Topic: Entry level ($300-500) turntable recommendations

[mizary]

Hi all...  I haven't been around much lately...  but thanks to some audio/computer upgrades I have gotten into 24-bit audio - including 24/96 vinyl rips.  I think they sound awesome...  even the BAD rips with dirty everything and cheap equiptment.

So I am looking for a turntable now and figured you guys (it's still all guys on here - right? ) would be the ones to ask.

I just bought a "cheap" preamp...  the NAD PP2.

Now I need a table.

If you made me buy one today I'd probably just get a new Rega P1 for $350 shipped.  I saw one on audiogon last week for around $309 shipped.  I believe it was new.

However I'd really like to get the P2 or P3.  But the new prices are out of my range...  but used ones are right there.

I've read up a bit on Regas but don't know much about other brands...  People rave about Technics - but I'm not a DJ.  The qualities the Technics tables have don't interest me much.

A used Music Hall MMF-5 seems to be withing my price range and popular.

But I don't know crap about other brands like BIX, Thorens, Denon, yamaha, etc...  And with brands like vpi all I know is I can't afford them.

I've been looking at audiogon and ebay for deals...  any other places to look?

Is there something to be said for a NEW table?  Used ones scare me a bit.  Right now I'd rather not have to troubleshoot and work on the table I buy.  I know nothing.  Once I get a table I will keep learning and in a few years if I am still digging the vinyl I will probably upgrade.  Or I might find vinyl too bothersome and get rid of the table in a few years, which is why I'm not looking to drop $1000+ on a table/amp.

--mizary

[Invisible]

The Rega P1 and P2 are great tables for the money. I wouldn't hesitate to purchase one. The Music Halls are also nice, though I prefer the Rega.

[joekar]

Check out this site if you like, they have a nice selection of tables.

http://www.needledoctor.com/

Peace,
jk

[Kyle]

The Rega P1 and P2 are great tables for the money. I wouldn't hesitate to purchase one. The Music Halls are also nice, though I prefer the Rega.

I have a P1 and it is great. Very simple, well built, and great sound.

[carlbeck]

I would say a used Thorens is the way to go, I have a TD125 & a TD160. Nick has my 160 right now but the TD125 flat out blows it away. Look for a 160, 125, 147 or 166. There are plenty out there & tough to beat for the money, plus you can tweak the hell out of them as time goes on. Check this site out:

http://www.theanalogdept.com/thorens_dept_.htm

[powermonkey]

I don't know if you can get them over in the States (or how much they cost) but I recently got a Project Debut 3 turntable which cost just over £100 (so in the region of $200) and it sounds great to me - really good for very little money.

[shane]

I wouldn't hesitate to buy a used table if you can find a good deal locally.  I'd be real leary of having one shipped though.  Unless its being packed by someone that really knows what they're doing it could get destroyed real easy.  Turntables are pretty sensitive and UPS workers genrally are not.  If it were my money I'd go with a new Rega P1 and spend what you have left on records.  Of wait a bit and get a new P2 or P3.  The only downsides to one of those is that neither come with cartridges so you have that expense as well.

Shane 

[mizary]

Thanks for the links and recommendations.  +T's all around.

I think I am just going to hold onto my phono amp and just keep looking for a deal.  I'm in no hurry...

Plus after thinking about all the costs...  I realized I could get a playstation 3 for a few bucks more.  Sure the PS3 won't last forever like a Rega...  but it would def make me happier today.

I just got a HD tv and would have to have a source for blu-ray movies...  plus I hear you can play video games on it.

But who knows...  I might buy both, I might buy neither.

Kind of an odd choice I know...  PS3 vs a turntable.  I supposed I'll have them both (or some kind of blu-ray player) eventually...  It's more of a question of which to buy first.

Prices are more stable on turntables...  HD DVD players and blu ray players are only getting cheaper.  But I want it now!

Then again the tv I just bought is only a 720p...  HD DVD/blu-ray might make me want to buy a new 1080p tv.  I saw some animated movie on a blu-ray player on a sony xbr2 at circuit city - it was amazing.  But HD movies over cable on a cheap 720p tv looks pretty good too...

Turntables are a dangerous hobby...    I hear the gear upgrade bug got it's start in turntables back in the 1960's. 

--mizary

[powermonkey]

Thanks for the links and recommendations.  +T's all around.

I think I am just going to hold onto my phono amp and just keep looking for a deal.  I'm in no hurry...

Plus after thinking about all the costs...  I realized I could get a playstation 3 for a few bucks more.  Sure the PS3 won't last forever like a Rega...  but it would def make me happier today.

I just got a HD tv and would have to have a source for blu-ray movies...  plus I hear you can play video games on it.

