Topic: Zoom’s 32-bit float m/s - Instamic Pro Plus C

[adrianb]

My Instamic arrived today but it seems to be faulty. It’s a Pro Plus C Stereo, and thats what the label says on the back, but it’s only recognised in the App as a mono. When selecting the device it has an “M” icon top right which I believe makes it the mono version.

I think somebody has badged up some mono devices with the stereo packaging.

Very annoying because it was the mid-side stereo capabilities I was interested in and was planning on doing some comparative recordings this weekend.

[Klove68]

My towns art center had a show recently and I thought it was a good chance to run multiple rigs in a relatively good sounding room to do a comparison. The band was Life In A Blender and I ran DPA 4080's into an MMA-A/iphone, CK 61 caps into an F3, Core Sound HEBs into a Sony A 10, the instamic (stereo setting) and a Zoom M4. Everything but the M4 was in/on my hat, the M4 was on the table with a napkin covering it. No post production was done to any file except for making the levels roughly equal.

https://drive.proton.me/urls/2FQKH7XWG4#9XIKlzna7mAa

[adrianb]

Thank you very much for these comparisons Klove68.

I think, and expected, the Instamic to be the least good of the examples. But, and it’s a big but, totally listenable and if that was your backup recording you would be really happy with it.

Considering it’s size and price it really is quite amazing.

[Klove68]

Agree 100%. Its a good backup and perfect for the rare case when you just can't bring in any other gear.

[adrianb]

Agree 100%. Its a good backup and perfect for the rare case when you just can't bring in any other gear.

As I said previously I’ve not recorded a gig in over a year because I just can be bothered with the preparation anymore. This will possibly become my recorder of choice, and will start taking it to gigs again. Maybe buy another one and have one on each shoulder.

For those happy with their 24-bit recording gear for gigs, who might be tempted by a 32-bit recorder, I could argue buy one of these instead.

[todd e]

I have the app setting for 24/48 and the mics power up that way only if I have the app open before I pair them. If the mics are turned on first, default settings are used.

'them' so you use two stereo's or two monos?  maybe i asked already apologies

[datbrad]

I meant a pair of the mono version. I think most of the value in the stereo version is with a single unit on a camera's hotshoe mount. For concerts, I reflexively chose a pair of monos to run A/B in the open, or HRTF when I can't be open. Plus, the SNR spec of the mono is 5db better than the stereo version so there's that.....

[dallman]

Because the stereo version only records in mono for 32Bit, I looked for the differences in the 2 models especially regarding 32Bit float. Here is what I found:

If The Zoom Instamic Pro Plus C records mono for 32 bit, in 32 bit what is the difference between the stereo and mono models?

The main difference is the stereo model has two extra microphones and offers more recording modes, including Stereo and Mid-Side (M/S), which are unavailable on the mono-only model. Both models only record in mono when utilizing the 32-bit float capability, with other modes available in 24-bit.

Recording Capabilities:

Both versions of the Zoom Instamic Pro Plus C can record in 32-bit float in the Mono mode only. This mode uses the main four-microphone array to capture a single channel of audio, which is suitable for clear voice-centric recordings like interviews.
The core difference is the flexibility offered by the stereo model in 24-bit recording:
Mono Model: Records in Mono (32-bit float/24-bit) and Dual-Mono (24-bit). Dual-Mono sends the same mono signal to both left and right channels for post-production consistency.
Stereo Model: Includes two additional lateral microphones and offers all the modes of the mono model, plus dedicated Stereo and Mid-Side (M/S) modes in 24-bit.
Stereo mode provides authentic left/right channel separation for ambience and music.
Mid-Side mode allows for an adjustable stereo image, providing flexible spatial control in editing. This mode utilizes all six microphones.
Signal-to-Noise Ratio (SNR)

Due to the extra microphones and the processing involved in creating the stereo image, the mono version actually has a slightly better signal-to-noise ratio (SNR) of 72dB(A) compared to the stereo version's 67dB(A) when used in their respective core functions. This makes the mono model potentially better for scenarios where the absolute cleanest mono signal is the priority.

[hardrain62]

Just received my stereo Pro Plus C in the mail. Man, this thing is fun and the adjustability/flexibility in conjunction with the app is very nice. I haven't had a chance yet to  with it, but it seems promising. As adrianb said, I also at this point in my life, depending on my mood, feel a little fatigue with the whole production that goes into stealthing, so this could be the cure for that; pop it in a hat, check the levels on your phone and let it roll. What I think is most exciting about this mic/recorder is actually maybe not the unit itself, but what it could be signaling. We've seen similar offerings from Hollyland and others that have been close but not usable for our use case; either mic sensitivity that's too high, max SPL being too low, no 24 or 32-bit, too bulky, no on-board recording, etc. The Pro Plus C could be the first of its kind that could really serve the purpose we need in a tiny package. Exciting!

