Best line in recorder?

[Justinasia]

What do you think is the best recorder for using only the line input? I was thinking of a small setup for quiet acoustic music, something like this:

DPA 4060> CA ST-9100 > line in recorder

I would love the quality of the SONY PCM-D50, but without the weight and bulk. Is there anything comparable? Don't need internal mics nor pre, just good line in and battery life. I was thinking the Olympus LS-10 could be good, but read here that the line in has no gain, and mic in is bad for bass. Would gain be a necessity for a good recording of such quiet non-amplified music? Any better suggestions?

[digifish_music]

What do you think is the best recorder for using only the line input? I was thinking of a small setup for quiet acoustic music, something like this:

DPA 4060> CA ST-9100 > line in recorder

I would love the quality of the SONY PCM-D50, but without the weight and bulk. Is there anything comparable? Don't need internal mics nor pre, just good line in and battery life. I was thinking the Olympus LS-10 could be good, but read here that the line in has no gain, and mic in is bad for bass. Would gain be a necessity for a good recording of such quiet non-amplified music? Any better suggestions?

R09HR is very nice.

digifish

[sunjan]

I was thinking the Olympus LS-10 could be good, but read here that the line in has no gain, and mic in is bad for bass. Would gain be a necessity for a good recording of such quiet non-amplified music?

R09HR is very nice.

digifish

What he said.
ST-9100 has plenty of gain. R09HR at unity should be enough, unless you're recording something very quiet. 
The

[Justinasia]

What he said.
ST-9100 has plenty of gain. R09HR at unity should be enough, unless you're recording something very quiet. 
The

Hi Sunjan
You said at the end "The" - were you about to say something more? What do you reckon about the LS-10 line input? There's no gain, but could I just increase the levels afterwards with software? Would that be the same as having gain, or would it be worse in terms of noise or distortion?

Thanks.

[sunjan]

Hi Sunjan
You said at the end "The" - were you about to say something more? What do you reckon about the LS-10 line input? There's no gain, but could I just increase the levels afterwards with software? Would that be the same as having gain, or would it be worse in terms of noise or distortion?

Sorry, I was rambling.

The Olympus LS-10 needs a very loud signal going line in. And there's no gain at all!
It is workable with high-sensitive mics, but Chris Church advises strongly against it, especially if you intend to record acoustic stuff:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,96477.msg1504687.html#msg1504687

Guysonic came to the same conclusion too:
http://taperssection.com/index.php/topic,103380.msg1389869.html#msg1389869

Sure, you can boost the levels in post, but that will increase the noise floor. Digital gain is never desirable.

Don't create headache if you can avoid it, get a R-09HR or at least something with better sensitivity than LS-10.

[Dede2002]

R-09HR all the way.

[John Willett]

I was thinking the Olympus LS-10 could be good, but read here that the line in has no gain, and mic in is bad for bass. Would gain be a necessity for a good recording of such quiet non-amplified music? Any better suggestions?

I am very happy with my LS-10 - and Olympus have released upgraded firmware is the last couple of weeks for it.

Otherwise, the Fostex FR-2LE is an excellent recorder (but not so small).

[Justinasia]

Hi John
Fostex FR-2LE is great yes, but I am thinking of a small very portable setup.
Have you been using your LS-10 with an external pre?

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

Does anyone have the link for the size comparisons of the various recorders? There were a couple posted here on the forum but after searching again I can't find them. Really helps to give a visual image of the 3D volume of these things.

[Belexes]

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

I have an R-09 and a D50 and the D50 is so quiet that I prefer it over the R-09.  To me, it's worth the bulk.

I still use the R-09 and when I need a very small setup for very stealthy operations.

[Justinasia]

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

I have an R-09 and a D50 and the D50 is so quiet that I prefer it over the R-09.  To me, it's worth the bulk.

