Topic: Question for DPA 4060/4061 users

[fmaderjr]

I just made my first recording with my DPA 4060's after many years of mostly using AT-853 cards and MM-HLC-1's. I taped a friend's cover band in a bar with a lot of crowd noise and not from very good position (table a few feet to left of the stage) because I wanted to sit. I powered them with a Church Audio ST-9100 set to about 11:00 into an iRiver iHP-120 (set at 10 DB to start and the safety clip feature eventually worked the levels down to 7.5 DB). The mics were clipped to the brim of my baseball hat.

I was amazed by how good the recording sounded compared to most of the ones I've done with other mics. Even the crowd noise didn't come through as badly as I expected it would (there was constant low level talking during the performance), but it was still pretty distracting in a lot of spots.

Does anyone have any suggestions about the best way to position these mics to minimize the crowd noise behind you? Will it do any good to clip them to the front of my shirt in order to use my body to block out some of the noise instead of clipping them to my hat? I know the best way is probably to move to another location where the noise is not so bad, but I'd like to know if there's anything you can do to improve the crowd noise rejection if you can't move much.

[Arni99]

mail sent .

[Belexes]

I use to run 4061's > ST-9100.  The higher the mics the better. You are doing yourself no service by putting them down by your neck and using your body as a baffle.  Sometimes all you can do about the crowd is to move if it's too chatty, but them you sacrifice what may be the best taping position in the house.

Which makes me wonder why non-tapers always seen to be drawn to where I need to be to tape! Always seems that way...

[Gutbucket]

I use to run 4061's > ST-9100.  The higher the mics the better. You are doing yourself no service by putting them down by your neck and using your body as a baffle.  Sometimes all you can do about the crowd is to move if it's too chatty, but them you sacrifice what may be the best taping position in the house.

Which makes me wonder why non-tapers always seen to be drawn to where I need to be to tape! Always seems that way...

I respectfully disagree.  Generally yes, higher is better becuase you can get the mics above the clutter of bodies and more up into the clean air, but as long as you have a clear path from the mics to the sound source you can get a very nice attenuation to the rear by using some kind of baffle.  That can work very if the yappers are behind the baffle.  I find the neck area gets you no rear attenuation and no advantage over head worn.  I prefer a wider spacing than my skinny neck anyway.

[edit] it also makes the blocking of sound by your cooperative girlfriend or buddies more effective if they move between the mics and the chatters.

[2nd edit in afterthought after Moke's wise comments]

[Gutbucket]

It's your friend's band?

Can you put the mics at the stage lip?  That will reduce the chatter the most just by getting closer to the band than the yappers.  Quite easy to do with such a small, low-profile rig too.  Vocals though the PA could be weak though.  Then you can also wander freely, and sit wherever you want.

[ilduclo]

I actually have had pretty good results with taping each 4061 to either side of a
menu holder at a bar, then using my jacket to hood the whole thing from all but a 12" wide opening facing the stage. This was needed due to noise from the kitchen of the bar, which included the dishwasher, the telephone and clinking glasses/crashing pots and pans. All this was amplified by the really horrible echo-ey acoustics of the place. First recording I did in this place without the "baby jecklin" and baffle was awful, the last one with the full set up sounded really pretty good, decent stereo separation and very little extraneous noise....

[grider]

why not buy some DPA mic clips and put those mics onto an actual mic stand, up eight to ten feet?  that would help out substantially; plus, you must remember these DPA's are omnidirectional and capture sound 360 degrees, whereas your former cards had no rear lobe and were directional and were not intended to capture sound to the rear of the capsules

[Gutbucket]

Or buy 50 yards of disposable mic clip/clamp for less than the price of one real DPA clip or one real clap.  Figuring a generous 2" per mic mounting, you've got about 900 mic clips per roll.  Doesn't take much to secure those little guys.

[fmaderjr]

Thanks guys for all your extremely helpful suggestions. Will try a few of them that involve baffling the mics including one provided by arni99 in an email. Like the ideas of taping them to a menu holder and using the back of a chair as a baffle (both brilliant!) as well as trying to place the mics on the stage lip.

It's encouraging to know that there are ways to make these great sounding mics sound even better.

grider-I do have clips for them but couldn't use a mic stand with a large spread-I'm pretty sure the bar wouldn't like it-people dance close to the stage for one thing.

Belexes-I appreciate your opinion as well. However, my hearing probably isn't so hot anymore and I'm guessing reduced crowd noise will sound better to me than possibly losing some frequency response that I probably wouldn't hear anyway. Will just have to try a few diffent methods and see.

[Belexes]

Belexes-I appreciate your opinion as well. However, my hearing probably isn't so hot anymore and I'm guessing reduced crowd noise will sound better to me than possibly losing some frequency response that I probably wouldn't hear anyway. Will just have to try a few diffent methods and see.

No problem, all a matter of experimentation. I am on the "higher the mics the better" team, but Gotbucket made some valid considerations.

[it-goes-to-eleven]

Does anyone have any suggestions about the best way to position these mics to minimize the crowd noise behind you?

Clip'em to the performer's facial hair!

[grider]

Thanks guys for all your extremely helpful suggestions. Will try a few of them that involve baffling the mics including one provided by arni99 in an email. Like the ideas of taping them to a menu holder and using the back of a chair as a baffle (both brilliant!) as well as trying to place the mics on the stage lip.

It's encouraging to know that there are ways to make these great sounding mics sound even better.

grider-I do have clips for them but couldn't use a mic stand with a large spread-I'm pretty sure the bar wouldn't like it-people dance close to the stage for one thing.

Belexes-I appreciate your opinion as well. However, my hearing probably isn't so hot anymore and I'm guessing reduced crowd noise will sound better to me than possibly losing some frequency response that I probably wouldn't hear anyway. Will just have to try a few diffent methods and see.

one great little trick we use where I live in a small jazz supper club, where we always get front table center, is a small table top microphone stand, that is just 12 inches high, about head height, and we place it in the middle of the table and roll tape, so simple and low pro, cost me about $25 at the Guitar Center

[bluntforcetrauma]

"Sound" is omnipresent and the mics are omni directional, no real way to get away  from sound but--get as close to the sound source as possible, where the music can not be " talked over" while playing. don't worry about between song chatter.  I would get in front of one of the PA sources, set the pre- as low as you can go without clipping, the music itself will drown out any talkers, chatter, etc


I have pulls using the DPA 4061> include Pearl Jam at the gorge, in Washington state in 2005 and 2006.

[bluntforcetrauma]

hey if security is looking for pinky size mics  then dam its meant to be to get caught.  C'mon, its not the mics they see, its the funny behavior that is suspect for security.

[Gutbucket]

True.  But why give 'em the inside line.  People have been shut down by information gleaned from TS searches in the past.
Thanks and +T,

Peace