But who knows...  I might buy both, I might buy neither.

Kind of an odd choice I know...  PS3 vs a turntable.  I supposed I'll have them both (or some kind of blu-ray player) eventually...  It's more of a question of which to buy first.

Prices are more stable on turntables...  HD DVD players and blu ray players are only getting cheaper.  But I want it now!

Then again the tv I just bought is only a 720p...  HD DVD/blu-ray might make me want to buy a new 1080p tv.  I saw some animated movie on a blu-ray player on a sony xbr2 at circuit city - it was amazing.  But HD movies over cable on a cheap 720p tv looks pretty good too...

Turntables are a dangerous hobby...    I hear the gear upgrade bug got it's start in turntables back in the 1960's. 

--mizary

If only the PS3 played vinyl....

 

[chris]

As Carl mentioned, the Thorens is a safe bet. Although, do NOT forget the mighty TD 150.  I've had it for 3 years and love it.  It's very open for mods down the road but sounds damn good stock.  I would upgrade the arm. 

I'm using this arm at the moment: http://cls.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls.pl?anlgtnrm&1179082271


Good luck.  Analog is a ton of fun and sounds just wonderful.

C Evans

[carlbeck]

Nope Chris is right, I should have mentioned the TD150 as well. I have an itch for a 124 in a massive plinth personally. Eventually I'll start moving towards newer gear vs. my backwards thinking 

[mizary]

hey guys... I ended up getting the P1 with the glass platter upgrade.

I bought a demo unit from a local store.

However I have a few questions (which would probably be better put in it's own thread... but ...)

The first thing I did when I got the table was drop the needle onto the felt while it was spinning. (skated off the edge of a 7")  I can't imagine that could be good for the needle.  But how bad is that?  It seems like I have some light crackles and pops even with new vinyl.  Could that be from the needle?  How can you tell if a needle is damaged or worn out?  The store said the table had 100-200 hours on it.

And if I did want to buy a new stylus any suggestions? under $100...

Also I feel like my records are lacking low end...  They seem a little bright.  Any ideas?

Also currently I don't have anything to set the table on.  So It's been on the carpet which is on concrete floors.  How much is that effecting the sound?  I know it calls for a ridgid surface - I would say carpet is the opposite.

cables...  Right now I am just using very cheap interconnects.  But the cables on the P1 don't look any higher quality.  I ordered some new ones from monoprice - but I am sure they are still miles away from audiophile quality.  But does it matter at the level I am at?

ripping...  At some point I want to rip/digitize some albums.  I have access to a UA-5 and a R-09...  my soundcard is cheap and integrated into my MB.  It has SPDIF out - but not in.  So I was thinking about using the UA-5 over USB to my computer - but if I remember correctly I though it had issues at 24/96 over usb.  And if I have to stick to 24/48 I might as well just go into the R-09.    Sure I could buy a M-Audio US41750 Audiophile 192 and go digital from the UA-5...  But I'd rather not.  It would be nice to have - but I don't think I'd get much use out of it other than rarely ripping vinyl/cassettes.  Any ideas here?  Is using the UA-5 a good/bad idea? Also I need to get all my other issues ironed out before I waste any time ripping a bunch of albums.

thanks again everyone...

Oh, and I am loving the vinyl.

It's fun to A-B the vinyl vs cd.  and vinyl vs. dvd-a (yoshimi)

I think dvd-a is very close to vinyl...  It's pretty amazing.

--mizary

[scervin]

Have you used a stylus force gauge to get proper stylus force.  That may help things.

[mizary]

no I have not.

Supposedly with the P1 you just slide the weight all the way to the front.  The guy who sold it to me told me to put it 13/16th's from the ridge on the back of the tonearm which is about 2 whole turns back from all the way on.  But that was a little too little - which is what caused the needle to skate off the 7" onto the felt.

There is also a bias slider, which doesn't seem to do anything...  it goes from 0-2. it says to set it the same as the tracking weight of the stylus.  (I think) which was like 1.5g (I think)

There is alot more to a turntable than I even knew.

--mizary

[scervin]

no I have not.

Supposedly with the P1 you just slide the weight all the way to the front.  The guy who sold it to me told me to put it 13/16th's from the ridge on the back of the tonearm which is about 2 whole turns back from all the way on.  But that was a little too little - which is what caused the needle to skate off the 7" onto the felt.

There is also a bias slider, which doesn't seem to do anything...  it goes from 0-2. it says to set it the same as the tracking weight of the stylus.  (I think) which was like 1.5g (I think)

There is alot more to a turntable than I even knew.

--mizary

Have you cleaned the "new" vinyl?  I always clean a new LP before use.  Get's all the processing junk off of it.