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Author Topic: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)  (Read 40584 times)

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Online beatkilla

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #120 on: March 03, 2020, 03:35:55 PM »
For the first year or so that I had the ZS100, I always shot in manual focus mode and would tap the AF icon on the LED screen once I zoomed in to focus the picture.  The problem with this is that during the 2-3 seconds it takes to fully zoom in, as well as for a second or two after you've zoomed in, the picture is out of focus until you can tap the AF icon on the LED screen - but that disappears while the camera is zooming and doesn't reappear until a second or two after you stop zooming in/out.  So a few months ago, I made the switch over to shooting in auto focus mode.  I generally prefer this to manual focus; especially in situations where the musicians are different distances away from my camera (i.e., I am near the front left side of the stage, so the guitarist in front of me is 8 feet away, the lead singer in the middle of the stage is 15 feet away, and the bass player on the other side of the stage is 25 feet away, etc.).  Shooting in manual focus mode in this scenario, I would have to refocus for all three of the musicians (four if you include the drummer).

A big drawback with auto focus mode is that I tend to have trouble staying in focus when there is a lot of dark parts in the picture.  For example, I zoom in on someone playing a black piano and you can only see their head and the rest of the picture is dark.  In this situation, the auto-focus just drifts in and out of focus and really drives me crazy.  Also, when there are a lot of flashing lights or strobe lights - the auto focus has a hard time handling that.

As far as I can tell, you can't change the AF <--> MF setting while shooting on the fly (by pushing the MF button next to the "Menu Set" button).  Of course, stopping the video in the middle of a show to change this setting is not practical.

I have read quite a bit about the AF/AE button on the back of the ZS100, but can't seem to figure out how to lock the focus when shooting in auto focus mode.  If I could lock the focus, I could zoom in on that guy playing the piano and once I got a properly focused picture -- I could lock it in and not have to worry about the camera drifting in and out of focus.  But I just can't figure this out.  Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.



The AF/AE lock button has 4 different possibilities.

Scroll to WRENCH C screen>AF/AE lock (drop down menu)--->AE LOCK(only exposure is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF LOCK(only focus is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF/AE lock(both focus and exposure are locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF-ON(Auto focus starts)


The AF/AE lock button has 4 different possibilities.



Scroll to WRENCH C screen>AF/AE lock (drop down menu)--->AE LOCK(only exposure is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF LOCK(only focus is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF/AE lock(both focus and exposure are locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF-ON(Auto focus starts)

If you choose any of the 3 settings above except AF-ON(Auto focus starts) You get another selection below the AF/AE lock selection.The next selection below that is AF/AE LOCK ON or OFF.

With LOCK OFF you press and hold the AF/AE button on back of camera to use what you have selected as your choice and when you let go it stops using that selection.

So for instance your filming and zoom in to your piano player -->You have selected the settings of AF LOCK(only focus is locked)and also chosen LOCK OFF.Once you had zoomed into piano man you would press and hold the AF/AE button to lock(really this is switching to Manual focus the focus has just stopped where you told it to)

OR with AF/AE LOCK ON/OFF setting set to LOCK ON.

Same scenario you don't need to PRESS and HOLD the back button of camera(AF/AE) You push it once and the focus is held and push it once again to start autofocus working again.

Now if you want to choose AF-ON(auto focus starts)the LOCK ON/OFF is greyed out unfortunately because this would give you Manual and Autofocus whenever you wanted it.
BUT you still can have MANUAL focus AND Auto focus while filming.

Choose AF-ON(autofocus starts)for the AF/AE back button.

Set your camera to Manual focus.

Now while filming in Manual focus you can PRESS and HOLD the AF/AE back button to use Auto focus whenever you want/need it.

Offline guitard

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #121 on: March 06, 2020, 10:18:55 AM »
For the first year or so that I had the ZS100, I always shot in manual focus mode and would tap the AF icon on the LED screen once I zoomed in to focus the picture.  The problem with this is that during the 2-3 seconds it takes to fully zoom in, as well as for a second or two after you've zoomed in, the picture is out of focus until you can tap the AF icon on the LED screen - but that disappears while the camera is zooming and doesn't reappear until a second or two after you stop zooming in/out.  So a few months ago, I made the switch over to shooting in auto focus mode.  I generally prefer this to manual focus; especially in situations where the musicians are different distances away from my camera (i.e., I am near the front left side of the stage, so the guitarist in front of me is 8 feet away, the lead singer in the middle of the stage is 15 feet away, and the bass player on the other side of the stage is 25 feet away, etc.).  Shooting in manual focus mode in this scenario, I would have to refocus for all three of the musicians (four if you include the drummer).