You're talking line level in, right? If so that's very interesting. I see you also have the Fostex FR-2LE. Would you say the difference between the noise of the R-09HR line in and D50 line is, is a bigger difference than the D50 mic in and the FR-2LE mic in?

Seeing as you have all 3 of these units, I'd really love your opinion so I'll explain a little more. I was actually thinking of having the FR-2LE as my serious recorder, and a smaller option for when I need to travel lighter, but hopefully also good quality. If you only had your Fostex, and you needed what I do, would you buy the R-09HR, the D50, or a different unit?

[johnw]

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

I have an R-09 and a D50 and the D50 is so quiet that I prefer it over the R-09.  To me, it's worth the bulk.

You're talking line level in, right? If so that's very interesting. I see you also have the Fostex FR-2LE. Would you say the difference between the noise of the R-09HR line in and D50 line is, is a bigger difference than the D50 mic in and the FR-2LE mic in?

Seeing as you have all 3 of these units, I'd really love your opinion so I'll explain a little more. I was actually thinking of having the FR-2LE as my serious recorder, and a smaller option for when I need to travel lighter, but hopefully also good quality. If you only had your Fostex, and you needed what I do, would you buy the R-09HR, the D50, or a different unit?

^ I have the exact same question!

[Belexes]

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

I have an R-09 and a D50 and the D50 is so quiet that I prefer it over the R-09.  To me, it's worth the bulk.

You're talking line level in, right? If so that's very interesting. I see you also have the Fostex FR-2LE. Would you say the difference between the noise of the R-09HR line in and D50 line is, is a bigger difference than the D50 mic in and the FR-2LE mic in?

Seeing as you have all 3 of these units, I'd really love your opinion so I'll explain a little more. I was actually thinking of having the FR-2LE as my serious recorder, and a smaller option for when I need to travel lighter, but hopefully also good quality. If you only had your Fostex, and you needed what I do, would you buy the R-09HR, the D50, or a different unit?

I never really have done a side-by-side yet of the Fostex and the D50.  I started out with the R-09, then purchased the D50 for the digi-in bit bucket and decided I wanted to open recording with an all-in-one, so I opted for the Fostex getting it modded by Busman.
When I patch into a board, I like the mobility of the R-09 and D50.  

I like the build quality of the D50.  It's sturdy and has some weight to it.  I like the "dial" gain control, just like the old Sony DAT portables.  The buttons are easy to navigate. I find the R-09 more cumbersome to operate and the R-09 has a build quality something close to Fisher Price.  I will say though that the build on the R-0HR is much improved.  For me when I stealth, size doesn't tend to be an issue. Most venues I attend don't have metal detectors and I can walk into the venue with no pat down. Thus the D50 fits me perfectly.  Obviously though, the smaller the better when you are dealing with tougher venues.  

Digi-in with the D50 is nice.

[su6oxone]

R09HR is quieter than the R09, there are some posts regarding that but i'm too lazy to search for it on my iphone.  

Edit: You could also consider the marantz pmd661 as your all in one device.

[John Willett]

Hi John
Fostex FR-2LE is great yes, but I am thinking of a small very portable setup.
Have you been using your LS-10 with an external pre?

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

Does anyone have the link for the size comparisons of the various recorders? There were a couple posted here on the forum but after searching again I can't find them. Really helps to give a visual image of the 3D volume of these things.

I have handled all three - the Olympus is the smallest, thinnest, slimmest and most easy to handle.
The SOny is the largest and the R-09HR is somewhere in the middle (but these three were my short-list before I bought the LS-10).

I have only used the LS-10 line in connected to a consumer cassette deck as an easy way to copy cassettes to digital before popping them into the computer to make CDs of them.  I had no problem at all with level.

I hope this helps.

[digifish_music]

For those saying the R-09HR , why would you vote for the R-09HR over the PCM-D50?

Smaller size and lower cost, he said he was after a good line-in only recorder. The R09HR is a fantastic line-in recorder. When I use it with a MixPre the results are awesome.

digifish