Topic: Suggestions for recording 7 voices and piano?

[Roving Sign]

I have an opportunity to record a local 7 piece gospel vocal group.

One lady sits and the others circle around/behind the piano

Pretty sure they will be unamped.

I want to be unobtrusive - but I can probably put some gear fairly close...

Should I be concerned about getting too much piano? - or does the human voice have a bit more bang than I am thinking...I would also worry about getting too much of one singer of another...

Options might be my Sony ECM999 Stereo Mic on one of the wider settings...

Spread Omnis?

One of the classic card patterns? - (i guess XY and ORTF might be best)

[Brian Skalinder]

What gear do you have at your disposal?
Will you have an opportunity to setup during rehearsal / soundcheck to get a feel for how different configs sound?

[Roving Sign]

Ok - This is in the basement of the local Synagogue - not a terrible room - 12ft cielings, but not huge - there is a small stage - I think the group actually stood in front of it - because of the piano...

I have 2 Audio Technica at10r condenser omnis - these have a nice plucky sound...
I have TEAC/Nak omnis also...

A Sony ECM999 Stereo Mic - One of the better Sony stereo mics I think this is an M/S mic - can be set for up to 270 degree pickup...

Apex 435 LD cardioids

dbx 386 tube pre/built in A/D, Yamaha MG10/2 mixer, 2 stands, plenty of Canare XLRs, 30ft 4 channel Whirlwind snake...also have Behringer 2496 A/D Converter...

Will be 16/44 > JB3

I doubt there will be a sound check - this is a few older black ladies from the area that play a few shows every couple of months...They rock - rare you get to hear something like this IMO...

Anyway - they will probably just come it and do it...its a relatively informal format...Coffee House type thing.

I will get there early enough to get set up without getting in the way...I know the fellow running the production as well. So I should be able to do what I want...

[Brian Skalinder]

MS might work well since you can control the stereo image in post.  It will also help reject some of the audience noise, if that's a factor.  Omnis probably would sound great, too, but may depend on the audience factor.  In either case, don't run too close - you want to give the voices a chance to blend.  For my a cappella recordings, I've typically run ~12' - 20' back, depending on the venue and layout.  I've also found I far prefer baffled omnis to split omnis.  I don't care for the phasing issues I get running split omnis (perhaps I need to close the distance, but in some cases have run as small as 2').

[MattD]

1 pair of cards inside the piano ORTF. Not sure if the LDs will fit unless it's a grand piano.
Mic each voice "section" separately (soprano, alto, tenor, etc) with a single mic. Mix after. I'd be worried about getting too much piano in the voice tracks, if anything. You have a lot of omnis, which might hurt you if the audience is a factor. However, if it's gospel sing-along style, that might just be badass.

[Brian Skalinder]

1 pair of cards inside the piano ORTF. Not sure if the LDs will fit unless it's a grand piano.
Mic each voice "section" separately (soprano, alto, tenor, etc) with a single mic. Mix after.

IME, with singers positioned so closely together, it'd be tough to get decent separation across the different parts and achieve any sort of useful mix and blending.  YMMV.

I like the idea of micing the piano separately, and I've had good results doing so.  I've typically run two cards, one a bit above and angled down towards the hammers, the other 3-4' down the length of the piano also angled down.  I think a safe bet would be to go with a rhythmic micing config per the DPA grand piano application guide.

[spyder9]

Any chance you can get a set of omnis/cards above the heads of the performers?  Run a big stand onstage and point the mics down at the performers?  The setup I suggest would be for a church choir, with mics hanging from the ceiling.  Should get nice separation on the singers.  Run the stand 10 feet.     

[Roving Sign]

Thanks for the suggestions guys - Im sure space will be the main factor...

Will report back later...