A big drawback with auto focus mode is that I tend to have trouble staying in focus when there is a lot of dark parts in the picture.  For example, I zoom in on someone playing a black piano and you can only see their head and the rest of the picture is dark.  In this situation, the auto-focus just drifts in and out of focus and really drives me crazy.  Also, when there are a lot of flashing lights or strobe lights - the auto focus has a hard time handling that.

As far as I can tell, you can't change the AF <--> MF setting while shooting on the fly (by pushing the MF button next to the "Menu Set" button).  Of course, stopping the video in the middle of a show to change this setting is not practical.

I have read quite a bit about the AF/AE button on the back of the ZS100, but can't seem to figure out how to lock the focus when shooting in auto focus mode.  If I could lock the focus, I could zoom in on that guy playing the piano and once I got a properly focused picture -- I could lock it in and not have to worry about the camera drifting in and out of focus.  But I just can't figure this out.  Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.



The AF/AE lock button has 4 different possibilities.

Scroll to WRENCH C screen>AF/AE lock (drop down menu)--->AE LOCK(only exposure is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF LOCK(only focus is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF/AE lock(both focus and exposure are locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF-ON(Auto focus starts)


The AF/AE lock button has 4 different possibilities.



Scroll to WRENCH C screen>AF/AE lock (drop down menu)--->AE LOCK(only exposure is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF LOCK(only focus is locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF/AE lock(both focus and exposure are locked)
                                                                                          ---> AF-ON(Auto focus starts)

If you choose any of the 3 settings above except AF-ON(Auto focus starts) You get another selection below the AF/AE lock selection.The next selection below that is AF/AE LOCK ON or OFF.

With LOCK OFF you press and hold the AF/AE button on back of camera to use what you have selected as your choice and when you let go it stops using that selection.

So for instance your filming and zoom in to your piano player -->You have selected the settings of AF LOCK(only focus is locked)and also chosen LOCK OFF.Once you had zoomed into piano man you would press and hold the AF/AE button to lock(really this is switching to Manual focus the focus has just stopped where you told it to)

OR with AF/AE LOCK ON/OFF setting set to LOCK ON.

Same scenario you don't need to PRESS and HOLD the back button of camera(AF/AE) You push it once and the focus is held and push it once again to start autofocus working again.

Now if you want to choose AF-ON(auto focus starts)the LOCK ON/OFF is greyed out unfortunately because this would give you Manual and Autofocus whenever you wanted it.

Thanks for doing all of that research.

It seems like the best option for me, based on how I film and the problem I am trying to overcome, is to go with AF/AE LOCK --> AF LOCK, and AF/AE Lock Hold --> OFF.  And it does work -- I zoom in and press the AF/AE LOCK button and it locks in the focus.  The problem is that when I release the button and move to a different focal point, it takes several seconds before it will start auto focusing again.  So basically, this fixes one problem -- but creates another problem. 

I have come to the conclusion that their isn't a perfect solution to the fairly unique problems that come up when filming concerts with a small camera like this.  You just have to work with the limitations that come with each of the two basic options (auto focus or manual focus) and try to overcome them as best you can.

BUT you still can have MANUAL focus AND Auto focus while filming.

Choose AF-ON(autofocus starts)for the AF/AE back button.

Set your camera to Manual focus.

Now while filming in Manual focus you can PRESS and HOLD the AF/AE back button to use Auto focus whenever you want/need it.

A better option IMO is to use the "AF" button on the LED screen (see picture below) when shooting in manual focus mode.  It only requires a light touch with the right thumb, so there is pretty much no chance you'll have any camera shake or unwanted movement.

BUT ... as I said earlier ... there isn't a perfect solution.  About half the time I tap that AF button, the focus goes into a "hunting" mode for a few seconds -- so the camera goes from only being slightly out of focus, to completely out of focus for a few seconds, and then back into perfect focus.  It's really annoying.



I think for the time being, I am just going to stick with auto focus for most shows.  At shows when I am filming from somewhat of a distance from out in front of the stage and all of the performers are relatively equidistant from the camera, I will choose manual focus.
Mics: CA-11 (omnis and cards), AT853 cards, DPA 4060 omnis (Schoeps MK41s on order!)
Pre-amps: CA-UGLY II & CA-9100
Decks: Edirol R-07 & Edirol R-09HR

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #122 on: March 09, 2020, 01:58:45 PM »
My most recent effort:
Set 1: https://youtu.be/n0W76gmzfO0
Set 2: https://youtu.be/FH4epL05h9I

I used a 30k kb/s bitrate render and it looks much better. I found how to sync audio by waveform in Davinci, so it took about five minutes to make the second video after processing the audio. Great free program.
Mics: nbobs/480+ck61/62/63; C568EB; MKE2
Recorders: MP6; A10

Offline guitard

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #123 on: March 13, 2020, 10:29:53 AM »
I used a 30k kb/s bitrate render and it looks much better.

