Chris said though, a mix of multiple sources with the polarity oposite is going to sound almost mono, lacking in bass, and generally like ass.

Matt

[mmmatt]

Thanks I knew you would see that I learn things here too like the word matrix.

+T for being a good sport Chris.

Matt