Topic: Rig for recording surround ambient locations

[Jonathan Starr]

I have a Protools HD studio here on Maui, and I'm starting a project to record surround sound for a still life multimedia illustration of life in pre-contact Hawaii. Various scenes in nature, with sea and birds & mountain winds etc, some with chants or hula drums etc dubbed on top.

I've got to decide on a rig. For a while I was considering a SD 744, but I'm currently leaning toward the new Apogee Ensemble Mobile, which I can pair with my Macbook and a battery pack. It will give me 4 fine pre's, and I'm thinking to mount 4 small condensers on a pole.

The files will be short, but must be really clean in 24 x 96 uncompressed .wav that I can drag into PTHD.

I also record shows of a jam band I play in, 90 minute sets. I've been using a Sony Hi-MD for this, with a Rode Stereo Mic, but I want to switch to the new rig since the Sony tracks leave much to be desired and I would like to add at least a direct vocal track.

Aloha,

Jonathan Starr
Big Gorilla Sound

[Brian Skalinder]

Budget for mics, pre, ADC, interface, total?

[Jonathan Starr]

I want to keep my new expenditures down to around 5k for this.

I have a lot of mics - pairs of Earthwork Omnis, KM184s, AT 4041s, Peluso CEM-6s, MC012s, plus various  large condensers, tube & SS. Also a new Macbook, and a stereo FMR pre that could run off 12v.

I'll need to spec out the sound system for the exhibits, which must be easy to set up and move. Initial thoughts are in the range of 4 powered EONs or Mackies on poles in the 4 cardinal locations and a sub. Perhaps run it off a laptop and the same interface used for recording.

I think we'll also need a directional mic on location.

Aloha,

Jonathan

[flintstone]

For those of us with an interest in surround sound and a budget below $5K...See pages 4 and 5 of this review on the O'Reilly Digital Media web site
http://tinyurl.com/35w46c

and this page that tells how to make a surround sound DVD with inexpensive software tools
http://tinyurl.com/yofgxh

At some point, this web page will provide samples of the H2 in surround mode to compare with two very expensive surround mic systems.
http://www.radio.uqam.ca/ambisonic/comparative_recording.html

Flintstone

[Kewl]

At some point, this web page will provide samples of the H2 in surround mode to compare with two very expensive surround mic systems.
http://www.radio.uqam.ca/ambisonic/comparative_recording.html

The comparative surround recording was part of an Ambisonic workshop that ended yesterday. If the organist gives me permission to post samples, it shouldn't be too long before there's something to listen to.

That said, we did listen to the recordings on Saturday, and the Zoom H2 held its ground quite convincingly. The most striking aspect when we did fast A-B comparisons in Nuendo was the spectral differences between the systems. The most satisfying microphone frequency-wise was the SoundField ST350.

The H2 and the AKG Blue Line mics both had different spectral signatures. Compared to the SoundField, the H2 had a noticeable lack of high frequency detail, something that I would find not acceptable if the H2 was used on its own for a music recording. But for recording surround ambiances that would be mixed later for film or video, it could certainly work.

The AKG Blue Line mics show their age in that they are derived from the AKG 451. So they do exhibit mid-high frequency presence that can be fatiguing on sounds that are already rich in that spectrum. Like a French-baroque organ...

We're left with than the spatial rendering... We'll need more listening for that as the differences are more subtle.

- Daniel

[Tim]

why pick those mics for comparison?

I've actually owned a soundfield and the bluelines and wouldn't think for a second to compare the two. Just wondering what the goal was. Thanks

[Kewl]

why pick those mics for comparison?

Because we could?

Seriously, the point was not to compare spectral performance, but spatial performance. Nevertheless, what was more evident with a first listen was the spectral difference. That said, the AKG Blue Line combo of one omni and two fig-8s allows for direct B-Format sound capture and that makes a valid comparison with a SoundField mic for the spatial performance. And the H2 is such an interesting tool that it had also to be included. The fact that the H2 surround output can be easily converted to B-Format adds to the experiment validity.

Being fully aware of the AKG Blue Line mics characteristics, I would use the combo of something like a DPA 4006-TL and two Sennheiser MKH-30 to record Native B-Format. If I had money...

- Daniel

[Nick's Picks]

i'm a soundfield fan here, so that is where my recommendation would land.

but ..., what about the core-sound A format stereo mic?

[Kewl]

i'm a soundfield fan here, so that is where my recommendation would land.

but ..., what about the core-sound A format stereo mic?

I love the SoundField too... Thankfully, I have access to one. As far as the TetraMic is concerned, I don't have access to one, but that will change in the near future as one of Ambisonic workshop participant is getting his TetraMic this week. From my point of view, the TetraMic limiting factor is the Windows-only non-realtime A to B software, but that should be adressed in the near future with a Windows and Mac OS X VST version of the A to B software.

One of the guys who worked on the TetraMic also worked on the SoundField MkIV in the 80s and he's very proud of the TetraMic. In any case, the smaller capsules on the TetraMic, and the more coincident assembly, should allow for a very good B-Format, frequency wise.

- Daniel

[Tim]

why pick those mics for comparison?

Because we could?

Seriously, the point was not to compare spectral performance, but spatial performance. Nevertheless, what was more evident with a first listen was the spectral difference. That said, the AKG Blue Line combo of one omni and two fig-8s allows for direct B-Format sound capture and that makes a valid comparison with a SoundField mic for the spatial performance. And the H2 is such an interesting tool that it had also to be included. The fact that the H2 surround output can be easily converted to B-Format adds to the experiment validity.

Being fully aware of the AKG Blue Line mics characteristics, I would use the combo of something like a DPA 4006-TL and two Sennheiser MKH-30 to record Native B-Format. If I had money...

- Daniel

thanks. I was just curious, wasn't sure if there was some rhyme or reason behind it.

[Ozpeter]

That TetraMic and its associated preamp and recorder looks extremely interesting! - thanks for the heads-up.