Topic: ZOOM M2 M3 M4 MicTrak Recorders - 32 bit float dual ADC one-piece devices

[commongrounder]

It could be the Primo EM200 then  https://www.micbooster.com/datasheets/EM200.pdf

Very similar specs to those of the M4 published by Zoom

I did wonder that, but I have also wondered previously if the Sony D100 uses those capsules.

They are very decent capsules, and not cheap. If the Zoom M4 does use them it means that for the price I’ve paid on eBay I’ve almost got the recorder for nothing!

I’m pretty sure the Tascam Portacapture X8 uses the Primo EM200 capsules (I’ve had the mic heads apart and see telltale markings), and can say with almost complete certainty that the Sony PCM-D100 does not use Primo EM200 capsules. I think Sony either made their own capsules, or has custom units made to their spec. I own both the X8 and D100, and comparison recordings are both outstandingly good, but slightly different.

[rastasean]

Niels, you could consider a file sharing site like https://wetransfer.com/

The file won't be available forever, but it's free, fast, and I don't think an account is needed.

[Niels]

Wetransfer only allows 3 days for free, so I will rather make it available through Google Drive - I can leave it up longer than that.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cBghGGQCk3xBPNUEyeeHFOeYgKoTlUzP/view?usp=sharing

Let me know if there are access issues.

Description of the recording: Frog chirping, crows and trains crossing river.


Location: Tama River. Kawasaki city, Japan.

Google Map:
https://www.google.com/maps/d/edit?mid=1FHDGCOvlv0ctvsDuJ4JriONc5dlkM3s&usp=sharing

Recorder Zoom M4 Mictrak on a table tripod placed on the ground (concrete) at the purple indicator on the map.
Internal mics used.
Manufactures included wind protection was used.
Lo-cut set to 80Hz

Recorder points towards the riverbank (along the red line on the map) where I heard frogs (circa 10 meters away) - See exact location on linked map above.
40 meters further away from the frogs is a train bridge (the loudest train on the recording)
Additional two train bridges are located 120 meters further up stream from the first bridge (the other trains on the recording).
300m behind me (opposite of the direction the recorder is pointing) is a busy 6 car lane bridge.

Weather: Sunny 29°C with a very light breeze towards the recorder

The recording was normalized and exported to 24bit in the recorder. No other processing.

Comments: The trains sounds a little louder in the right channel because of the direction the recorder was pointed.

Don't know if this is of use to anyone.
Field recording examples are very difficult to evaluate without good knowledge of the properties of the location.

[adrianb]

Wetransfer only allows 3 days for free, so I will rather make it available through Google Drive - I can leave it up longer than that.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cBghGGQCk3xBPNUEyeeHFOeYgKoTlUzP/view?usp=sharing

Let me know if there are access issues.

Description of the recording: Frog chirping, crows and trains crossing river.

Location: Tama River. Kawasaki city, Japan.

I’m quite impressed with that, especially considering it’s a budget recorder with internal microphones.

I look forward to doing some comparisons with my Sony D100.

[adrianb]

My Zoom M4 MicTrak recorder arrived yesterday and I’ve spent today doing some comparison recordings alongside my Sony D100.

I have to say that I am really impressed with the Zoom M4. It holds up really well in comparison to the D100, and you would have to pay four times as much on a used one. If I was to listen to the recordings blind I don’t think I would be able to distinguish between them, although the M4 seems a bit less vulnerable to wind noise.

I still hate the form factor though, and the shiny plastic. The advantage of this, and the low cost, is that I am going to feel a lot less bothered about getting it scuffed and damaged so imagine it will get a lot of use.

[ICatchSounds]

My Zoom M4 MicTrak recorder arrived yesterday and I’ve spent today doing some comparison recordings alongside my Sony D100.

I have to say that I am really impressed with the Zoom M4. It holds up really well in comparison to the D100, and you would have to pay four times as much on a used one. If I was to listen to the recordings blind I don’t think I would be able to distinguish between them, although the M4 seems a bit less vulnerable to wind noise.

I still hate the form factor though, and the shiny plastic. The advantage of this, and the low cost, is that I am going to feel a lot less bothered about getting it scuffed and damaged so imagine it will get a lot of use.

Yes, I am finding the M4 way better than expected.  I am almost positive the M4 and the H5 Studio share the same mic capsules.

[Ozpeter]

Shiny plastic is intended to reduce handling noise.  I deliberately used the word "intended"!  But I can understand reservations about its appearance and form factor.  Well, just close your eyes and enjoy the audio...

