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Author Topic: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)  (Read 52231 times)

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Offline Organfreak

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #390 on: May 20, 2021, 01:16:11 PM »
I am really glad to see Zoom does something with the remarks adressed by customers/tapers from this site. I did the update, wondering if it is really audible? Playback sound seems slightly smoother, but that may only be present in my ears  :).
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Online voltronic

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #391 on: May 20, 2021, 04:02:23 PM »
I am really glad to see Zoom does something with the remarks adressed by customers/tapers from this site. I did the update, wondering if it is really audible? Playback sound seems slightly smoother, but that may only be present in my ears  :).

The rising low-frequency noise was well below audibility to start with. I suppose if you recorded something in 32-bit float that was extremely quiet and then boosted the levels by 50 dB or so in post you might notice it, but that's an unlikely scenario.

Still, it was a clear problem and I'm glad it could be fixed by adjusting a digital filter, and wasn't some sort of hardware problem.
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Offline voodoostrat

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #392 on: June 10, 2021, 02:18:58 PM »
Question - I bought one last week. I’ve been trying to dial it in for the last few days. This morning I noticed that on track 5 & 6 (set to line) that the knob on #5 was controlling both 5 & 6. I can’t figure how to have adjustments to the separate channels.  I have linked those 2 channels to stereo. I know it’s probably something simple but I can’t figure it out.

Thanks!

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #393 on: June 10, 2021, 06:18:31 PM »
Question - I bought one last week. I’ve been trying to dial it in for the last few days. This morning I noticed that on track 5 & 6 (set to line) that the knob on #5 was controlling both 5 & 6. I can’t figure how to have adjustments to the separate channels.  I have linked those 2 channels to stereo. I know it’s probably something simple but I can’t figure it out.

Thanks!

MENU > INPUT > TRIM LINK

See the manual, pg, 101.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2021, 06:20:28 PM by voltronic »
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Offline dallman

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #394 on: June 10, 2021, 09:52:18 PM »

MENU > INPUT > TRIM LINK

See the manual, pg, 101.

Your answer got me thinking, and I am away from my decks and rusty with my knowledge right now, but if the knobs on the F6 are not gain, but fader, and gain is set automatically, does having those faders not balanced with each other affect the actual recorded tracks? On the one hand no, nor does it matter because you can balance in post, but does it affect the actual recorded gain levels used by the recorder if the faders are not balanced?

I know we tend to still think of those knobs as affecting gain, but that is not the case even if it feels like it does.
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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #395 on: Yesterday at 06:46:51 AM »

MENU > INPUT > TRIM LINK

See the manual, pg, 101.

Your answer got me thinking, and I am away from my decks and rusty with my knowledge right now, but if the knobs on the F6 are not gain, but fader, and gain is set automatically, does having those faders not balanced with each other affect the actual recorded tracks? On the one hand no, nor does it matter because you can balance in post, but does it affect the actual recorded gain levels used by the recorder if the faders are not balanced?

I know we tend to still think of those knobs as affecting gain, but that is not the case even if it feels like it does.

Even though gain may be fixed, recording levels are not. Depending on your recording mode (linear vs. float), those knobs could be adjusting individual channel input trims (post-ADC), the individual ISO track recorded levels sent to the SD card, or acting as faders for the stereo downmix. (I'm differentiating between "recorded levels" and "faders" here, because faders are the last adjustment you make before going out to your main mix.)

Check out the block diagrams in the manual on pp. 193-198. I always use 32-bit float mode, and I have my knobs set to adjust "Rec Level" as described on pg. 194. Keeping them at the default "Reference Level" is useless to me, because I never use the stereo downmix, and this way at least I could adjust ISO track levels if I wanted to. Of course, in 32-bit float mode with the multi-ADC setup this recorder uses, adjusting levels isn't really necessary, but I like to watch the meters dance.  8)

So, what all of that means is that you will absolutely be recording different levels on your individual channels if your individual track knobs are set differently. That would be true no matter what mode the recorder is set up in. This is why I have my input trims all linked in pairs.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #396 on: Yesterday at 09:02:37 AM »
Echoing what voltronic posted above.. You can use the menu to set the channel knobs to perform various functions, and you can adjust recording trim in various ways either with or without using those knobs. 

