Topic: Doubt on transferring

[EdBA]

Hello!

I have a doubt about transferring the audio from tapes to the computer and then make Cds... I thought in writing this at the 'Ask the tapers' section but as it is not exaclty about taping, I wrote here.

This is what I have lately been doing...

- I connect the player to the computer, obtain the sound from the tape using Audition 1.5 (of Adobe).

- Remove hiss and do a few small arrangements with the whole file. I don't know if it is "normal" but my computer has turned off a few times while working with something large, for example, a 'noise reduction' command, so, to avoid that, I split the entire file in small files saved in a new folder -those new "small" files are the songs or tracks.

- If the big file (the whole concert) was split in several files already, then I work with each "small" file: reduce more hiss, increase or decrease the volume, put a filter (last week I found the "Quick filter" and I like it a lot, no more "Parametric", "Paragraphic" nor any other filter) and sometimes put an equilizer. This is quite time consuming, as most of the times I have done it with each track!

- Then, using the Nero program, I do something like a sketch or a test on Cd to listen to it and find if more arrangements must be done in order to try to make it sound better.

- When the edition is ready, I burn the Cd(s) using not Nero but the same Audition program, because I think that Cds result better when burned with Audition than with Nero.

... Is this process correct?, or should I try something better?

Thanks for your attention,
Eduardo.

[Jhurlbs81]

just a few thoughts since no one replied...

How do you split the file into tracks?
If you are not using CDWav I'd recommend it.  It will split the tracks perfectly.

Also, if you adjust volume or noramalize the tracks individually you will find the volume of each track will be different.  It really is best to EQ, normalize the whole file at once. If your computer is crashing, maybe try rmoving some unnecessary files and then defragment your hard drive.   

Hope this helps,
Jesse

[EdBA]

Thank you Jesse!

Once I have the whole file I select part of it (which will be a track), cut it and paste it in a new file and so on until the big file reduces and gets to be nothing. Then, when all the tracks are split and saved in new "small" individual files, I select each file to be burned on the disc -without pauses, of course. You must be totally right, working with the whole file at once should be better than with each track. Is it normal, though, that an order take more than ten or even twenty minutes to be completed?... for example, the "remove clicks and pops" thing with a long file (like a concert of 140 minutes) might take too long to be done.

What is CDWav?  I do everything in the Adobe Audition program in wav format with a sample rate (what's that??, Hertz?) of 44100 or 48000; 16-bit of resolution and in stereo channels. Saturday and yesterday I tried to transfer the audio from an audio tape with 32-bit of resolution ("float" - I have no idea of what that means) and 48000 rate but the computer turned off while extracting -this never happened before.

And yes, as I have a lot of files related to graphic design, certain processes might be tough to support; it is a Windows' system computer, not Macintosh but I understand that there is not a big deal about it. I will do the defragmentation of disc and get rid of things I don't need, then hopefully it works better.

[Jhurlbs81]

Eduardo,
     It does take a long time to modify a large file.  A concert lasting 140 minutes may take 20 minutes to remove clicks and pops.  When I resample a concert it usually takes about 15 minutes per hour of recording time.  (The sample rate btw is the number of samples recorded per second.)    You should always keep that set to 44,100.  That is the sample rate for Cds.  If you set it higher you will not be able to burn the files to cd.  So be patient when editing files, in the long run it will save you a lot of time.  I will go back and forth between the PC and something else.  Start your "remove pops and clicks" and go do something else.  Once your editing is done CDWav will split all the tracks in just a few minutes.  CDWav can be downloaded for free at etree.org.  It's a great program, and very easy to use. When you play the CD back it will be perfectly seemless, whereas coping an pasting may not be perfect.

But again, if it all possible do your editing to the whole file at once, then split the tracks.   

[69mako]

In my opinion you shuld really address why your computer keeps shutting down first.  A bad power supply, bad HD, etc.

Working as one large file will definatley be quicker, easier, and provide better results.  CDWave is the only way to split tracks.  A friend turned me onto it a while ago and I've never looked back.

Mako

[EdBA]

I wanted to re-take this thread I started last year...

First of all: thank you very much again for those who replied then, your advice helped me a lot and I followed it just as you told me and it worked

The Cd Wav program is great, I really love it and it is very easy to use... it can take longer than a few minutes of course, and more because I pay a lot of attention when splitting tracks - I like to separate introductions for songs or divide very long songs in parts (when it is possible and, sometimes, necessary) and things like that.

I did the defragment to the computer and since then I have not had a single problem working with a long file.. the first show I fixed is a very long one (150 minutes) so I wanted to test the computer and it worked like an angel    The removing clicks and pops thing took around an hour!, but it didn't shut off nor nothing weird.

I now have some more doubts:

- What is removing clicks and pops??  This is the first thing I always do but I don't really know what I am doing!  Well, no, the first thing I do is to check the whole archive little by little to find cuts, strange noises that can be deleted without affecting the course of the show and things like that.. I delete the cuts and, if needed, I put very small fades out and in in order to make those cuts a bit less 'rude'.

- After removing clicks and pops I reduce the hiss. No problem with that, but what level would you recommend me to use?  The program I use to edit is the Audition of Adobe and it gives three levels of hiss reduction: light, standard and high... I normally use high but have also used the other two. Does it depend on how old the audio tape is or is there a level that is normally used?

- Then I "normalize" the file... what is that??, or why is it good to do it?