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, you can use a program like XMedia Recode to synch audio (remux) and produce a lossless 4K video file that is exactly the same as the raw video you started with (except it now includes the alternate audio).  Unless there is a compelling reason to re-encode the video (for example, if you have to correct the color), I don't think you can beat the quality of the ZS100's original 4K video.

https://www.xmedia-recode.de/en/download.php

Here are my instructions on how to use XMedia Recode to produce a lossless 4K video.  Note:  you have to synch the audio in another program prior to muxing it in XMedia Recode.  I do that in Vegas Video; but that can be done in pretty much any video/audio editing program.

1.  Click the Open File icon at the top of the GUI page and select the video and audio files you want to mux.

2.  Format tab (this tab is selected by default when you open the program) - choose your desired format.  I usually choose mkv as it allows 24 bit audio.  And in "Output Stream Type" choose "Video and Audio" (default).

3.  Video tab - choose your video file from the two files in the queue above (by clicking on it) and for "mode" choose "copy" (will be "convert" by default - which you don't want).

4.  Audio tab - the audio in the video file you just chose will automatically be parsed into the output box.  For "mode" choose "copy."  Click the "import" button and choose the audio you want to mux with the video.  Right click the audio that shows in the output box (the audio in the video file) and choose to delete it.  In the source box, click the audio you want to mux with the video and then click on the arrow button between the source and output boxes to move it over to the output side.

5.  At the bottom of the GUI, click the "output" link and then click "Save to folder" to choose the destination for the new file.

6.  Click on the "add to queue" button (blue plus sign) at the top of the page.  Double check to make sure the video and audio in the "Output" box that pops up shows that they are both listed as "copy."

7.  Click encode button at the top of the page to get the muxing started.

*A five minute 4K video will usually take around two minutes to mux.
Mics: CA-11 (omnis and cards), AT853 cards, DPA 4060 omnis (Schoeps MK41s on order!)
Pre-amps: CA-UGLY II & CA-9100
Decks: Edirol R-07 & Edirol R-09HR

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline DavidPuddy

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #124 on: March 15, 2020, 01:16:48 AM »
I used a 30k kb/s bitrate render and it looks much better.

As I mentioned earlier in this thread, you can use a program like XMedia Recode to synch audio (remux) and produce a lossless 4K video file that is exactly the same as the raw video you started with (except it now includes the alternate audio).  Unless there is a compelling reason to re-encode the video (for example, if you have to correct the color), I don't think you can beat the quality of the ZS100's original 4K video.

https://www.xmedia-recode.de/en/download.php

Here are my instructions on how to use XMedia Recode to produce a lossless 4K video.  Note:  you have to synch the audio in another program prior to muxing it in XMedia Recode.  I do that in Vegas Video; but that can be done in pretty much any video/audio editing program.

1.  Click the Open File icon at the top of the GUI page and select the video and audio files you want to mux.

2.  Format tab (this tab is selected by default when you open the program) - choose your desired format.  I usually choose mkv as it allows 24 bit audio.  And in "Output Stream Type" choose "Video and Audio" (default).

3.  Video tab - choose your video file from the two files in the queue above (by clicking on it) and for "mode" choose "copy" (will be "convert" by default - which you don't want).

4.  Audio tab - the audio in the video file you just chose will automatically be parsed into the output box.  For "mode" choose "copy."  Click the "import" button and choose the audio you want to mux with the video.  Right click the audio that shows in the output box (the audio in the video file) and choose to delete it.  In the source box, click the audio you want to mux with the video and then click on the arrow button between the source and output boxes to move it over to the output side.

5.  At the bottom of the GUI, click the "output" link and then click "Save to folder" to choose the destination for the new file.

6.  Click on the "add to queue" button (blue plus sign) at the top of the page.  Double check to make sure the video and audio in the "Output" box that pops up shows that they are both listed as "copy."

7.  Click encode button at the top of the page to get the muxing started.

*A five minute 4K video will usually take around two minutes to mux.

Thanks for the suggestion. It doesn't look like this program works for mac though. Is there a quality issue with the way I did the last videos or is it more of a time saver to do it the way you are suggesting?
Mics: nbobs/480+ck61/62/63; C568EB; MKE2
Recorders: MP6; A10

Offline guitard

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #125 on: March 15, 2020, 10:10:58 AM »
Is there a quality issue with the way I did the last videos or is it more of a time saver to do it the way you are suggesting?

The bottom line is that re-encoding will never improve the quality of the video; it will only degrade it.  So if you can preserve the raw video, it's best to do so.