[mepaca]

Just received my stereo Pro Plus C in the mail. Man, this thing is fun and the adjustability/flexibility in conjunction with the app is very nice. I haven't had a chance yet to  with it, but it seems promising. As adrianb said, I also at this point in my life, depending on my mood, feel a little fatigue with the whole production that goes into stealthing, so this could be the cure for that; pop it in a hat, check the levels on your phone and let it roll. What I think is most exciting about this mic/recorder is actually maybe not the unit itself, but what it could be signaling. We've seen similar offerings from Hollyland and others that have been close but not usable for our use case; either mic sensitivity that's too high, max SPL being too low, no 24 or 32-bit, too bulky, no on-board recording, etc. The Pro Plus C could be the first of its kind that could really serve the purpose we need in a tiny package. Exciting!

Just remember that when the bluetooth connection to the app fails, and it probably will, that it is still recording which is a good thing.

[adrianb]

Received my replacement Stereo Pro C from Amazon yesterday, and had some time to test it today.

Obviously a negative to start with receiving a Mono labelled and packaged as a Stereo. It doesn’t give me a lot of faith in their quality control, but let’s hope it was just a one-off. The customer support was excellent in responding to my questions.

As to the product itself it really is a little wonder, and great fun too. I’ve been for a walk in the woods, and have tested it alongside my Sony PCM-D100. No wind at all so no wind protection on either device, and I know how susceptible the D100 is to wind noise, so I cannot comment on the Instamic’s performance in breezy conditions. I have to say, using it as a field recorder (which it isn’t really designed for) and I’m really impressed.

The quality of the recordings are not as good as the D100, and I didn’t expect them to be, but not bad at all. Stereo separation was good for such a small device, and the noise floor seemed okay to me.

If you like stealth field recordings as I do, on the beach, traffic, people in busy places, then this is a very useful device. There has been lots of times when I’ve wished I had a recording device with me and I plan on having the Instamic with me all the time, but it will also be great to use it as a backup.

I have a gig on Friday and look forward to using it in that scenario too.

[dmbfan36_23]

Just unboxed my new Stereo version and planning to try it out for Nine Inch Nails tonight. Any tips? I'm going to have it on the top of a winter beanie, plan to point the mic array forward. Is stereo or "mid-side" better to run?

Also, how do you get the firmware updated with a Mac?! Every time I get to step two and try to hold down the button for the "2 LEDs" to turn off, it either A. starts recording, or B. powers down. It makes no sense.

[Gutbucket]

I don't have one but have been following the thread.

Probably best to run Mid Stereo mode assuming that produces a raw Mid/Side recording, since that should give the the most options and flexibly, retaining a fully unmolested mono Mid channel and allowing you to dial in the M/S ratio to best effect afterward.  Stereo mode will "bake in" the ratio and resulting "stereoness", but will produce a recording that does not require M/S to L/R conversion afterward.

Curious, is it also possible to set the stereo version to record in mono, as 32bit float?  I assume so.  Thinking about running multiple stereo versions of these things and using a few in mono where appropriate.

[dmbfan36_23]

allowing you to dial in the M/S ratio to best effect afterward

Any Mac software recommendations for doing this? I might just run regular stereo for my first trip out with it, but mid-stereo sounds interesting in the future.

Curious, is it also possible to set the stereo version to record in mono, as 32bit float?  I assume so.  Thinking about running multiple stereo versions of these things and using a few in mono where appropriate.

Yes, the stereo version can do 32/96 mono and you can pair two (or more) together to make stereo/multi-channel 32-bit recordings. The native stereo and mid-side modes only do 24/48.

[Gutbucket]

allowing you to dial in the M/S ratio to best effect afterward

Any Mac software recommendations for doing this? I might just run regular stereo for my first trip out with it, but mid-stereo sounds interesting in the future.

Lots of plugins to do it. Your editor might have a built-in routine to do it. Or you can do it manually in any editor (or analog mixer) by assigning a copy of the Side channel to an additional channel and inverting it's polarity.  The mono Mid channel gets panned center, the non-inverted Side channel panned hard left, polarity inverted copy panned hard right.  Vary the level of both Side channels together to dial in the desired stereo width.  No side at all = Mono.

Here's a good Mid/Side conversion plugin (free)- https://www.voxengo.com/product/msed/