[Niels]

Shiny plastic is intended to reduce handling noise.

That is Zoom's way of spinning their problem with the matte "rubber" surface finish going sticky. The handling noise on the M4 does not qualify as "better" than any other handheld recorder I have used.
But if one can incorporate the unit's form factor into one's workflow, then I don't think this recorder will disappoint.

At this point, my greatest gripe with the M4 is that normalisation/export to 24bit has to be done on each individual file. Which is a non-issue for those who do that outside the device or only have to do a few.

[adrianb]

It’s quite a breezy day here today, so just spent a couple of hours comparing all the handhelds currently in my ownership. The Zoom M4 and Sony M10 were the only ones that could produce usable recordings, and the latter are omni mics so not comparable really.

I’m getting to be really impressed with the M4. I guess the good wind performance is due to the cage, sort of like a mini baby ball gag.

[mepaca]

I got this dead kitten https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CWYRFMKZ?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1 from
Amazon. I recorded an all acoustic stage all day long with my M2 on a very breezy day with no wind noise. For what
it is and what it costs the M2 is pretty amazing. I played it back over headphones for some of the performers and
they couldn't believe how good it sounded and a few said they were going to buy one. It's great for a run and gun
situation with minimal hassle.

[adrianb]

I got this dead kitten https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CWYRFMKZ?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_fed_asin_title&th=1 from
Amazon. I recorded an all acoustic stage all day long with my M2 on a very breezy day with no wind noise. For what
it is and what it costs the M2 is pretty amazing. I played it back over headphones for some of the performers and
they couldn't believe how good it sounded and a few said they were going to buy one. It's great for a run and gun
situation with minimal hassle.

I assume the M2 has the same capsules as the M4 and arranged in a similar way to that described in the video provided by ICatchSounds?

If it does then the M2 is being sold at about the same price as buying the capsules alone!

I’m now seriously considering buying the M2 as well.

The dead cat from my Sony D100 fits my M4 perfectly. Since a breezy day was unable to create wind rumble in the M4 I’ve just been holding it in front of a fan and still not been able to create rumble to destroy the recording … just the noise of a fan.

[Ozpeter]

I guess the M2 (and M3) simply have to have good capsules, as otherwise there would be no point to using them, as no other input is provided.  And as I've probably said before, going to the lengths of equipping them with F series preamps and dual ADCs would be pointless if fed from crap capsules.  And apart from the actual sound, the 135dB SPL rating is pretty good too.  I just wish I had more opportunities to actually use them!

[adrianb]

I guess the M2 (and M3) simply have to have good capsules, as otherwise there would be no point to using them, as no other input is provided.  And as I've probably said before, going to the lengths of equipping them with F series preamps and dual ADCs would be pointless if fed from crap capsules.  And apart from the actual sound, the 135dB SPL rating is pretty good too.  I just wish I had more opportunities to actually use them!

It shouldn’t be a surprise that the quality of the capsules used are good for the reasons you give, and my initial use has resulted in some good quality recordings.

What has really surprised me is their performance in windy conditions. All the cardioid mics I’ve used have been terrible in windy conditions, and I’ve spent a fortune on dead cats and wind protection. This is not related to quality since even my Sennheiser 8040 mics are defeated by the slightest breeze unless I hide them in an expensive blimp.

Yet it seems that currently for £99 I can buy an M2 that sounds as good as my Sony D100 without any wind noise issues. Due to all the negative initial reviews I managed to get an M4 for just £130 with all that plus the extra flexibility.

I would often postpone a hike and recording session because it was too breezy, now I’m looking forward to trying the M4 out in the field with the addition of two pluggy mics on the side.

[Niels]

And as I've probably said before, going to the lengths of equipping them with F series preamps and dual ADCs would be pointless if fed from crap capsules. 

I don't think the M2 & M3 have F series preamps. I have only seen F series preamps mentioned by Zoom in relation to the XLR input on the M4.
But regardless, your point about crap capsules makes sense.

[Ozpeter]

Hmm.  Vendors of the M2 mention F series internals (eg B&H, quoted below) though that doesn't appear on the actual Zoom publicity.  However, the vendor mentions are a bit obscure - eg..

"The M2 MicTrak is designed to fuse the professional guts and features of the F-Series recorders with the convenience and portable form factor of the Handy Series. "

"Dual AD converter circuits, derived from the F-Series, make manual input gain adjustment unnecessary "

Interesting B&H use exactly the same wording in their M3 and M4 blurb.

So - who can tell.  Just leave me with my dream that I have a couple of F series recorders for a fraction of the price!