Topic: RANT: multichannel bit bucket with AES dig in.

[Sam Lord]

Where IS it?  The huge CF cards are here, the firmware is here (Alesis, Tascam, Marantz, Sound Devices, etc.), the market is here, with thousands of MOTU, Lynx, Apogee, Presonus, Mackie, et al micpre/ADCs flying out the door.  Where the @#$% is the bit bucket to store the music??  I don't trust a flimsy, non-locking laptop Firewire socket to handle a concert, nor an unneeded Mac or Win system to crash on the job--should anyone??  Sonosax R82 is the idea, just 5x too expensive... Thanks all for listening.

[balou2]

 

[gratefulphish]

Where IS it?  The huge CF cards are here, the firmware is here (Alesis, Tascam, Marantz, Sound Devices, etc.), the market is here, with thousands of MOTU, Lynx, Apogee, Presonus, Mackie, et al micpre/ADCs flying out the door.  Where the @#$% is the bit bucket to store the music??  I don't trust a flimsy, non-locking laptop Firewire socket to handle a concert, nor an unneeded Mac or Win system to crash on the job--should anyone??  Sonosax R82 is the idea, just 5x too expensive... Thanks all for listening.

How many channels are you looking for?  The R-4 Pro is four channel, and takes AES input for two of them.

[Shawn]

Where IS it?  The huge CF cards are here, the firmware is here (Alesis, Tascam, Marantz, Sound Devices, etc.), the market is here, with thousands of MOTU, Lynx, Apogee, Presonus, Mackie, et al micpre/ADCs flying out the door.  Where the @#$% is the bit bucket to store the music??  I don't trust a flimsy, non-locking laptop Firewire socket to handle a concert, nor an unneeded Mac or Win system to crash on the job--should anyone??  Sonosax R82 is the idea, just 5x too expensive... Thanks all for listening.

How many channels are you looking for?  The R-4 Pro is four channel, and takes AES input for two of them.

the R4 can't mix analog and digital signals.

[WiFiJeff]

Sonosax R82 is the idea, just 5x too expensive...

I did my first multitrack recording with the R82 last Friday, using the analog inputs.  It produces two sets of stereo tracks, one from the mic-in and one from the line-in.  The mic-in has an undefeatable limiter that kicks in at -2.5 dB, the line-in has no limiter, a bit weird.  I am very happy with the results.  By the way, using a CF card does not help battery life (says Sonosax), as the hard drive is always active, so I use the harddrive only.

I have been playing around with the dongle for digital-in, I had mine wired (unfortunately) so that tracks 5&6 were fed by an RCA input and 7&8 by AES, figuring I had flexibility that way.  Wrong.  The R82 will look for a digital signal to sync to on 5&6, if you try to input only on 7&8 you get a flashing SYNC error.  On 5&6 it is okay, though I have some noise issues feeding it from a V3 (not with feeding it from a Marantz 671, why?).  It looks like feeding two digital signals on 5&6 and 7&8 will also trigger SYNC errors if they are not externally clocked together.  But I am a novice at digi-in.

Jeff

[gratefulphish]

the R4 can't mix analog and digital signals.

The R-4 could not, but the R-4 Pro can.

[poorlyconditioned]

Exactly!  This is what we need.

The ideal product would have two, or even four optical/coax inputs and a usb port to put a "stick drive" for storage.

It is very simple from an engineering point of view, but there is just no market for this I guess.

We don't need pull down menus, an LCD display with games on it, wireless or any other crap.

I thought Len (Core sound) would pick up on this, but instead made something that requires a "pocket PC", which is just a waste of time.

  Richard

[Shawn]

the R4 can't mix analog and digital signals.

The R-4 could not, but the R-4 Pro can.

cool. I didn't know that. Honestly from a taper's perspective that's the first solid reason I've seen to upgrade to the R4 pro over the standard R4.

[gratefulphish]

That was the big one for me.  It also locks to the digital signal, as opposed to the R-4, which resamples the incoming digital signal. I also like the new sensitivity knobs, with trim controls, the locking DC power connector, the 80 gig HD, and the ability to plug in a USB drive to copy the show.

[Sam Lord]

Exactly!  This is what we need.

The ideal product would have two, or even four optical/coax inputs and a usb port to put a "stick drive" for storage.

It is very simple from an engineering point of view, but there is just no market for this I guess.

We don't need pull down menus, an LCD display with games on it, wireless or any other crap.

I thought Len (Core sound) would pick up on this, but instead made something that requires a "pocket PC", which is just a waste of time.

  Richard

Thanks Richard.  I ranted about this to Doug Oade, folks at iZ, Sweetwater, Mercenary, anybody.  My point is that the market just ballooned in the past 3 or so years with all the new high-quality location (=portable) gear out there.  For 8 or more tracks, what are the choices?  Nothing under 20 pounds (HD24, *no AES*) or if lightweight, under $4800 (sonosax r82).  What do I need (2) 744s or a Zaxcom Deva for, I have better micpres and converters.  It's nuts!

Gratefulphish, I need at least 8 channels, but 16 would be the magic number.  Try this for a location setup: 1 DAV BG-8 micpre, a Mytek, Lynx, or Apogee 8 or 16 ch ADC, and a 1RU or smaller device with a solid AES DSub or MADI or AES50 dig input.  That's 3 rack spaces if you don't spread them. (I do.)  Ideally I would run a hard drive directly connected, as Sound Devices allows, or alongside to dump CF cards when they have filled up.  Although now a 16GB CF card costs $130...equivalent hardware exists in video: the little Focus Enhancements HD4 records 25Mb/s via firewire onto a 60GB drive, see:

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=10042&A=details&Q=&sku=466732&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

at a price of $1195.  That's only fast enough for 5 channels of 24/96, but could be much faster.  CF drives would be cheaper and even more reliable.  Regards   

[gratefulphish]

I would probably start saving money for the sax, or go directly to a laptop.  I just don't know whether there will ever really be a market for more than one or two eight channel machines for the field. 

BTW, has anybody really looked into the compatability of the new larger CF cards with existing devices?  I had a friend's R-1 show a virtually new (ran first set) 8GB card show as "full" after a little more than an hour.  Maybe it was a bunk card, but I don't know how some of the devices react (if at all) to the higher capacity cards.

[JasonSobel]

BTW, has anybody really looked into the compatability of the new larger CF cards with existing devices?  I had a friend's R-1 show a virtually new (ran first set) 8GB card show as "full" after a little more than an hour.  Maybe it was a bunk card, but I don't know how some of the devices react (if at all) to the higher capacity cards.

not sure what happened with your friend's R1, but many people have successfully been using 8 gig CF cards for a while now (in the SD boxes, the Tascam HD-P2, the Marantz PMD-671, etc, etc).   and not just the big name brands, either.  most recording devices format the cards as FAT32.  whether the card is 4 gigs, 8 gigs, 16 gig, etc, etc... it should all be seen as the same kind of thing to the recording device.  while I don't know of anyone who has yet used a 16 gig card, I don't see why it wouldn't work either.

[WiFiJeff]

I ran an 8GB CF card in an R1 for a year and a half with no issues at all (other than having to start a new file at the 2GB limit manually, no seamless autostart).

Jeff

[THE NIZ BIAAAAACH!]

The r4 does not stream to the cf card.  Only transfers axisting files after the record session.

[barrettphisher]

Amen!!!  WHERE is the V4??  Grace needs to get a 4 channel 24/96 Hard Disk recorder out already.  I'll buy one as soon as they make it.  They are loosing market share like no other, they still have the V3 but I would imagine sells have fallen on these units.  Grace, please make this machine happen!!!!
Barrett