Topic: Recording acoustic guitar: budget <$400

[sfmartins]

I have reviewed several threads on the topic, so I focused my question to the following

Equipment
- Acoustic guitar Martin D35, with factory installed Fishman Premium Blend with Mic + Piezo
- Acoustic Amplifier Ultrasound DS3
- MacBook

Details
- Record only 1 acoustic guitar
- Both fingerstyle and picking
- Guitar only and guitar + pedal effects (e.g., Tommy Emmanuel, Tim Reynolds, Dave Matthews)
- No need for portability

Budget: <$400

I had suggestions for a PreSonus AudioBox USB with a Shure SM57.

What do you guys think?
Any opinions are very welcome!

Thank you very much!

[PH]

You would probably be better off with an Apogee Duet. I know several local musicians who have recorded an entire record using their duet, macbook, and logic.

I would borrow the mics instead of buying them or it could get very expensive. If you must buy, think about Cascade Fathead II Ribbons or Studio Projects C4's. They are both iin the $300 range for a pair and both will work well on acoustic guitar. You can vary the distance from the guitar and each other to achieve different type of results for flatpicking, fingerstyle, or strumming.

Someone you know has a nice pair of mics they would let you use for that reason. If you know a taper, he might even come over and record it for you to gain the experience.
Many musicians I know will set themselves up with a simple two channel signal chain for the purpose of putting down demos and doing overdubs on other projects.

Preamp/AD combos such as the API A2D or Grace m201 would make good front end signal chains to get into your system.
The Apogee Duet works pretty well from what I've heard too, decent preamps and excellent converters and gets you directly into your DAW.
Goodluck, PHil

[sfmartins]

Thanks a lot for the tips.

I think, however, that goes a bit over my budget of $400 for the interface + mics.
This is mostly for simple home recording, not professional at all.

My suggestions for mics so far were:

- Studio Projects B1 ($100)
- Audio Technica AT-3031 ($170)
- Rode NT1A Cardioid Microphone RD-NT1A ($220)
- Rode NT5-S ($220)

As for the interface

- PreSonus AudioBox USB ($150) [Firebox for $300 is already over budget]

Any other suggestions?

Thank you all for the time.

[PH]

You can't really get anything decent in that budget range if you are trying to buy both mics, preamp, and interface.
I feel you would be better off just paying an engineer for his time at a small project studio, and get better results.
You could easily get a full day of demos for that price. It would be much better quality than trying to buy all of that gear on your budget.
Another option would be waiting until you have a budget for the Duet and some of those mics mentioned. That is your best long term option, Patience

[sfmartins]

I see. Guess I really need to increase the budget.

What do you think of the Presonus Firebox? It would be $200 below the Apogee, but people seem to thing the preamps are not great.

Any opinions on the comparison of Cascade Fathead II Ribbons, Studio Projects C4, Pair Rode nt5, or Rode nt4?

Thanks again.

[Church-Audio]

This is one of the best acoustic guitar mics. I love the sound of this mic.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-AKG-C-451-EB-Condenser-Microphone_W0QQitemZ110351656659QQihZ001QQcategoryZ41466QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

The M-AUDIO omni studio can be had for $100 and has alot of monitoring features and will do 24/96k the most underated interface in the history of interfaces

http://cgi.ebay.com/M-Audio-OmniStudio-USB-Digital-Recording-Interface_W0QQitemZ150326397347QQihZ005QQcategoryZ41784QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[PH]

There is a pair of C4's in the yard sale now for $200ish. Those are great low budget mics, I highly recomend them. I've used them in my studio many times on the fretboard of an acoustic bass, high hat, mandolin and I've used them on stage for acoustic guitar and mandolin. Great mics.

That would leave you about $150 for an interface. I don't know much about those low-budget interfaces, especially in the mac realm. 
I've heard raves about the duet from musician friends of mine who are religious about their macs. They love the way it sounds and how seamlessy it integrates into their system.

I like Presonus stuff, but does it work with mac? And what software are you going to be using, that's a very important factor. 

[sfmartins]

Well, putting everything together, the best seems to be

- Pair of Studio Projects C4's (~$280) or of Rode NT5 (~$350)
- PreSonus AudioBox USB (~$150) or PreSonus Firebox (~$300)

Which is between $400-650.
I will probably make the final decision according to cheap deals I find here on the forum, ebay, craigs, etc.

Also, are there any particular stores you guys recommend?

Thanks again.

[PH]

What software are you going to be running? I'm not sure that the presonus stuff plays nice with macs and I know it won't work with Protools.

[sfmartins]

I was planning to use GB or Logic, and they seem to be compatible.
The issue is that the new Macs don't have FW 400, which affects even the purchase an Apogee Duet.

[PH]

Shoulda bought a PC........ just kidding you.
Good luck, like I said sometimes it's easier, better, and cheaper to hire a professional to record your music for you.
Once you start acquiring gear, it's endless. The fever will hit you and won't let you go, ever.

[Javier Cinakowski]

With that fishman combo you won't need to count on the external mic too much.  I would worry most about the computer interface.  The computer interface is the backbone of this project or anything you do in the future....

If you do feel the need to get the natural tones of a external mic, I would find the cheapest NT5 or C4 I could get on ebay.  Both of those mics are very similar.  I like the NT5 more for guitar and near-field.  The C4 I prefer for difuse-field....

I have found a peizo/internal mic combo can sound really natural if you run them through a BBE sonic maximizer or other aural exciter before the DI/mixer/PA.  Perhaps you would get more use out of that in your rig, than buying a mic....

[goodcooker]

I recorded some nice sounding acoustic guitar and mandolin tracks with
(1) Audio Technica 4040 pointed at the 12th fret from ~one foot away
(1) Studio Projects C4 omni over my right ear pointed down at the sound hole
into a Presonus Firebox.


The mic pres in the Firebox are nothing fancy but they are suitable for home/project use. The a>d is just fine and I still use it (with an external pre nowadays) for demos and such.

[ghellquist]

My suggestion is to go the low budget way for a start. The Studio Projects B1 is a long time favourite around here, I have been recommending it to new starters for the last 4 years or so. It works well both on voice, acoustic instruments and amplifiers. I have not tried the Presonus box, but as long as nothing undue happens with compatibility you will probably be just fine with that one. The feature set looks all right to me.

For best acoustical sound, treat yourself to a nicely sounding room. When recording acoustical guitar I like placing the player on a hardwood floor but having the room rather damped otherwise. Point the active side of the mic (not the top) at about 12th fret slightly towards the sound hole. No amplification in this case.

When recording the amplifier, place it in a well dampened room and on a rug. Again point the active side of the mic to the best sounding place of the speaker, often halfway between middle of speaker and the edge. (You see the speakers through the fabric in front of them).

Once you have tried working with this combination for a while, you might want to go on to other equipment, but this is a very good starting point that probably will serve you well for many years. The important thing to remember with acoustical instruments is that the room where you record really influences the sound at least as much as the mic you use.

// Gunnar

[dbindc]

I've got a Presonus Firebox I'm not using much these days.  Worked fine with my old ti Powerbook in Peak and DP.   I could let it go for $150 plus shipping/PP if you're interested. 

Also have an AT 822 stereo mic that doesn't sound bad on close miced acoustic guitar.