- After this I do things like "parametric equalize" or "quik filter" and both actions help to make the sound be better, with more or less treble, more or less bass, etc., I guess this depends on how the recording was made and how you want it to sound on the Cd. After trying to make it sound better, sometimes the volume is increased so I use the "amplify" option to reduce the volume so to not have distortion because of high volume.

Am I doing it correctly?, any more suggestions will be very well-received

[leshlush]

- Then I "normalize" the file... what is that??, or why is it good to do it?

- After this I do things like "parametric equalize" or "quik filter" and both actions help to make the sound be better, with more or less treble, more or less bass, etc., I guess this depends on how the recording was made and how you want it to sound on the Cd. After trying to make it sound better, sometimes the volume is increased so I use the "amplify" option to reduce the volume so to not have distortion because of high volume.

The way I see it, (and maybe someone can correct me if I'm wrong)...

When you normalize, your program finds the highest peak and the assigns it a value and then makes the rest of the wave a ratio thereof (using a mathematical equation)... Although you can set your normalize value to whatever value you choose, it usually defaults to a zero value and that's probably where you'll want it so that at your highest point is just hitting the peak w/o distortion... Essentially Normalizing your audio brings up the overall vollume by bringing up the peak values...

As far as using your EQ after Normalizing, I would say that you should probably do all your EQ work prior to Normalizing b/c once you've Normalized, your peaks are essentially where you want them to be and by doing your EQ afterwards, your peak values can again be afected and are no longer where you want or need them... Depending on your levels after you've completed your EQ work and other effects, Normalizing may no longer be required... Take a look at your levels after your done your mixdown and if they're stilll too low than you can consider Normalizing...

Be careful using the amplify option to reduce your levels, remember that you've already increased your levels(normalized), so by afterwards reducing them, your just over-processing your wave... The more processing you use, the more your sound looses it's life... If you do all your EQ work and other processing before you Normalize, chances are you won't need to re-reduce your levels and if the levels are already high enough after your processing, normalize won't be necessary...

I hope this helps... +T

[leshlush]

And just to add... Remember that when you normalize, your not only bringing up the levels on the good sound, your bringing up the levels on all of your wave and therefor increasing the noise level as well... Yet another reason why, if your going to remove clicks & pops and hiss, it should be done prior to Normalizing...

Again, I hope this helps...

[beefstew]

Most people dont like the removal of hiss - or noise reduction done. But if u think it sounds better, then go for it.

"Hiss is the breath of the recording, when you take it away - it suffocates"

[goodcooker]

i have used Audition a little so here goes.......

IMO don't over process your file
use some eq if you like (preset for hum and hiss removal in parametric eq effect is adequate and adjustable) and in the eq bus mixer you can blend the eq'd signal with the dry signal to your liking.....this works very well to keep your signal from losing it's original character
 you also might consider using the soft limit function (sparingly and blended with dry signal as above)...it can give the mix places for keyboards and horns and stuff to sit in(and sorority girls who sing the whole time).....I know that limiter is a bad word around here and tapers usually don't use it on their decks but in software editing you can just take it off if you think it sounds too squashed......

hope this helps......

[powermonkey]

I'm no PC expert, but I've had a few troubles with my PC shutting itself off, and I've looked into why it does this and what to do about it. Firstly, the machine may be overheating - the fan might be clogged up, so that is worth getting looked at. secondly, my PC kept reseting itself randomly because some of the drivers were out of date, and presumably clashed with newer software I'd installed. I fixed this by getting myself a thing called 'VersionTracker Pro' that goes through your system and keeps software and drivers up to date.

I hope that helps, and I'll leave all the sound-editting to these other folks who clearly know what they're talking about.

 

[EdBA]

Thank you all!   

I am keeping in mind your advices and put in practice what Leshlush and Beefstew said... however, I don't really like the hiss so I am still removing it. I am also not normalizing anymore unless I consider it 'necessary' and, in such case, always at the end... I just read what you Goodcooker and Powermonkey wrote, so next time I will check those functions with the parametric equalizing thing - which I don't use all the time.

[nihilistic0]

If your machine is crashing when working with large files, then take a look at the following


-unstable ram
-heat issues
-insufficient power supply

[EdBA]

Hi!

Here I am again with two new doubts...

First: a friend sent me a full concert through Internet split on two parts (which may well be disc 1 and 2) without splits, each part is a long file on mp3 format. It doesn't need a lot of edition, but if I do a few things with the sound in Audition, it is going to be saved on wav format, correct?  The simple fact of saving it in wav makes it sound better or is it still going to sound like an mp3 file even when it has the .wav extension?

Second: is it normal that, after extracting the audio (of a song or a full show) from a Cd, some noises that were not in the original Cd appear in the wave on this new extraction?  The question leads me this way: if I want to fix a show (sound and/or splits) that is already on Cd, what is better to do?: to extract -or open- the audio from the Cd and work with the file or -this may sound dumb, sorry in advance!- copy the Cd on an audio tape and do the transfer from the tape to the computer?

[BC]

Hi!

Here I am again with two new doubts...

First: a friend sent me a full concert through Internet split on two parts (which may well be disc 1 and 2) without splits, each part is a long file on mp3 format. It doesn't need a lot of edition, but if I do a few things with the sound in Audition, it is going to be saved on wav format, correct?  The simple fact of saving it in wav makes it sound better or is it still going to sound like an mp3 file even when it has the .wav extension?

it is not going to sound any better, you are limited by the sound quality of the original MP3 material, even if you later save it as a wav.