Your videos look fine on Youtube, but that's not really a fair test (especially since Youtube also re-encodes the video).  To me, the true test is watching the video on a big screen tv.  I take the mkv file I make with XMedia Recode that contains the original video muxed with 24 bit audio and watch those on a 65" tv. 

Regarding saving time -- in my experience with my PC-based video work station, encoding video does take a lot more time than muxing with XMedia Recode.
Mics: CA-11 (omnis and cards), AT853 cards, DPA 4060 omnis (Schoeps MK41s on order!)
Pre-amps: CA-UGLY II & CA-9100
Decks: Edirol R-07 & Edirol R-09HR

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

Offline jerryfreak

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #126 on: April 11, 2020, 10:41:52 AM »
re: ZS100

how durable are these

i see used ones for $200ish

is that a risk vs a new one with warranty for $350-$400?
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #127 on: April 11, 2020, 02:09:25 PM »
re: ZS100

how durable are these

i see used ones for $200ish

is that a risk vs a new one with warranty for $350-$400?

They are still kind of new (came out in 2016) and since they are digital, you don't really have much in the way of moving parts to worry about.  So it's hard to say how durable they are.

I've got two of them -- one that I bought new, and a second that I bought used (although it looked new when I got it).

It's one of the few (only?) point-and-shoot cameras that records unlimited 4K video (after hacking it).  That in and of itself, puts this camera in a rather unique category.  And if you use all the information that has collectively been gathered here in this thread, you can really shoot some nice video with this cam.
Mics: CA-11 (omnis and cards), AT853 cards, DPA 4060 omnis (Schoeps MK41s on order!)
Pre-amps: CA-UGLY II & CA-9100
Decks: Edirol R-07 & Edirol R-09HR

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #128 on: April 12, 2020, 08:01:57 AM »
just asking as i see a hanful of 'for parts not working' on ebay which generally points to a non-serviceable design with a finite life

for consumer electronics i try to buy new with my CC that doubles the warranty

it seems that 399 with a bundle of accessories is the new normal price so i can hope to find something on sale for 350ish at some point and pull the trigger
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #129 on: April 12, 2020, 10:08:54 AM »
just asking as i see a handful of 'for parts not working' on ebay which generally points to a non-serviceable design with a finite life

it seems that 399 with a bundle of accessories is the new normal price so i can hope to find something on sale for 350ish at some point and pull the trigger

I just checked and out of several dozen for sale, only two were "for parts/as is."  From my anecdotal experience of shooting around 100 full concerts, I have concluded that this camera is solid as a rock.

$399 has been the going price for quite some time.  I doubt it will go down anytime soon because it's been out of production for four years and the ZS200 has been out for a few years, and if Panasonic follows its pattern, a ZS300 will likely be coming on the market soon.  So there simply aren't that many new ones left in the inventory.
Mics: CA-11 (omnis and cards), AT853 cards, DPA 4060 omnis (Schoeps MK41s on order!)
Pre-amps: CA-UGLY II & CA-9100
Decks: Edirol R-07 & Edirol R-09HR

Video: Sony FDR AX100 (4K), Pany ZS100 (4K) & Sony DSC HX50V (HD)
Photo: Canon EOS 60D

A/V software: Sony Vegas Pro 13.0 (build 453) 64 bit / DVD Architect Pro 6.0 (build 237)

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #130 on: April 12, 2020, 10:43:06 AM »
thanks! useful info
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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #131 on: April 12, 2020, 01:45:26 PM »
It's solid as far as point and shoots are concerned.

Most likely those being sold as Parts/Not working have been dropped.

I bought one off ebay and it was immaculate....even had all that grip tape on it exactly like Guitards has .

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #132 on: April 19, 2020, 04:38:53 PM »
FYI...you can pick up a GH4 body for $350-4  I own six with a Sony A7 and and Canon XF105.  Don't waste your money on P&S.  MANUAL ALL THE TIME.  JMO

just asking as i see a hanful of 'for parts not working' on ebay which generally points to a non-serviceable design with a finite life

for consumer electronics i try to buy new with my CC that doubles the warranty

it seems that 399 with a bundle of accessories is the new normal price so i can hope to find something on sale for 350ish at some point and pull the trigger

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #133 on: April 19, 2020, 04:53:41 PM »
P&S can be way easier to get into a show that has metal/bag search...
ain't no party like a katydid party
jumpin' and a hoppin' and singin' them songs!

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Re: Panasonic Lumix DC-ZS200 (edit: mostly about ZS100 though)
« Reply #134 on: April 19, 2020, 05:25:45 PM »
P&S can be way easier to get into a show that has metal/bag search...

this

i already have a DSLR. not looking for that, ans many (most?) venues specifically prohibit "professional" cameras, and detachablre lens is usually the ba for 'professional'
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