I use an F8 rather than F6, other than lacking 32bit float recording capability its usage is very similar.  As a practical way of achieving the functionality I desire this is what I do:

Set it up so that while recording the individual channel knobs act as faders controlling the stereo-mix/monitor-output.  I do that simply as a way of disabling the channel knobs from affecting recording trim since the knobs are very susceptible to accidental mis-adjustment.  Instead I adjust recording trim via the menu knob by selecting the channel on the display.  Doing that requires a press of the menu knob to select/deselect each channel or linked group of channels, eliminating the potential for accidental adjustment. 

Upon achieving an appropriate trim balance between the first stereo pair of channels I link their trims (MENU > INPUT > TRIM LINK) so that they can be further adjusted as necessary in unison without changing the balance between them.  I then proceed to do the same for each additional stereo pair. 

At that point I either leave it like that, with the ability to quickly select and adjust any pair and make a trim adjustment separate from the others, or I go (MENU > INPUT > TRIM LINK) and link all of the channels together so that I can adjust them simultaneously with a single knob-turn while retaining relative balance.
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #397 on: Yesterday at 09:50:33 AM »
More detail than you need-
I never use the channel knobs, and would be happiest if they weren't even there.  I do use the recorder for playback, and have it set so that in playback mode those knobs do nothing, adjusting fader level to the mix using the menu knob in the same way as adjusting trim while recording. 

The only significance of the channel knobs for me is their control over the stereo-mix while recording. I don't record the stereo mix, so that is only relevant for me in two ways:
1) if I am patching out to someone while recording.
2) when playing back, the initial stereo-mix fader balance carries over from whatever it was set at while recording.

The second is annoying because those knobs end up being set randomly instead of meaningfully.  If the fader levels were locked as well during recording this would not be an issue.

As it is I'd rather it revert to a flat zero'ed-out fader balance across all channels prior to the initial playback of the recorded fileset, or a specific saved fader position that doesn't change with each recording.  I do like that it automatically saves and recalls fader positions with each subsequent playback however, as that reflects any playback adjustments I make specific to the recording.

musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

Offline dallman

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #398 on: Yesterday at 12:06:29 PM »


Even though gain may be fixed, recording levels are not. Depending on your recording mode (linear vs. float), those knobs could be adjusting individual channel input trims (post-ADC), the individual ISO track recorded levels sent to the SD card, or acting as faders for the stereo downmix. (I'm differentiating between "recorded levels" and "faders" here, because faders are the last adjustment you make before going out to your main mix.)

Check out the block diagrams in the manual on pp. 193-198. I always use 32-bit float mode, and I have my knobs set to adjust "Rec Level" as described on pg. 194. Keeping them at the default "Reference Level" is useless to me, because I never use the stereo downmix, and this way at least I could adjust ISO track levels if I wanted to. Of course, in 32-bit float mode with the multi-ADC setup this recorder uses, adjusting levels isn't really necessary, but I like to watch the meters dance.  8)

So, what all of that means is that you will absolutely be recording different levels on your individual channels if your individual track knobs are set differently. That would be true no matter what mode the recorder is set up in. This is why I have my input trims all linked in pairs.

Great information from both you and Gutbucket. Really good and informative which I was hoping could be supplied. I am in a different city right now than my F6, and cannot recall if I knew that I could make the changes noted above. I did read the manual as I always really enjoy the discoveries that come from reading the manual, but I do not remember and won't know until I return home. I'm really curious to see how my settings are done and if I was unaware, this is even better, but if I just forgot (as happens more and more now that I am about to turn 66), this still is a great refresher. The one benefit to a bad memory is the constant re-discovery of exciting known and forgotten facts. ;D ;D
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Offline Gutbucket

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #399 on: Yesterday at 01:26:08 PM »
Truth!  Thank goodness for the memory recall of friends!
musical volition > vibrations > voltages > numeric values > voltages > vibrations> virtual teleportation time-machine experience
Better recording made easy - >>Improved PAS table<< | Made excellent- >>click here to download the Oddball Microphone Technique illustrated PDF booklet<< (note: This is a 1st draft, now several years old and in need of revision!  Stay tuned)

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Re: Zoom F6 (32-bit float equipped)
« Reply #400 on: Yesterday at 08:25:29 PM »
Truth!  Thank goodness for the memory recall of friends!

+1 to that.

Gut - I know it doesn't have enough channels for your use, but the F6 knobs are quite stiff, and do not move unless you really want them to. I actually never checked to see if the hold function locks them or not. Perhaps Zoom will eventually come out with a revision to the F8 that has knobs with more resistance.
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